So Gnomes messed up… Druids could help them build a sustainable approach to their engineering mindset.
It isn’t that hard to grasp. You guys are saying “NO CHANGES TO THE LORE”, then saying “well… I guess SOME changes are ok… but NOT THIS ONE”.
I really don’t even want to play as one myself. I don’t think I will ever main away from NE druid. I’m just pointing out your outdated logic isn’t holding up anymore with how much Lore changes have already happened and are going to happen moving forward.
You mean like the destruction of the planet at the hands of Deathwing? Malfurion saw how powerful Deathwing had become and saw that he could use the Highborne to his advantage. He allowed them back into society on the condition that they don’t abuse the Arcane power.
Because Night Elf Mages has always existed… From day 1, Blizzards lore has stated that Night Elves have been able to use Arcane Magic… This isn’t something that was made up 30 years later…
Because it’s NEVER once been established. It’s never once come up at all in any form. Malfurion, Cenarius, Ysera, Elune… None of them work this way. They are the pinnacle of Nature Magic in the Warcraft universe, and it’s never once come up that this is how it works.
Saying it does would retcon the entire system. It would literally re-write the entire magic system that they have in place.
They’re not a race that destroys the planet for one…
Second, they could very easily be a descendant from a Wild God, or an Ancient, kind of like how the Centaur, and Quillbore are… There was an unnamed fox Ancient during the War of the Ancients… They could very easily be a distant descendant of him/her.
Ok let me ask you this, how do you think a nelf druid looks upon a literal abomination from maldraxxus? He would look at horror because they were once living beings. Well the same thought concept applies to trees and such. Druid commune with nature, that means animals, bugs, and even trees. So seeing machines is like seeing the living beings being perverted into a abomination. As for gnomes giving up their machines, that (lore wise) is nearly impossible, considering they want too see how everything ticks, how it works and how it could be created into something else. That is their nature
Edit* had to fix the damn autocorrect
And the Wild Gods could see that there is a way to prevent Gnomes from continuing to tear down nature and agree to help gnomes build a sustainable approach. This makes sense, and the only argument against it is “well it wasn’t that way in the past so it can’t be that way in the future” - which you just destroyed that argument yourself. It would actually be in druids best interest to try and recruit gnomes to find an alternative method to inventing new things without destroying nature. So I don’t really get what your platform is here.
How? The emerald dream basically knows no bounds. How do you possibly know that there is no possible way the emerald dream could power a gnome contraption??? Do you realize how ridiculous you sound?
Do you realize gnomes aren’t solely intent on destroying the planet? They want to invent things. There is nothing anywhere saying they only want to tear the world down. I have every reason to believe gnomes would love a sustainable way to power their inventions. Who wouldn’t? They are smart creatures. And Druids are smart too. We are not the type to be lazy and just let gnomes idle by and continue to destroy the world.
The more this goes on, gnomes actually have more of a case for why they should be druids. It would benefit both gnomes and druids… And no one here can possibly say the emerald dream in incapable of powering a gnome device. Sure, maybe it’s more of an arcane thing… But the arcane school has no stake in whether gnomes continue to tear down nature. Druids actually do… hence, Gnomes and mechagnomes alike could be fit into lore just fine.
There wasn’t any changes to the lore though… Night Elf Mages isn’t a change to the lore… It IS the lore. It’s established lore from day 1…
Malfurion letting them into the Night Elf society isn’t a change to the lore. It’s an expansion to the current story of Night Elf Mages… It’s just them being welcomed back into their home after thousands of years of learning their lesson. Nothing has changed here other than a dude got to go home…
Would you invite an Isis terrorist into your home?
Honest question. If he said “I’m not a bad guy, I swear”. Would you let him in to have dinner with you and your family? Would you introduce him; as an Isis terrorist; to your extremely conservative military friends?
No?
Then why would a Druid do this with a Gnome? It’s essentially the same thing here.
There’s expanding on a story, and then there’s perverting it with bad writing.
Letting Night Elf Mages go home after thousands of years of exile because they could use their help in the fight against Deathwing, isn’t a far stretch.
Allowing a Gnome; who’s nature is to tear down nature and replace it with technology; to be a druid, is.
Because Ysera, who’s charge by the titans is to protect the Dream; Elune, who watches over it, Malfurion who lives there, and Eonar who created it, have never once mentioned that this is a function of the Dream.
The people that know it the best, and the people that have created it, have never once given any indication of how this works.
Resorting to insults now? How petty.
Mecha-Gnomes literally replace natural body parts with machines… They literally destroy the natural order to create machines… That’s the whole point…
Exactly… Finally we see eye to eye… Druids are not going to allow Gnomes to destroy the world. It’s literally what they fight against. So saying "Sure come into our homes with your gas powered electricity and smog and pollution, isn’t something that a Druid is going to be ok with.
I mean… Vegetable oil is a thing… Sure… I guess…
But Arcane magic is the one that animates machines… Not Nature magic. We’ve been over this.
Also, Eonar can say that the Emerald Dream can’t power a Gnomish device. And after all this time, Neither Eonar, Elune, or Ysera have given any indication that this is a thing it can do.
lol. You don’t even listen.
There’s literally no point in arguing with you if you’re going to be like this.
You just have to look at real word events with the Natives destroying gas pipe lines to see exactly why a technology loving race wouldn’t fit into a nature loving class.
How would Moonglade benefit from a fume spewing gas engine? It wouldn’t. So it would…
You couldn’t be more wrong. Druids fight alongside gnomes all the time. Your analogy should actually be something like “would the leader of one country invite the leader of another country to talk about how both countries may benefit one another” - and the answer probably is yes - that happens all the time. Your analogy is not a good one and not accurate.
Exactly. We do not yet know its’ limits. How do we even know the people who know it best know the Emerald Dream’s limits? How many times in WoW has someone created something that turned out to be more powerful than intended?? See every single xpac ever.
Except you’re forgetting that the playable ones are escaping the island because of this very thing… Seems like something a druid-like soul would do. Escaping mechanization is moving toward the druid mission.
Like I said: In the scenario where mechagnomes or gnomes become druids, there is no reason to say they would continue spewing gas and oil everywhere. Moonglade could benefit by working with gnomes instead of against them.
You simply cannot compare real life to WoW lore. That’s just insane. But if you really need to… Native Americans and European descendants could both benefit by working together. I don’t really understand why you’re bringing up the pipeline. Gnomes aren’t intentionally destroying nature for money or greed. The pipeline absolutely has no place running through native land just to save some pocket change. I don’t think you can say Gnomes are doing the equivalent. Further, there is nothing that says pollution is even bad on Azeroth, nor that Azeroth even has an atmosphere that is capable of being broken down by Gnome byproducts.
The pipeline story in real life is tragic - but it doesn’t really work as a point against why gnomes can’t be druids. Can’t compare that very real event to a video game back story.
We are about at the time where you need to start explaining why Druids can even pick up Mining and Engineering as professions. A druid could potentially have a personal interest in killing animals for hides, removing precious metals and ores from the earth for the same missions gnomes have. Why is that ok for a druid to do, but we can’t accept gnomes into the order?
The lore buffs coming out the wood works. I wish I could just put it to a vote.
Would it be cool if the alliance and the horde both had small race options for druids?
I get why people are so concerned about the lore but if the trolls who love gold can be druids a Vulpera can too I’d imagine. They have at least some interactions with the Loa, they live next to 2 area’s that are basically overflowing with natural magic phenomenon. It’s not THAT much of a stretch.
The lore aside Vulpera, Goblin, Dwarf, Gnome and mecha-gnome could all have some really cool forms and just in general just make people happy to play smaller races for people like me who strongly dislike large races. <---- This is more my original point.
Goblin druid, here it comes… =D
Who cares? It would be fun to play as transformer Druid.
… but… but… my precious 17 year old living storybook that actively changes all the time isn’t supposed to change in this way!!! How DARE anyone threaten it!
In case it’s not obvious, I actually support adding playable Druid races. I can see how a ton of people would have fun with the mechagnome Druid idea, despite not wanting to play one myself. Would be cool to see it happen.
I’m all about circle of life. I just want circle of life on a smaller frame.
I have long despised gnomes and tech in WoW. I write it off as magic based, to make myself feel better. But it’s a real pity that small race = technology for Alliance and WoW in general.
Like it has been explained about 5 times now, changing and growing lore is great because it adds more story, however changing the lore that doesn’t make sense, isn’t the story growing its spitting on whatever they are ret-conning. For example, if they came out with a couple of undead characters that had sex and created another undead baby, that wouldn’t make sense due to forsaken cannot give birth or get pregnant in the first place due too…you guessed it, they are dead. What you are complaining about is “well they could become druids if they don’t destory the natural surrounding area”, guess what the vast majority of gnomes love taking stuff apart and creating it into another thing. That is their literal thought process, while druids are all about taking what is already there and using it to their advantage.
Don’t get me wrong, i want a small race as well. Would love to be something other than a giant. Especially when it comes to healing in pvp. But it has to make sense, wildhammer dwarf druid possible, vulpera possible, creatures that litterly destroy their surrounding area, not possible. That goes for gnomes and goblins
And what I’m telling you is our designers modify the “footholds” in the lore, virtually all the time. They could suddenly flip and say one special undead suddenly does give birth. Then what? Will you suddenly lash out because they once said it was not possible? Who cares?
It’s literally no different from the entire premise of any religion. Science says there should have been no way the Virgin Mary gave birth to Jesus Christ in the Bible, yet there are many, many valid beliefs that simply ignore the science. And that is totally fine. Who am I to say there wasn’t some magical essence that made that one case possible for her? (Just going to say I do not want to debate religion, but it is a hand-in-hand analogy to your point. All real world religious beliefs are valid)
And while I actually agree that it doesn’t make sense for mechagnome druids to be in game with the current lore, I am just pointing out that saying “it doesn’t fit the lore” is a completely bogus argument for why they couldn’t fit in the lore at some point in the future. You are missing the whole point. If it brings players in, I don’t see the issue with changing the lore. Let people have fun…
If they were change the lore that badly, then i would un-sub. Maybe I’m bias, but i came from emerald dream, where the lore mattered and the rp that sprung from it was amazing. If they were to literally make a mistake like retconning lore that big, then i would be done and move on. I came to this game because my old dnd buddies moved away and this was a way to keep the friendship strong, they have since left the game but i still play for the lore and the story that came from it. But if they were to allow mecha-gnomes, goblins or even regular gnomes be druids, i would unsub in a heart beat and never look back.
While this Druid I am on was not originally made on Emerald Dream, I also have spent a lot of time with Lore-heavy groups. That’s why I’m pushing, because, while I follow the lore as well, some lore buffs are invalidating anyone else simply because they don’t follow the lore. I do, and these people are offering perfectly good suggestions to bringing in new players. OP is Basically doing design work for the company, honestly. But this living story book is too precious to you to allow a younger population to explore newfound appeal in an otherwise stagnating game.
I’m sorry you feel that way, but you must understand that there are many younger players who would see a pseudo-transformer being advertised in trailers and think “wow, I want to play THAT game!”
Your stance is just slightly selfish (edging on entitlement), albeit only marginally justified for the bigger picture. Imagine a world in which you quit, but another person subs for the very reason you quit. Say, Transformers happen, 1k graybeards quit the game, 3k sub to play a transformer and 1.5k stick around for a few years of gameplay. Still think your stance is where you want to stay? Your loss, honestly.
Anyway… Look where the role-playing playerbase has gone… they play classic or null their sub. You no longer see anyone in the Gold shire inn, for better or worse…
Entitlement? What the hell have you been drinking, I’m not demanding that guns and futuristic technology to be banned from the game or saying that its stupid. Gnomes and goblins want mech suits, fine build a class around it. But leave the lore behind druids alone, they don’t deal with technology. And this is more about the gnomes mentality, they were designed to be incredibly smart and to be able to fix things. They were made to be able to take the surrounding area and morph it into something that will fix the current issue. Before the curse of flesh that is. After the curse of flesh they still had that same thought process of tearing things apart and seeing how they tick. That is the polar opposite of druids, which once again uses the natural environment without tearing it asunder
Some of the worst people in the world have changes of heart… there are virtually endless counters for any reason you think up to keep players from having a new twist on fun. Leave the lore (or lack thereof, if it is to be) to the devs and let people post all their fun and whacky ideas here.
You just sound like the grinch who wants to steal a metaphorical Christmas.
“Worst people”. Gnomes are not evil or even have evil intentions. (Unless their a warlock). I never said they were horrible people, I’m just saying it’s not in their nature (pun intended) to not give a damn about the environment. We see this in the gnomergan explosion that caused the place to be evacuated. We see them as investigators of the unknown, regardless of what is the unknown. Whether its fel magic as seen in Trial of the Crusader, Necromancer’s as in Pit of Saron, or Mages as in Dalaran. They care more about the unknown and how it ticks, rather than what happens in the process of gaining that knowledge.
And I’m saying if the worst people have changes of hearts, why can’t gnomes have a change of heart toward the essence of how they approach their invention design, that is more centered on how they can benefit the world and not just their curiosity? Nothing. There is nothing from saying that isn’t plausible.
If you have a gripe, just say you don’t support it and move on. Don’t sit here and threaten to leave the game simply because you don’t personally like the idea. It’s awful for anyone who just wants to share a new thought they have.
I did not threaten, i simply said that it would be lore breaking and if they are at that point in the game, then its not the game for me.
As for changing their hearts on nature, they were not created that way. They were created to research the problem, find the solution, and then fix the problem.
I’m not saying that it’s possible for a single gnome to think that way, but once again that is a single gnome compared to the entire race of gnomes. Not enough of a reason (lore wise) for blizzard to make that possible.
As for letting it go and just giving my statement, i did that. After I posted my last one, i had no intention of reposting, until you were mocking people who loved the story and cherished the lore of the game. " … but… but… my precious 17 year old living storybook that actively changes all the time isn’t supposed to change in this way!!! How DARE anyone threaten it!" Seriously mocking? What are you ten? Grow up and realized that not everyone thinks like you, in fact if you look at most of my replies on this post, most of them have several people Liking them as in agreeing with my statement, when you only have a lonely 1 like. I’m done and this is my last post on the subject, but don’t be acting like a tool when someone disagrees with you.
I won’t take either side here but just point out that some of the retcons they have done already have been waaaaaaay more lore breaking than gnome druids I hate to break it to you. So you either have a very unhealthy relationship with druids or your not really going anywhere.
Either way if you take off you can send your stuff my way.