I wasn’t speaking to kit similarity but to specifically mobility and balancing. BM is a good example of infinite ranged mobility being hard to balance. You either keep that mobility and get damaged nerfed into the ground like BM did or you get mobility nerfed and retain damage.
This is also why DH and monks are so hard to balance, they swing between complete joke or absolute gods.
If I had the reigns mm would be a completely different spec based around new abilities. (Being a marksman) doesn’t necessarily mean a sniper. It means you’re a great shot.
Bursting shot? Should be a massive shot gun blast to the face. Increase damage 400% and have it knock people back like thunderstorm for shamans.
Concussive shot ? Bye bye. Steady shot now applies your slow. Figure out how many seconds. By the time you waste global on concussive you’re dead. Make steady slow negligible (40%) or something small.
Tune aim shot damage. Make like LB for shamans. Procs constantly from hunters mark. (made baseline and changed to interact with aim shot)
Delete lone wolf. Make it so mm has no pet ever. Straight up damage increase baked into class. Give new complete options for tier 1.
Disengage now has 2 charges. (zero reason not too)
Aspect of the turtle now gives you a 50% speed boost. (lolz activates immunity and people just /dance waiting for you to come out of it to immediately kill you. (add talent to interact with turtle shell healing you over time.
New talent (ping enemy player for incoming bomb transport) explosives drop from the sky dealing massive aoe damage.
Some ideas. But I guarantee you guys would love this iteration of mm.
All of these are great ideas.
Thank you. I Mained mm all of Lich. Actually helped friends in arena by 2v1ing most times. It was a carry class. To be reckoned with. Mobile. Traps worked. Damage was there. I miss it.
I hopped on my fiance’s hunter the other day and just immediately logged out. Asked her how she even managed to level and continue to do bgs with that class.
I know it’s comfortability. And after a couple hours I’d be back to my own mm self. But I was struggling helping her with a quest !!! Not PvP or a dungeon. A quest!!!
Tar trap is trash. Concussive is trash. Everything about it is just FRUSTRATING to use lol.
I mained a MM as well until cata. Its never been the same since. Switched to BM after that. I still enjoy MM but in most cases its become an inferior spec. Always feels like its missing something.
Comes out of stealth:
Aimed Shot > Chimaera Shot > Kill Shot
= Dead
I missed those days. Gimmicky but fun af
Silencing shot wouldn’t help much as a MM fix, also keep in mind that MMs issue atm is reliable damage. Not the damage ceiling, not the burst ceiling, it’s consistent damage under pressure.
Since this is an issue it will just end up being used on the healer to try and muscle kills, which once again starts down the MoP road of toxic CC of everything on the healer. Change like that isn’t as much helping MM, but more so just making the enemy healer want to quit life.
The issue right now like I said was Scatter DR and Precise shots. You have 2 focus dumps as MM right now, Aimed and Arcane. However unlike the Cata/MoP/WoD predecessor Arcane does almost half damage until you Aimed Shot, gating any meaningful damage behind a 2.2-2.3 second cast based on gear.
If you’d like to test what I mean, find a friend who is a demo lock. Duel him and tell him to go AFK. Then sit there and fight his Felguard using only Arcane Shot as a dump. Depending on your gear, you can literally lose to the felguard if you don’t pop defensives. Then realize, outside of Rapid fire, that is what you’re relying on while a War/DH, WW/DK, War/DK, DH/DK is eating your face doing 10k dps each.
The best band-aid you can do right now would be the following.
-Scatter to a different or self DR
-Aimed to base 2 sec cast
-Precise shots changed from 75% damage buff to arcane shot, to 100% crit chance on next 1-2 arcane shots.
-Arcane Shot base damage buffed by 60% damage.
-Conc shot now overwrites Snare Suppressants to 50% to make it worth the CD (Ghost wolf, Deaths Advance, Rog sprint talent) like Cata conc glyph making us THE ranged slow kiters.
-Steady Shot now instant cast so that you can actually take advantage of Conc increase. Most people don’t even know steady/conc increase even exists because we can never get it off reliably.
-Disengage has 2 charges. Survival can disengage and Harpoon, why shouldn’t MM have 2 options as well.
KEEP US SQUISHY. Just buff our damage on the move, while leaving turret damage roughly the same but the ideal scenario, and giving us tools to sway the game.
Even with these changes WW/DH will still have 100% uptime, Warriors will have reasonable uptime, DKs still have 70% chains and will be able connect when needed. However with the mobility and mobile damage changes tunneling us start to finish will punish bad players who don’t swap off when we get away.
don’t you know? blizz thinks buffing mm aimed shot by 200% or giving double aimed shot will fix all its problems.
You have some solid ideas in here like double disengage as a way to get more mobility instead of using roots like we had with entrapment/imp wc. I think allowing us to have both double disengage and posthaste would be pretty over the top if they didn’t up the CD of disengage to 25-30. But would be a good talent option.
The precise shot change you make might sound good for pvp but doesn’t work for pve given crit has two different values. Most hunters have 15-20% crit so that means this change in PvE adds 80-85% more damage to arcane shot on average. That means hunters will be even more reliant on precise shots in PvE than before. I like arcane shot being too strong base, it just means that it’s hard to punish the hunters damage. He can just spam one ability and still do good damage.
If blizzard is going to do any changes to this game, they need to increase player decisions and complexity, not reduce it. Things like demon armor are a good example of this, giving passive mitigation instead of active.
You got to try double mms in 3s. They can insta kill any healer except the broken immunity healer hpally.
Another idea would be to make aim shot do a certain amount of damage while standing still. But still castable while moving. If you have to move while casting. The damage is decreased.
Glad other people have the 2 disengage idea. Don’t think cooldown should be increased though. Considering all other classes mobility.
This would fix the problem, youd 1 shot anyone from stealth and not have to worry about the rest lol.
This was WoD hunter mastery, it was super clunky design and overall was hated by pvpers. Anyone who took pvp seriously ended up playing survival during WoD because of MM mobility issues.
If it was a talent like fire mage flamecannon then I could see that as being a choice option, but as a core design of the class it just didn’t work well in the past.
We need spell to spell interaction that reduces the cast time of aimed shot or makes it instant that is not rng proc LnL. We have tons of dead talents that can be replaced to facilitate this (steady focus, volley, explosive shot, barrage, lethal shots).
My other gripe is that we never use steady shot because RF with focus fire trait is almost all the focus we need.
Yes steadyshot extending the duration of Conc is useless, because steadyshot is a 1.5 sec baseline cast and does pitaful damage that casting it is pretty pathetic lol. id rather use the global on conq shot.
You wouldn’t. Even with 2 disengages now, DHs will only have to come off you when they’re punished and that’s not because they can’t connect, its to go defensive. WW as well. If you try to balance us around this, you screw over rets/enhance etc so a fine line, but not unreasonable.
Warrior matchups will change as they’ll have to stop riding you 24/7 and start actually thinking about “swaps” when they can double up on charge + leap, or force them to have to stormbolt your disengage thus removing training and rewarding good timing. This is a good change.
Against SV same thing. They’ll HAVE to perfectly time goes to harpoon + disengage at you and mirror your movement and come off you if they do it poorly, vs just harpoon trapping your healer then disengaging your disengage doubling your mobility.
You’ll stop being a train target completely for rets/enhance but still killable, also encouraging them to swap out talents against us, but historically we’ve been good at kiting these specs.
A misleading quote, as reliance isn’t really an issue in PvE atm. In most fights you pretty much can turret to your hearts content. You’re still held back by 2 charges of aimed limiting how many forced crit Arcanes you can get behind a roughly 10 second window. Pretty wide window to ensure you hit each one. In PvE this will only be a moderate dps increase. AFAIK we’re not topping charts and this change would probably put us at upper middle pack to possibly pretty strong but not top dps which is a pretty good place to be IMO.
That’s literally the point. Keep in mind this change puts the average Arcane shot at about 10-12k damage depending on gear, which is pretty much what everyone is spamming nowadays on 200-230k health pools. Assuming your target has 0 self sustainability, it will take you almost 30+ seconds to kill someone spamming your secondary focus dump. This change is to allow you to still maintain a respectable but non-lethal DPS while on the move vs right now where you can literally be ignored by most classes unless you’re aimed shotting.
The point is to up reliable damage while still maintaining that turreting Aimed Shots is still the ideal way to deal damage. Slightly lowering Aimed Shot cast time so that after spell pushback, aimed shotting a melee on your face isn’t a scenario where you’re casting 1 long cast vs the melees 2 GCDs resulting in falling very far behind very quick.
Unless we get chimera shot back (ideal), buffing aimed raw isn’t an option because that will screw over clothies, and open up more problems. Arcane shot buffs is literally the only way to fix the MM damage issue without making the spec ridiculous, and currently Precise Shots damage stack is what’s preventing that.
Why just MM? I mean at high ratings MM is better then BM by a whooping .4% placing them at a representation of 1% at 2.2k+. BM is at a sweet .6%. Survival the wanna be rogues are doing OK. Hunters as a whole represent 4.4% of the 2nd highest 120 population at 1800+. Good times for the hunter community.
mm won’t ever be viable again, neither will bm
hunter is a melee class now put up with it or quit, “we prefer if you didn’t play ranged hunter anymore” -ion hazzitatas
Rawrzy for MM president.
I started at release when all three specs were range, sad face.
If any of ya’ll were just watching the tournament, as I just mentioned with my proposed changes. After Trueshot Jellybeans couldn’t get anything done and was just walked down with extremely high uptime.
More kiting mobility and more damage outside of Trueshot through Arcane Shot is 100% the bandaid we need this expansion until a rework can be done.