This was originally suspose to be MS buying AB deal and with rumors of Sony buying Take Two, but since i’ve mentioned steam here (a throwaway point mind you), they decided to go with that and WAY off topic instead of discussing this. So i’ve decided to rebrand this topic to “Should WoW go to steam?” here, and separate what the orgrinal topic away from this topic.
Ya’ll talk about steam? Let’s talk about steam here.
My short answer is: Steam is a popular digital download distribution app that nearly every PC gamer uses, and nearly every dev, small and large, uses to sell their games on. Despite it’s 30% cut. It is the dev’s choice for what they want, but from a perspective of a gamer, yes i would love that.
My shortest answer: Yes.
Let me know your thoughts and opinions, why or why not, etc etc, and have a great day.
the only comment I recall MS making is “We intend to make Activision Blizzard’s much-loved library of games – including Overwatch, Diablo and Call of Duty – available in Game Pass and to grow those gaming communities.” no mention of WoW…Blizzard’s largest game so you may want to hold off on your wow subscription savings until the purchase goes through and they make a comment about it.
and pay Valve a 30% cut of all games sold? Why? The WoW community is fully mature, they obviously can’t grow the game by leaps and bounds like they did 15 years ago. Also STEAM makes you use their wallet for buying subs to “free to play MMOs” like LOTRO to become a VIP, it’s fine for the consumer but for Blizzard why would you let Valve handle that instead of you?
Still, i think it would be cool to pay for WoW and 400+ other games.
Okay, i hate to sound like a businessman but, more places you can put it in, equals more exposure, and more exposure, equals more profits. And Steam is the biggest digital distribution platform for video games, because it’s mainstream in the PC gaming.
I’m not saying, only Steam. It can be on Epic, Discord, etc in addition to steam.
If it works for other MMO’s, why not WoW? I mean heck, some of Activision-Blizzard’s games are already on steam, even the newer ones like CoD and Crash 4.
Plus, it’s a lot more cheaper then designing a game specifically for a console. Especially since the code for PC and net aren’t exactly ideal or where it should be tbh, and using that for a base on locked hardware with limited control schemes, isn’t a good idea.
Okay?
And you can buy Steam games with your credit card.
I don’t see that happening with WoW honestly. At least, not without solid evidence that Blizzard is ever going to do that. I don’t think Steam itself does that.
But why should any consumer care about what the business wants? If anything, this is more of a win for both parties in the business involved here, and it’s a win for consumers too: More games on a platform they like, more exposure to the game, more money for the devs/publishers here.
I mean, have the games like FF14, ESO, GW2, SWTOR and so on, gotten worse with steam releases? Because they seem to be doing just fine. Heck, Everquest is on there even.
I think the only problem i can see with Steam is the massive undertaking of making accounts be on steam as well, by trying to link them and etc. GW2 doesn’t even have something like that. So that’s one problem i can think for both parties involved.
cool for you sure, don’t think investors would be saying cool when the looked at the P & L statement in that case.
don’t worry you don’t sound like a business man. No business with full penetration in the market place is going to suddenly give up profit and drive traffic away from their launcher just so a few more people can be happy. WoW is a fully mature game, meaning everyone who plays MMO’s knows about it. The game is on its 19th year. Their business model has been to maintain the current player base and bring back past players. There is no new MMORPG base for them. They would need a totally new game for that.
those MMO’s have tiny audiences and are desperate for any cash income
mature like in an old person is mature in age, not necessarily acting mature or having a mature audience.
you can not use your credit card to make LOTRO purchases through STEAM. You use your CC to buy points in your steam wallet and then use your wallet to make LOTRO purchases. This may have changed recently but I doubt it from the complaints I see on the LOTRO forum about this confusion. I prefer to give my money directly to the developer so I use their client.
I know they do, I see the complaints.
Consumers don’t call the shots. You can beg WoW to be free and toss hissy fits about why they won’t cheapen the price for you (because that is really what your post is about) but that doesn’t mean they will or care to. ESO, GW2, SWTOR all have tiny audiences compared to WoW. Square Enix doesn’t have the launcher Blizzard does.
Only FFXIV is doing “just fine”. SWTOR went free play not because they wanted to but because they had to to stay alive and yes that game definitely suffered.
You seem to fail to realize the size and scope of both WoW and Blizzard and common sense towards their business practice. You are not the customer, you are the product. Their customer is the stock owner to which they have a fiduciary responsibility to protect their interests.
…This is why i don’t try to talk like a businessman, because honestly speaking, where did you get the idea that they will be few for WoW?
I mean, what do you want as a consumer/gamer? Don’t worry about what they want, what do you want as a consumer/gamer? Because speaking myself personally, i put that ahead of what the business wants. I’m not hired to do what’s best for the business, i’m looking for something to entertain me at a good cost.
I’m not going out and saying “Oh my god, those guys who worked hard on their game is losing 30% to Valve!”, no i’m going “Which game is going to give me the most amount of enjoyment for a good long time and at what price?”.
Okay. So is Everquest, and that didn’t stop it from going to Steam. And that’s an older MMO.
If you’re looking at the steam charts, that’s not an accurate summary of the audiences. Espeically since some of the MMO’s are cross platforms, not just storefronts, but gaming platforms as well, such as consoles and even mobile phones.
Either way, it still warrants my eyebrow raise, and it just sounds like “Oh we don’t need more because… everybody knows this game…”?
I said Steam games. Not LOTRO. I wasn’t talking about LOTRO.
Mind linking to some proving that it does other then the complaints?.. Like the patch notes that occurred on the same day as the steam release, saying “Now we have VIP to celebrate this steam release” or something?..
That doesn’t answer my question on why i should care about what a business wants. I could honestly care less what the likes of EA, Activision-Blizzard, Arena.Net, Squenix, and Amazon thinks or wants. It’s literally not my business.
…I’m sorry, but… did you miss out the whole year that FF14 was actually sold out during shadowlands?.. What?..
That had nothing to do with it being released to steam though. It being F2P happened back in 2012. The Steam release was on 2020. 8 Years after.
I honestly do not care.
I’m a consumer. What part of that you don’t get that it’s literally none of my business and it shouldn’t?..
Why were talking about this even?..
Can we just get back to the orgrinal topic? That being the whole “I don’t think companies should buy other studios, because it might not be at the best interest of the gamers/consumers to have things be locked or exclusive behind one thing?”…
from their business model for the past decade, it speaks for itself
tiny game audience, if and when WoW drops to that level I’m sure they will look at other avenues as well
I’m looking at the MMO player charts of their daily players, not STEAM charts
no you failed to understand it, it means “everyone knows this game so it’s difficult to get more and better off to retain and bring back former players”
WoW is a subscription based game similar to LOTRO, it’s not a one time purchase. Are you new here? STEAM controls the sub through their STEAM wallet. Why would you ever give them a cut?
What, I’m talking about wallet issues what are you talking about?
You don’t need to but you are obviously paying for their product.
If it’s none of your business that why are you crying about it? Why bring up the STEAM avenue, it was a weird path.
Absolutely because this is jumping all over the place. The companies buying other companies (in any industry) is awful for the consumer. The reason they do it is because their customer, the stock holder, demands increased revenue (which increases stock price) quarter after quarter and year after year. The executives compensation is literally tied to the stock price for most these large companies. The two easiest ways to increase profits are 1) cut cost (with labor being the highest cost) and 2) create new revue streams which means buying up other companies and of course cutting their labor so you can do both 1&2. In no way shape or form is this in the best interest of consumers and yes you will get screwed by it. The real winner is Activision CEO Bobby Kotick who is looking at a $375 million payday for the sale according to Bloomberg.
This entire steam point was, as a mere suggestion, just thrown at the end for if they can’t do the gamepass thing without buyout, so i’m just going to treat this as much relevancy to the topic it deserves now and just respond to this.
Because it’s a popular download distribution website for …video games.
And World of Warcraft, happened to be a … video game.
It’s really, really, really not hard to put the two together here for both business/gamer perspective.
Yes, i do agree, it will potentially lead to worse quality down the road. Me personally, it would also lock things away until you get the correct gamebox, or sub or etc. Kind of like how Disney buying Fox and Star Wars means you have to have Disney plus in order to watch the newest stuff. Or wait until it comes out on Dvd/blu ray or other services even.
yes it is when it’s a complete money loss for them, all WoW players have the blizzard launcher, both current and future (aka past subscribers). Why would blizzard ever give anyone a cut of that? They clearly can’t bring in any brand new players, they haven’t even tried in a decade. STEAM makes no sense…at all. It’s the equivalent of you standing in front of a city McD’s saying hey I’ll help bring in new people that have never heard of McDonalds but for each customer I bring in I want 30% of what they spend. People know McDonalds, they are either walking there for lunch or they are walking past it and don’t want it. At best you can only bring in people who have previously tried it and like it so why would McD’s even think about giving you a cut. You wouldn’t bring in anyone new, you would just help bring in people already headed while taking a huge cut. Same with STEAM.
It’s
an
awful
plan
very similar to probably what MS wants to do but more in line with Disney becoming the majority owner of Hulu through the Fox acquisition. They now bundle Hulu with Disney Plus and/or ESPN plus in several packages. I could definitely see MS (assuming they acquire Activision) doing a gamepass WoW sub bundle but I don’t think the investors would like WoW being in gamepass. It’s a huge acquisition and WoW is still a golden goose, just not as big as it was years ago.
Going to be honest, i could care less of what investors want really either. I’m more or less talking about this for the perspective of a gamer/consumer here, (Because that’s what we are only qualified to talk as, since were just people who they play their games and have really no right to talk about business anyways on their part) and how bad/good it is for us.
I would like WoW to come to Gamepass because it gives gamers more options. But not at the expense of other ways of getting the game to be pulled to just simply be exclusive. And this is how i also feel about Sony (again, rumor), buying Take Two, aka, the guys who made GTA and more importantly, NBA2K, and other franchises it might have.
Ehhhh… Tbh, it’s kind of debatable when you have franchises like Candy Crush and CoD from all of Activision’s library. And possibly a few others in Blizzard’s lineup, or anything from the mobile side.
going to be honest, investors could care less what you want and they are footing the bill, you seem to absolutely fail to understand this concept
you can debate it, you will lose, but you can debate it
I feel like I’m wasting my time explaining basic business practice to someone who only cares about their view and fails to see the difference between a subscription based service and one time purchase video game. There are only so many times I can repeat myself when the other person constantly replies with “because I want it and I don’t care if they lose money”. So have a great and lets hope you are never put in charge of any basic finance.
It’s really not. Otherwise EVERYBODY would be avoid Steam if it’s such an awful business idea, not just MMO makers.
And i should care why? I’m a gamer. I want to talk about what affects gamers.
What do you mean? WoW hasn’t been doing that great lately and i genuinely believe Candy Crush (which is a mobile game btw) and CoD are doing better then WoW
Because this thread is meant about studios buying other studios, and why it’s bad in the gamer perspective. This was meant to be a casual thread, causally discussing things. Something for Gamers to talk about on whether they think it affects them or not.
If you wish to make a Thread discussing how putting games on steam is an awful business idea or how the 30% cut from it is bad, then you go ahead. Nobody’s stopping you. Kindly leave my thread out of that.
Unless you owe stocks into Activison-Blizzard, or an investor yourself (which i yet to see any credibility for), my answer is valid here. It’s valid regardless, because it’s actually none of my business if they lose money or something. That affects NOTHING of my opinion on things.
Well this isn’t the most childish thing i’ve ever read, after you’ve derailed my thread with your nonsense about “but, but, muh investors!”.
And looking at your post history, it’s clear you’re just trolling or being a contrarian while pretending to know how a business works. Otherwise, you wouldn’t be on the forums if you yourself know business, right?
Live long and prosper, and don’t let those investors hit you on the door on your way out.
That’s your own subjective opinion. You’re not entitled to be right because you subjectively feel that way.
No i don’t. I just think their not relevant to discuss in a casual conversation about studios buying other studios. It doesn’t warrent you to derail so far off coarse, all because i made a suggestion that more or less fits what everybody else is doing anyways because it’s a popular decision, because there’s so many people using it.
Again, if you want to make a “Steam bad” thread, kindly leave and go make that thread.
You insulting me by telling me “i hope you are never put in charge of any basic finance” because you’re upset you clearly wanted an in depth analysis and discussion of the finer aspects of business and talking about what they want and such and nitpick on throwaway suggestions (like steam is just 5% of my OP, and yet you only responded to that and agrued… for the sake of it, against it), is more childish then anything.
no as usual you are are wrong, not a single Blizzard game I said. You seem fairly young and naive so you may not know this but Blizzard was a separate company from Activision until they merged. Not a single Blizzard game, Blizzard, game, Blizzard game. And speaking of childish you left out the Blizzard part when you copied my quote to try to attempt to make your post accurate, that’s pathetic!
you brought it up, I simply proved it was a bad idea that they clearly don’t follow
but they are not doing it, that’s what you constantly fail to see. they are not doing it and clearly have financial reasoning as to why
I’m posting an educated opinion based on responses from you that prove you lack a basic understanding of business sense. I can only go by what was provided by you.
So the 83% very positive reviews means people don’t like it?
Putting that aside, if you’re talking about the issues that particular version has, that’s and between what Lily has said here, two MMO out of what i’ve mentioned here… we yet to cover an entire genre of MMO’s that are negatively affected by steam.
I yet to see this complaint with every other game. MMO or otherwise.
But exactly why you’re discussing this minor thing instead of the main thing of the topic itself?..
I mean, it only takes minutes to setup on your PC. Plus from what i’ve seen after using a few EA games myself, it auto creates an account for you if you don’t have one. IIRC.
Activision-Blizzard are the same company…
Oh okay, so you’re saying there is Activision-Blizzard games on steam and i was correct. Okay.
What, this part where you’re just being practically angry with me because you didn’t check?
I left this out because there was no objective point to this. It’s just childishness for the sake of childish. And you doing this “No u” doesn’t convince anybody i’m being a child, especially since you’ve derailed this topic with this minor throwaway thing i’ve said.
As a minor thing. It’s still going off topic because you’re not discussing the main topic of this discussion.
You actually didn’t. I’ve countered it, and you continue to childishly go “GRR STEAM BAD!” Instead of going and making a thread about that yourself.
Sounds like a bad business move to not do what’s popular. A lot of game devs do this to get the money. Remember when everybody wanted to do lootboxes? How about that time where there was like all those CoD clones on the Market? or GTA clones back then even?
So why the others are doing it?.. I mean, you constantly fail to see how so many people are drawn to steam, and why so many the devs, big and small, choose to sell their stuff on steam. And i’ve given you the most simplest, most accurate answer, the answer that also is their finical reasoning, because that’s where they get their money from… And your best answer to that is “. Umm Nooooooo…”?
Doesn’t matter what you call it. It’s still comes off as an insult.
Again, if you want to make a “Steam bad” thread, then get off and make your own “steam is bad” thread. Were not talking about steam, and yet for some bizzare reason, you took a throwaway point, and you decided it would be good form to go… “GRR!! Steam bad because their 30%!! What?! Steam is popular and everybody uses or sell games on it?! DOESN’T MATTER!! STEAM IS BAD!! I RIGHT, U WRONG!!”
Were not talking about steam, and you’ve practically driven this thread away from what i was originally going to talk about.
Edit: Okay, now you can talk about steam here, since i’ve separated the MS Deal thing to another topic. Continue hoss.
I mean the game is good, but the only people who are going to leave Steam reviews are Steam users, so they’ll probably leave good reviews.
Feel free to do some reading up on why people hate how it’s available through both - it causes general confusion and is just damned inconvenient adding yet another layer of hoops to go through to play.
As far as having a bajillion launchers going on at the same time…it’s a pain in the behind and nobody prefers it. Some tolerate it. But in either case it unnecessarily hogs up system resources and can even cause performance problems on lower end systems.
Yes I just told you they were so you can thank me for educating your some more,frankly a thankless job. Obviously Activision published games and Blizzard published games are not run the same since no blizzard games are on STEAM
nope once again you are wrong, you lied and cherry picked a quote because you were desperate. You knew no blizzard games were on STEAM and pathetically attempted to make yourself look right and got caught.
not one time did I say “no u”
never said STEAM was bad, I like STEAM. what I said. it clearly made no financial sense to Blizzard to post their games there. Unfortunately you don’t know the definition of the word " fiduciary" or how stocks work. So you countered with " but I want it and I don’t care how companies operate". Your ignorance is a you problem.
Once again you don’t understand their fiduciary responsibility. If it doesn’t make financial sense they won’t do it. If it does make financial sense and they don’t do it, they could lose their jobs and/or potentially get sued in a breach of fiduciary duty lawsuit.
because their internal numbers show they can make a profit from it and don’t have their own launcher and ecosystem as does Blizzard. Why would blizzard give a 30% cut of all profits to Valve when they are selling the same product month after month, year after year to the same people already signed up for their system. Their internal numbers clearly shows to them it doesn’t make financial sense.
you brought up steam, in fact in your last full post you mentioned it five times at least. You have been hung up the entire thread about WoW being on STEAM.
but I want it and I don’t care how companies operate". Your ignorance is a you problem.