There’s a bunch of ways, none of them easy, because WHY WOULD ACTIBLIZION WANT YOU TO KNOW THAT?
Here’s a page with a script that checks:
~http://red-rose.com/forum-trust-level/
And yet the Fans say that Luke Skywalker would never draw his Lightsaber on Kylo Ren in the first place…
Seems George’s idea of how Luke would act is not the same as how Fans assumed he’d act.
Alright, Ive been baited.
Dude, we’re talking about the guy who kept trying to save his father, DARTH VADER, an embodiment of evil, while the old bald guy was in full Sith mode. AND WAS SUCCESSFUL.
Fast forward to that horrible movie. ‘Awww naww, I’m feeling like my nephew is having some bad thoughts/might get possessed. Better draw my saber and take a whack just in case!’
How can you NOT see that as a major character break? The assumption of how a character, who has been written for two whole decades (!) would act is entirely within the realm of plausability and shouldn’t just be dismissed out of hand.
A lot happened between those two times. There’s a major difference between someone who’s still an idealistic farm boy at heart, and someone who’s doing badly at coming to grips with the fact that he truly sucks as a teacher and Jedi Master.
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Because people and characters can change over time, and it’s not like this was a thing that happened a week after Return of the Jedi.
To make a comparison, if my knowledge of Jaina ended with Warcraft 3, and then I learned about her “Once Horde, always Horde” mentality 5.1 and 5.2, I’d probably also be shouting about it being a major character break, but that’s because I lack the context of Theramore.
Just the same way, my knowledge of the EU is vague enough that I don’t know what may or may not have affected Luke in the decades between Return of the Jedi and The Force Awakens.
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There are such things as defining character traits which, to no surprise, define a character. Batman doesn’t shoot firearms. Spiderman doesn’t strangle people to death with webbing. Hannibal Lecter is a really smart guy. Mr. Bean is bumbling.
And Luke Skywalker is defined by his hope and his perseverance. It’s not like he redeemed some nobody dark jedi here. Again, it was Darth. Vader. The entire galaxy was against even the thought that the guy had a shred of decency left in him. But not Luke!
That kind of belief doesn’t vanish, that’s a core tenet. That’s bad writing to do a 180 like that.
He got that thought after what went down with Kylo, so is a non-factor in why he decided to go saber happy on an unarmed boy in his tent.
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A pity Rian payed too much attention to George Lucas rather than ignore him then…
That thread was so fun to ponder over! I tried to get as many people as I could, and spent a lot of time in post histories formulating the best classifications for everyone. Of course, I reaaaaally stretched the limits of “alignments”, but it’s very challenging to boil everyone down to a couple of words!
Love you too, Dawny~
You are still nice! Salt is a must in many dishes, and venom makes antivenom. The flow of your passion may have taken a different course, but it’s still passion! And that’s the quality I admire most in people : )
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I would’ve said the exact same thing about Jaina a long time ago, but then things happened that changed how she saw things.
I’m not saying it’s the only way things could’ve possibly turned out, or even the best way (because let’s face it, literally no choice in the movie was the best way of doing things), but I’m able to believe that over the course of decades, a person’s outlook can change, and that’s without the possibility of the Dark Side screwing with him. I think the biggest thing is that he caught himself and realized what he was doing was wrong.
On an unrelated note, at least Solo was a blast. I’d happily watch that a dozen times than watch The Last Jedi again.
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I’m of the opinion that people give George Lucas waayy too much credit for Star Wars. See: prequels (entirely his own thing) vs. OT (collabs). Best things about Star Wars came from people other than Lucas.
Listen, there are people out there that take works of fiction perhaps more seriously than they should. They are called fans (root word being fanatic), and I am one of them. A whole lot of people don’t take this seriously and I think they’re right to, but I take Star Wars fandom seriously.
My first clear memory, as a sentient human being, was of watching Empire.
TFA kicked me in the gut, TLJ kneed me in the jaw while I was doubled over. Call me crazy or foolish or whatever, but the sequels broke any kind of hope I had for Star Wars in Disney hands. It really did. Not solely because they were awful, but because I could see the tracks where they are taking this story and the death of better possibilities lost.
I wish I had the eloquence to properly explain myself.
I know exactly how you feel. One of my first memories is going to see A New Hope (it didn’t even have that title yet. It was added later.) at a drive-in movie theater in 1977. I’ve loved Star Wars ever since.
I’m one of those people who actually didn’t hate the prequels. I liked them to a certain degree. Was some of it not that great? Well, yeah. The romance stuff was bad and Jar Jar should have been toned down. Overall, they were not terrible to me.
The new sequels though? Oh boy. They are bad, like really bad. TFA I might have been able to stomach if we hadn’t gotten the horror that was TLJ.
At least Rogue One and Solo were good, imo.
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I remember early on hearing about him going to Disney and making the suggestion that Rey and Finn should’ve been closer to Episode 1 Anakin age.
Thank god that didn’t happen, at least.
Also he’s the sole reason Darth Revan isn’t currently canon and that makes me mad.
Trust me when I say I understand where you’re coming from. I wouldn’t bother posting here if I didn’t care about lore far more than I should and BFA has produced similar feelings you’re describing.
I love Star Wars to death, too, but I’ll be the first to admit I was never super attached to Luke as a character, which may be why i’m willing to for the most part accept his portrayal in The Last Jedi. Han was always my favorite character and I can imagine if Solo had portrayed him as a radically different person doing things I could never see him doing, I might have the same reaction. I’m honestly very glad that wasn’t the case.
I honestly liked The Force Awakens personally, but The Last Jedi fell flat on it’s face. Repeatedly.
And I definitely get this too. I can’t count how many times I’ve said this to myself while trying to desperately form the arguments in my head into proper English.
I’ll gladly admit the two KOTOR games were the best pieces of Star Wars outside of the OT. I got the same reaction to the Revan reveal that I got to Empire’s father reveal. Blew me away, and I think that’s saying something for the game’s writing team. I’m a much bigger fan of Kreia, though.
The glimmer of hope I had for TLJ when its trailers hit was that OldLuke was going towards a Kreia route. I understood that the Disney team wanted to take the Light/Dark side in another direction and thought to myself, what could be more perfect than Kreia?
I thought it would be a fantastic story if OldLuke came to the conclusion that the old ways of the Jedi had failed his father and needed to be fixed. ‘It’s time for the Jedi to end.’, oh yeah…I agreed! It made sense with his character to mildly follow the Kreia route in my opinion because Luke understood the value of knowing both sides of the Force (but unlike her committing to Lightside), that one of the major failings of previous Jedi masters was suppression.
Kreia is my favorite character, in my opinion extremely well thought out and portrayed with great nuance. Before there was ‘There must always be a Lich King’ there was “But there must always be a Darth Traya, one that holds the knowledge of betrayal. Who has been betrayed in their heart, and will betray in turn.” An antagonist that wanted to kill the Force itself? Novel concept!
What I got was basically Luke saying screw it and going pole vaulting on some tiny island.
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I mean, yeah, no, you’re right. That would’ve been much cooler.
And now understand that we’ll never get that or anything like that. Not without it feeling hollow, nor without it feeling like a concession. We got what we got and if you don’t like it you’re toxic. You aren’t allowed to complain about it on a supposed forum dedicated to SW discussion without harassment. If you don’t like the sequels you are the problem.
It’s decades of fandom love wrenched out of your hands and beaten and rolled into a spear by people who will move on to the next fad. Something of you that you fostered, wielded into a weapon to hurt you with.
Melodramatic to the extreme, yeah, but I can’t help it. I feel like an idiot exposing myself like this, but I appreciate you and others for the chance to vent. I’ll zip it.
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Girliness Upgrades(https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/GirlinessUpgrade) seem heavily maligned for changing the character too drastically… I personally would like the character to remain as Tomboyish or Feminine as she started out as.
Drastic changes in fiction in regards to character personality(even within the work they themselves debut in as in the case of Kylo Ren, Obito/Tobi and Zant) are maligned for a reason yet writers and artists can’t seem to get the hint at all!
The writers and artists seem to think that the audiences complaints of everything being the same means that the characters’ personalities and design should change drastically when in fact it’s the plot that the audiences want changed.
The Fans also don’t want characters copying their predecessors either.
I’ve lost my character’s lovely covered face. What a shame.
Now it’s a lovely W badge, for “winner”!
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Yes! Join me, Irenaus! Join the ranks of the Faceless!
Huh. I thought mine stood for “Wario”.
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Don’t worry about it. It’s important to vent sometimes and I’m sorry if you’ve been harassed in Star Wars discussions for not liking them. If I came off that way it wasn’t intended and I apologize.
I mean you’re not wrong. I"m still upset about Jaina even if I’ve accepted it.
Are you saying Wario isn’t a winner?
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