I dont see a realistic scenario where both pvp’ers and pve’ers are simultaneously content with their gear progressions in the game’s current state
in any scenario where both types are equally accessible and powerful, both sides will feel forced to do each other’s content (because time gating of gear), a fight which pvp always loses resulting in either worse gear (bfa pve trinkets) or worse effort/reward ratio (m+ vs random drops)
pvp stat fixes all those problems
i dont have to explain this to you guys, but its sad that apparently this concept has to be explained to the devs in charge
idc what Ion’s reasons are, its painfully obvious he’s misguided and should get over his pride and listen to people at the heel of his boot
yeah i agree. i am on the verge of quitting if we dont get a pvp stat. i WILL NOT be forced to endure pve content which i have 0 interest doing and have 0 fun doing just to be able to pvp. not again. coming back to 8.3 because of quarantine has shown me just why i stopped playing in the first place. the utter lack of care for pvp from the wow team has been so apparent for several expansions now
we complained about holinka, but in hind sight he was a blessing compared to the uncaring and blatantly disregarding-of-feeback devs in charge of pvp now. pvp in this game used to be so fun. never thought they would destroy it like this
I mean, I guess? It’s just there’s other games out there. I made this character during the rhona and I wanted to be invested in it and everything I hear about SL just makes me want to play something else. This is coming from someone who preordered thinking that it would be an A-team product, like Legion and MoP and WotLK. I thought A-team wouldn’t make the same mistakes B-team made in BFA.
We complained about Ghostcrawler too. Then we got Holinka, and then we got WoD, and everybody was crying for Ghostcrawler.
That being said, Ion seems to have no interest in PvP, a-la Jay Wilson’s “Shut up PvP guy!”
I just really, really don’t understand why WoW can’t separate PvE and PvP better (ie. via gearing rather than just abilities).
Please, for the love of god, if there’s one thing that we need back it’s this. EVERY SINGLE EXPANSION, save for Legion (and maybe TBC, can’t remember much more than “stormherald go brrrrrtttstun”), has had PvP seasons where the meta was shaped around PvE trinkets.
I think we need to start a formal Template Coalition here on the Arena forums. “Give us Templates, or Give Us WoD gearing! Either way, it’s better than the current garbage we have to deal with.”
I complained about Holinka though. It wasn’t about class design though. It was about the ridiculous forced participation in things like Ashran. I still think that was a terrible idea given the inability to balance it. I think history if proving us right by the way. The only way to win in Ashran was to cheese it or get incredibly lucky - especially as an Alliance player.
I didn’t realize how bad it could get until we got Ion. He essentially deleted my character (RSV Hunter). I just can’t picture the logic that says that is okay. I like his raid content, world design, world quest systems, and general PVE stuff, but he is inept when it comes to systems, class design and PVP systems.
I keep thinking about that scene in Breaking Bad where Marie doesn’t want to tell her shrink what’s bothering her (Walter being a drug kingpin and murderer), so her shrink suggests she talk about the thing that was bothering her the week before, “Parking at work.”
My complaints about the other game designers feel minuscule compared to my complaints about Ion.
Feel like they’ve done a good job on listening to feedback so far. Don’t get why this is being ignored. Their fix for PvE trinkets was to make Adapt, Relent, and Medallion trinket slots? I get Medallion, other two should just be pruned.
Separate yes, templates hard no from me. I actually enjoy picking my stats and not being at blizzards mercy of what my stats should be in their eyes. They clearly make horrible decisions in PvP based on the last 2 expansions. I just want the scaling system back from WoD. That system was perfectly fine. Good example of dont fix what isn’t broken.
Please no templates. I and many others couldnt stand them. I’d rather pick and choose my own stats any day of the week and at least have the ability to tinker with things. WoD gearing system ftw! Bring that back and the issue is solved no doubt!
Yes, I like this I think WoD style gear scaling is the answer, not a PvP stat.
They don’t even need to do this if they really don’t want to. They just need to give us the 2-set trinket damage reduction back where if we have 2 PvP trinkets on we take a certain % less damage from players.
And by that, you mean “pick one of three options on off-set pieces, where only two of them have optimal stats and the others only have one good stat so it’s kind of a moot point because they’re outshined by PvE items unless we get a PvP stat?” I, personally, always remember being bummed out that I couldn’t stack my ideal off-stats on every off-set piece.
Ion has already given his reasons as to why he doesn’t want WoD style gearing, a la “we want gear to be gear.” As much as I’d like WoD style gearing back, I highly doubt that we’ll get it back because it’s something the devs have specifically said they don’t want. They don’t like PvP stats, and they don’t like PvP gear scaling. Beyond that, PvP gearing in the past has only ever given players the illusion of choice. I know a LOT of people cling to that illusion as if it’s offering them real choices beyond “pick these ones because they’re straight up better, also if you pick the wrong off-set piece people won’t play with you because you’re obviously an idiot who doesn’t know what’s optimal so you obviously play like trash.” As funny as it sounds to hear Ion talk about people picking the wrong piece, it’s not as if he’s 100% wrong. I remember many people, myself included, calling other people idiots for having bought the wrong off-set pieces.
Templates offer, at the very least, a strictly level playing field for all players of any given class. You might argue that the templates could be tuned poorly for any given class, but the same could be true for gearing via PvP. Tuning PvP templates is also easier than tuning gear/class stat weights because those things actually have an impact on PvE as well (which, if “shut up PvP guy” Jay Wilson was right, the devs refuse to allow PvP to impact PvE).
To give us an ideal situation, we’d be hard to please… But to make things better than they are currently, the devs could make even the most minor positive change and we’d be over the moon. But historically, they don’t even bother, unfortunately.
