Zul was just messanger here. Not the mastermind of all the agression. That is the whole point why Vol’Jin in 4.2 was sure it was Rastakhan’s initiative.
Zul on each front sent a different general, ever since this meeting nobody saw Zul again until BfA, so how come anyone could conclude it was he who was behind all of it - and even Alliance, who unlike Vol’Jin wasn’t on meeting with Zandalari.
Even if they didn’t think he was behind the whole thing, his encounter with Vol’jin showed that he had an important role.
As for the Alliance knowing about it, the Darkspear actually visited Stormwind after Vol’jin’s meeting.
It’s just showing that Vol’Jin needed mercenaries for his own biddind wether they were from Horde or Alliance.
Because obviously devs couldn’t cut a content for one faction in game.
Vol’Jin didn’t even personally appear in Stormwind to talk with Alliance he sent Bwemba who herself gave a vague information.
There is reference to a Darkspear Emissary traveling all through Stranglethorn to Alliance camps telling them about the Zandalari threat:
In the end, it is revealed that this person was Vol’jin all along:
You asked the wrong question. They were totally justified in chasing them down because they set fire to the city and caused a lot of destruction during their escape. The question you should have asked was why did they lock them up in the first place? I am assuming it was because it made for a compelling introduction between the Horde and the Z-trolls. After all their king wasn’t really in favor of reaching out to them, so saving his daugther from the “evil” Alliance helped change his mind and opened the doors for the Horde.
So what was your view on the horde attacking Anduin on his way to the Exodar at the start of MoP?
The horde and alliance were at war. And Anduin was the heir to stormwind.
Likewise, the alliance and Zandalari were at war since Cata. Talanji was the heir to the Zandalari. She also had Zul, who was the one overseeing the Zandalari’s expansionism during Cata and MoP.
The time Vol’jin turned on his troll bruddas… Never forget.
Identical. But exception was that narrative was highlighting it as well.
Ok but that doesn’t change the fact that she was on diplomatic mission and was seeking aid. Alliance has noauthority to tell who can make alliances and who cannot.
And for over a dozen of posts above I was arguing that they had no intel about it.
I liked Vol’Jin a lot, but indeed this particular instance made him insufferable.
Humans ventured to troll territory.
If human outpost is surrounded by troll ruins it then it’s not “those nasty trolls preparing a trap for them” it means that it was humans who were pressing into someone else teritory and retallation was about due. So what was he smoking to say that trolls are in the wrong for striking down invadors.
Narrative back then was absolutely disgusting.
Still didn’t answer my question. What makes the anduin situation okay but the Talanji one different?
Heir to a hostile nation is on a mission to work with another hostile nation…
Better let that go through because a troll poster on the forums might get triggered…
So I see you continued to ignore all the evidence to suggest they did know. From Vol’jin telling alliance bases about the Zandalari and the Gurubashi working together to take over stranglethorn vale. You got alliance forces fighting against the Zandalari (and mogu) on the isle of thunder.
But please, continue to ignore actual evidence.
I never said it was identical? I said that both cirumstances are wrong.
Zandalari were hostile to Horde as well and there was a truce between Horde and Alliance too.
Really people, we already collaborated with Hostile forces, all what was needed was even a single character that is up for collaboration.
The nightborne as a whole were hostile too, we went to help them anyway because one withered was nice to us.
We collborated with Klaxxi despite them being openly Hostile and additionally ended hostile afterwards.
Alliance who fully embraces Dark Irons who for years since vanilla were hostile and even caused a civil war among dwarf clans and the head of their faction kidnapped the prince of Stormwind which almost escalated to additional bloodshed.
And purple blood elves who were hostile to Alliance for longer than Zandalari were and additionally turned out to be ticking bombs with their strange powers but they said they’re good now (which is laughable).
So in this case acting like that toward Zandalari is hypocritical at best, it’s even additionally pretentious that Alliance feels like telling outsiders who can they can team up and who can’t, while they themselves don’t show any restrain when it comes to judgment on factions they decided to collaborate with. That is the definition of World Police.
And I would understand if Talanji was with all her navy ready to conquest but she was on a single vessel on a diplomatic mission. If their previous hostility is a permanent death mark then Alliance needs to kick some of their members too.
That evidence wasn’t about Zul though, it was about overall Zandalari agression.
It didn’t really highlight anything. It wasn’t me ignoring anything it’s just it wasn’t anything there showing that Zul was responsible for all of that. It’s more like people were ignoring my points because it didn’t fit their narrative. So are you implying Vol’jin was amnesiac in the very same patch, because in front of Zul’Aman he said it was Rastakhan who rallied the forces.
And Stranglethorn IS a Gurubashi territory. It’s like saying that We should aid the orcs in Elwynn Forest because Humans wants to take it over. Do you realize how it sounds? That trolls can’t even fight for their own territory.
For quite a long while we had a discussion on how Rexxar was ridiculous for claiming that this land is Horde now and “ancestral” apparently. But when trolls are trying to push people out from their own homeland they’re still in the wrong.
But there was no Zul on Isle of Thunder. I was never arguing that Alliance didn’t know about Zandalari aggression, I was arguing that Alliance wasn’t aware that Zul was the mastermind.
How is that hard to understand?
Didn’t Zul on behalf of the Zandalari declare war on non troll races? Remember Rise of the Zandalari patch back in Cata? This led to MoP with Zandalari raising Lei Shen and making their presence around the world viewed as enemies of non troll kind. Making any travel by Zandalari near Alliance waters enemy combatants at their borders.
The Alliance also had spies that reported that Princess Talanji wanted to meet with the Horde for a potential Alliance thus making them true enemies to the Alliance, this potential meeting with Princess Talanji and Prophet Zul the same leader responsible for the rise of the Gurubashi and Amani back in the day. The same TROLL responsible for raising Lei Shen and leading the navy against the Alliance.
So logically the Alliance would want to capture her and the prophet because they wanted to prevent an alliance with the Horde. They also knew that at thee time the Zandalari had one of the biggest navies on the planet. Any joining of forces of Zandalari and Horde would be disastrous to the Alliance navy.
The entire plot with Talanji and the Zandalari left me shaking my head. The Alliance capture and imprison a soverign Queen because she might be working with the Horde? Then they give chase, entering Zandalari territorial waters. Following that, they stage an invasion as the Zandalari are fending off an insurrection. The Zandalari had not committed themselves to the Horde, although the Horde were there to help them. So the Alliance do the reasonable thing and destroy the Zandalari navy while it was in port and posing no risk to them, and instead of stopping there (which would have ended the Zandalari threat to the Alliance) they continue to ransack the city in their raid on Dazor’Alar and end up killing the sovereign king in his home. And everything i’ve seen from playing BFA is that Talanji never really gets back at them for that.
I can think of one instance, 80 years ago, when a rather isolationist nation was in talks with an alliance of nations losing a war. And that nation just so happened to have their navy sunk in port in a preemptive strike. Led to years of bloody war. I was never satisfied that the Zandalari never got closure for the Alliance’s actions. Outside of anything the Horde did in BFA, the Zandalari weren’t yet part of, but I hope it gets addressed somehow. Zandalar can rebuild their navy and armed forces and take to the seas.
Did you forget the Rise of the Zandalari patch back in Cata? Zul met with the representatives of the troll tribes and asked them to join his new troll empire. They proceeded to attack Horde and Alliance territories and to muster their forces on a planetary scale. This ended horribly for pretty much the Amani and Gurubashi as we killed their leadership and broke their ranks.
Later in MoP the Zul led Troll forces representing the Zandalari Empire resurrected Lei Shen. They then coordinated with Mogu forces and conquered the north coast of Pandaria eventually being repelled and Lei Shen defeated. Zul was with Princess Talanji and they were going towards Horde territory to discuss the possibilty of Horde-Zandalari alliance.
That’s when the Alliance intersected their ship and brought them to Stormwind for interrogation and imprisonment. They knew that leaving these two trolls out on their own would mean that their maybe a possibility of the Gurubashi to Stormwind’s southern borders may once again seek aggression against the human forces. Remember to the humans, the troll expansionist rhetoric is seen as threatening to their territories. Zul is above all the biggest propagandist of this agenda. They cant chance it considering the recent history in Stranglethorn and Pandaria.
They were willing allies to both the Horde and Alliance in vanilla wow and Wrath (remember they aided both factions to fight against the Gurubashi and Hakkar, and the observers who aided the elimination of the corrupt Drakkari).
When they became villains was under Zul during the rousing of the tribes in Cataclysm and later Isle of Thunder events during Mists.
That Rastakhan kept Zul in the royal court after both of these weird departures from vanilla Zandalari is extremely curious.
And I do believe the OP was talking about why Talanji and Zul were in the prison to begin with, not why the Alliance chased them after their jailbreak and subsequence damage to Stormwind.
That’s cool and all, but then they decided to rouse the Tribes and try to take over the world under a New Troll Order.
Also cool, but Zul is the Zandalari prophet and both the Horde and Alliance would thus be under the impression that it’s the Zandalari are effectively declaring war.
He also shows extreme confidence in Zul while you quest in Zandalar, almost beaming in pride of his prophet when he talks about “why he keeps his prophet in his court”, or something along those lines. And on top of that, Zul shows he has his own independence when he says to tell Rastakhan that he’ll return to him “in his own time”.
Two warring/hostile factions were attempting to meet, thus The Alliance captured the envoy. I feel like people are trying to make this way more complicated than iit is.
The OP is asking and you’re answering the wrong question.
The actual one is… Who gets to tell the Alliance OR the Horde as to what’s okay behavior? There is no international court, no greater power on Azeroth that either or both have to answer to.
Alliance did it, therefore troll bad and deserved it.
Horde did it? Horde bad and deserves punishment, including Horde Players.
Pretty much the narrative at this point. Get used to it.
Think something people forget is Zul was the Zandalari who was behind all the aggression against both factions.
So The Alliance had very good reasons to capture the guy, why was Talanji with him? Where did The Alliance even capture Zul? How did Sylvanas even know?
None of these questions have answers because BFA is a terrible story that requires you not to think about its plot to make sense.