AFKing from the GY cause you can’t do anything is different than AFKing from the start. I won’t blame you for doing that.
My bad, guess I was thinking you were like the OP asking for other changes. Which is why I said that wasn’t relevant to Classic queues.
My only purpose here is to know and spread the truth, as corny and cliche as that sounds.
I was unsure myself and merely looked it up; good to know it was a misunderstanding.
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it is that very imbalance between premades and pugs that give rise to pvp guilds. Changing pvp from a solo activity that you do around other people into a social one where the key to success is working and coordinating with others to achieve your goals. if people want the former they have retail. Classic is for people who want the latter.
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“Can’t do anything” is subjective. Many winning opportunities were ruined by people who quit in the face of needing to try.
Your post read differently.
But if that’s what you meant, then I’ll drop it.
Personally, as an elemental shaman, I just enjoy trying to pick people off from the GY, but I do know it can really suck at times. I’m content to roll with it.
Yeah this is my attitude. Even if it’s a loss, I still try to get kills at least.
Nah, that’s where CRBG’s are needed/good to have so you have a chance to get away from the premes.
Well, if we’re gonna go down that path, as someone who greatly prefers comp PvP (live for arenas), classic isn’t at all made for comp PvP because comp PvP wasn’t even a twinkle in their eye. In fact, PvP was kinda just tacked on in the start. BG’s are more competitive, but are also a casual form of PvP. I’m on the same boat, but that’s why I’m hoping TBC becomes a thing, by then I can just live in arenas again.
ehhh yeaaa that’s not really gonna happen…BG’s will be a little better because WoW is balanced around group PvP, but again, PvP balance wasn’t even a thing in vanilla. When Blizz finally did start balancing for PvP it was centered around 3’s, so even 2v2 and 5v5 weren’t balanced, they were just for points/practice/warmups. Again, best bet is TBC, we have a solid chance at it assuming Classic continues to do well. I wouldn’t be too shocked if it was already in the works. Expansions now are quite easy to do…not to say they don’t need to put in a lot of work for them as well.
At least you’re not the OP picking on someones level and whether they are pve or pvp server.
It became difficult to see from his perspective the second he started talking about mouth-breathers and such.
Not that I’m a saint myself; I apologize for calling you dense and whatnot.
Eh it’s np. I messed up what was being talked about as I admittedly didn’t read every post in this bad thread.
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you have a lot of good points. vanilla and bc are seperate games. I also loved bc and arena, but that is solely because i love actual pvp. I believe there’s only a few things that are needed for classic to have meaningful pvp, and I don’t think those things break the integrity of the game.
but you’re right. competitive pvp was not a priority of vanilla. however, competitive pvp happened, and it will happen again in classic. vanilla pvp balanced back then much better because people aren’t as try hard as they are now. people wouldn’t spend all day corpse camping like we’re seeing now. this is coming from someone who sees my fellow faction do it all the time. it’s not fun to be on either side. and I know what is coming in december. many have seen the writing on the walls. This isn’t a matter of will we have good pvp, it’s a matter of how many games do you want to play where you are GY camping all game/getting camped all game (depending on if you pug or not) vs how many games do you want a worthwhile fight? You will have both types of games, but a small improvement will determine if a significant portion of these games are completely one sided or not. Again, one sided games, no matter the side you are on, are no fun for anyone but the big sweaties who fp camp all day. this is not in the spirit of vanilla pvp.
I think the waiting until bc expansion to come out idea for meaningful pvp is a bad strategy, for business and for our fun, when the fix is so easy.
but hey. I can just leave and maybe come back if classic is still alive by then. based on how things are going though, i’m not so sure it will be by the time we get bc.
Classic will be fine. See you in BC
I hope they keep it close to the original of what happened. If too much metastasizing happens we can only blame the players for buying into awful gameplay and practices. I wouldn’t mind a perhaps, if it showed it was needed, weight attached to group players so they were more or very likely to fight vs. each other. However, this hand-holding implication is also very worrisome and contrary to what vanilla was and should be.
Arena is skill-based as much as vanilla pvp is skill-based. Arena has big problems with imbalance throughout the expansions as well as what the engine and system allows for the skill cap, vanilla skill cap is deceptively high, there’s plenty of unbalanced things, but the skill cap is there for those that know better, and it doesn’t rely on some vague notion of “more abilities and teammate coordination = more skill for 3v3 but not bigger numbers” that arena does, or the problem especially around BC/wrath being composition imbalance which plagued arena
As much as I can respect and appreciate what arena brought in terms of skill, it is often assumed that skill is synonymous with arena and that’s very unfortunate, especially with a big problem being that it’s so limited in scope that it becomes scripted pvp.
The honor system is a lot about stream-rolling pugs but your premade better have at least half competent players in it, too. Otherwise the very embarrassing thing of a premade being beaten by PUGs will happen, as it has in the past. This also isn’t accounting for the known unfortunate lengthy grind that the pvp honor system is, and doesn’t account for the general pvp that makes vanilla so great- Grim, Vurtne & Gameking pvp videos for as memorable as they are had very little to do with “vanilla pvp is only premades stomping pugs” don’t forget that.
Because you’d think we’d learn from past mistakes.
Do you think premades GY farming pugs is good for the long-term health of the game?
Nah you’re the guy playing on a cuddly PvP server without ample competition, admitting to camping people in the same sentence you claim to be “competitive”. You’re either a beautiful troll or a tremendous hypocrite.
You can’t fix corpse camping by simply changing the way ques are handled. Graveyard camping happens because Battlegrounds allow and arguably encourage it by design. That won’t change.
Fighting a premade as a pug group is not a viable solution or option. I say this as someone who will always play premade if I PvP because to do otherwise is laughable. I remember how vanilla works. If you end up having to solo queue, those games end up being make a sandwich in the graveyard games. Thats just how vanilla was.
And you’re an idiot, so, BAM!
Seriously, you’re an idiot.
There should be a solo queue but of course there won’t be. Idiots will defend this “No changes!” even though blizzard has already changed things.
There should not be a solo que. Not because of some hard stance on “no changes”, but because this is a group game. That is the real difference between Vanilla and Retail. Vanilla was meant to encourage you to group up in order to progress through the content. Molten Core isn’t a “difficult” raid in terms of mechanics, getting 40 people together and coordinated is what makes it “difficult”.
That’s what an MMORPG is. You’re supposed to have social interactions, form groups, make connections with heroes across the world. If you’re the type of player that wants to join a BG so you can run off and do your own thing instead of joining a group to coordinate for a victory, then you should get farmed by others opting for the latter. This is a group game. I hear retail is perfectly tailored for those opting for a more singular experience, maybe go solo que there.
PvP shouldn’t become “join a premade… or get farmed by one”.
Unless you also want to tell pug PvPers to reroll to a different game.