Retail has multiple levels of difficulty, so when people say this they mean the LFR people who cant clear content, and don’t actually want a challenge. Anyone from Retai who is a Mythic raider isn’t having problems with TBCC raids…
Its not even a matter of it being difficult, even pre-nerf this wasn’t some Souls experience, it had challenge, but it wasn’t unforgiving.
This ^.
I’d put Vashj as a middle boss of the heroic version of a current retail raid in terms of difficulty.
As for the OP… It’s the old adage: If I beat you… it’s because you suck… If you beat me… it’s because you’re cheating or a nolifer…
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My take is let the casuals experience all the various content playing the class/specs & such that they enjoy, without having to “spreadsheet” every detail of the game & then stack the deck with cheesy meta’s. The hardcore can 15-20 man the now-easier 25 man content if they really want more challenge (& reduce the pool of people competing for gear in the raid). Hell, give a few special rewards to those who can 15 or 20 man it (like a special mount or gear token that can only drop off a 15 man or 20 man play through of the 25 man raid), so that they can continue to tout their superiority in-game & on the forums. Win-win for everyone.
I’m probably in the minority.
My guild was 8/10 but I did not want the nerfs.
We literally 1 shot Vashj tonight first attempt.
The comments of “Well then you should have tried harder”, or “if you wanted to kill it by now you would have” are annoying and I could do without, as they completely miss the point.
Ok, so you just want braindead content you can cruise through without any difficulty and collect loot. Why not just add the PTR vendors that give you free loot? No, seriously. Wouldn’t you be happier with that?
Naxx at 60 isn’t even harder than the current raid tier lmao. Vanilla is a joke
Say you have never mythic raided without saying you mythic raided.
Mythic is hard. LFR also exists, and buffs you for failing until you succeed.
Tell me you never did naxx without telling me you’ve never done naxx
To this day I see naxx gdkps fail every week. They go 4 hours and they fail. Can’t kill the bosses even with plenty of people.
People who were 8/10 for 3 months are 1 shotting t5 in it’s nerf staged.
You know nothing Kanako
Naxx was hard and is still hard. It took many months to down KT and efficiently clear it. There is little room for error in there. It is as bad as the T5 raids. You guys seem to forget that by Naxx time, guilds were dying left and right.
There was like no successful PUG Naxx run for a long time.
Easy raid is better for the game health. Hard raid is creating tension and stress within raids.
Lol wut.
T5 In prenerf was hardly a “hard raid”
Progging for a week or two is kinda laughable.
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Absolutely nothing in these classic realms is hard until cataclysm. Why do you people try to act superior?
Because people are jealous and have low self esteem, so they insult people in more successful guilds to make themselves feel better.
You got it. People can feel how they feel but I don’t know why people need to disrespect others when they do it. It’s sad.
If you feel the 25 man raids are too easy now with 25 people, just build your guild raid groups around 15-20 people instead to increase the difficulty, with the added perk of being able to gear up with less loot competition.
well why nerf then ?
Finally a question worth asking??! 
I’m willing to bet hardmode Ulduar and Heroic ICC will give people a run for their money. Also, do you really think they’re gunna do Classic Cata? I sorta think… they should stop at Wrath tbh…
That’s a nice thought in theory, but in practice… that’s just not feasible. It’s just not how people or communities function.
Forcing the players to utilizer player made solutions to emulate difficulty isn’t going to work. Sure you’ll get the odd-ball who decides to do something different, but they’re the outlier, not the norm.
That being said… I do wonder if having difficulty was the right move for these classic realms. I personally love it, but everyone? I think most wanted to relive some glory days and enjoy re-killing the bosses and building their characters. Not re-live actual progression.
I know that Blizzard is low-energy these days in terms of ideas & development, but they could easily incentivize smaller raid/group size challenges by perhaps having special mounts, gear tokens, etc. that would only drop in 15 or 20 person versions of the 25 person raids. Same with heroics completed with 3-4 people instead of 5. Lots of way to creatively recycle & incentivize the same basic content for different caliber/types of players.
Yea, because Retail doesn’t have multiple levels of difficulty, including the braindead LFR and the less braindead, but still braindead Normal. Why do people think “go to retail” when talking to people who want EASY raids are referring to Mythic? Who said anything about Mythic?
Seriously though everyone, people are buggin. Listen, if you want braindead LFR content, go to retail. They have LFR specifically built for this purpose. If you want super try hard content, go to retail, they have Mythic built specifically for this purpose. If you want Classic TBC content, well, your SOL because the LFR nerds want LFR in TBC and can’t understand why most players want nerfs held off until the next phase is released. Guess we can all just go F ourselves, right?
Fact is, they shouldn’t have nerfed the only currently available content without first having new content ready to be released. It’s like clearing a dungeon now. No one speed runs dungeons in this old content. We need some kind of unforgiveness in the raid. 10 second KT add kills? sigh. No Vashj MCs to possibly 1 shot someone? sigh Imagine using 1 arcane explosion to kill Moro’s murloc adds. Yikes. This stuff wasn’t super hard to begin with, but there was at least some sense of “yea we could still easily wipe if people don’t pay attention.” Now 8/10s wiping for months are 1 shotting 10/10 lol. That makes total sense. Had to make sure they got their participation loot, I guess. Season of equality. You get a blue ribbon (8/10), and you get a blue ribbon (9/10), and you get a blue ribbon (7/10), F you I don’t like you (10/10 since week one), and you get a blue ribbon (3/10), yayyyy try out our ptr that doesn’t work!
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