What would happen if the Alliance was the aggressor in such a war? Calia’s called “Corpse Princess” by some, and I doubt they see the differentials between her and a Forsaken. But either way I’ll go back to my original point. Maybe we could like… take a serious break from Red Vs. Blue PVP bullcrap and Faction Wars that no one can win?
Instead we could set up PVP Factions like the Scarlet Crusade which offered cosmetic rewards etc. The reborn Crusade wants to kill Forsaken / Calia / Derek. Obviously Calia and Derek have to respond. ANYONE (including Alliance maybe) could sign up for one side to aid Calia. Maybe a vindictive Night Elf angry over Teledrassil sides with the Scarlet Crusade?
Now you have 2 sides fighting in a battle yet again. The point I raise is this, there are better ways to do PVP now. Blizzard just needs to retire the old barriers for something more elegant and fitting of the lore.
All I take from some posters is a false statement is that some people want to turn the Forsaken like the Blood Elves into a sub-par version of what they are, because the nostalgia for Warcraft II is strong.
Forsaken = The People of Lordaeron that ‘survived’ Arthas.
Blood Elves = The High Elves that ‘survived’ Arthas.
I’m sorry their loyalties have shifted and you don’t like it. But in a world that has been at war for a while, such things often happen. It doesn’t change what the Forsaken or Blood Elves are at their cores. Nor does the Kingdom of Stormwind have a monopoly on things like the Lordaeron racial crest.
Let’s be completely honest here people. An undead Menethil ruling over Lordaeron only terrifies some Alliance players, because it means they might not have an absolute moral standing in future wars or have as easy a time at painting the Horde as evil monsters that exist solely for their PVP fix.
0/10, too early for a Sunday esque troll thread, OP.
Same power level? A blight blob probably has MORE power than Calia (I mean as far as lore goes tge gal is quite generic and powerful as any rando priest).
Mend fences? Gal, she kinda doesn’t represent the actual Forsaken faction that commited the atrocities under Sylvanas’ banner, ergo she can’t represent them and her pretending to act as responsible for these people’s actions on any level is hilarious (you know, to "gain redemption people has to commit an atrocity/crime in the first place).
Political claim? Sorry, but last time we saw the big bulk of the Forsaken people REJECTED the actual heir to the crown (A.K.A Arthas) and pledged themselves to the dictatorship of an unaffiliated third party (Sylvanas) and the Horde. Literally the current Horde council has more legitimate political claim over the Forsaken than the descendant of a dead monarchy. I know it can be easy to mistake the geographical land (Lordaeron) with the people holding it (the Forsaken), but unfortunately for Calia, those Forsaken aren’t rocks and she doesn’t own them by default.
Calia is the literal WORST option available, as interesting as effing Velen for the lols and putting any rando version of Kil’jaeden in his place.
Yep. You do need to. Especially with Sylvanas having abandoned the Horde.
We get it though. Like the legions of Human Paladins that want my High Elf character to be their bestie, you want to kill Horde and pretend that the only time a genocide is bad; is when the Horde does it. Every other time it’s a ‘holy war’ for the good of the world.
Let’s not forget that Malfurion and Tyrande claimed the same justifications when the Highborne left / were exiled (semantics) after 2,700 years of tenuous peace. Here’s a novel thought, though. Who are you to say that any undead has no right to continue existing if they desire?
Yeah. Can you imagine Calia battling her fellow Lordaerians like Turalyon? Or she slaughtering Alliance soldiers wearing her kingdom symbols? She wearing the Lordaeron crest killing other people wearing the same symbol. Crazy. Confusing. Stupid.
that said, why dont the horde players want a old jaina type of character, old jaina always helped the alliance, but was always for peace, why cant calia help the horde, put her people first, but be for peace.
A. The Forsaken do not need another monarch. Much less one who might as well be living. The concept of a Lightforged undead remains bewildering and this is coming from someone who mains a Priest and desperately wants an Undead Paladin. An undead continuing to worship the Light despite their dark nature is interesting. An undead made of sunshine just misses the racial fantasy so entirely as to be considered parody. Or an out of season April fools joke, if you will.
B. The Forsaken do not require Calia nor any significant change to be morally nuanced. They already were once upon a time. They’ll always be on the blacker side of the morally gray gradiant because - well they eat people - but that doesn’t preclude them from still being heroic. Writing heroic characters with monstrous characteristics isn’t hard - Blizzard in fact used to do it quite often.
No Forsaken leader represents the faction for those atrocities.
That is literally something they’ll have to deal with on their own, even if Calia were to be their leader.
Second, by “mending fences”, I believe the fences in question are the one’s between the Forsaken and Humans. I know, shocking concept, right? Two races actually NOT wanting to kill each other anymore. But it’s been known to happen.
No, there’s been literally a hundred posts with far worse choices.
She’s definitely in the top 10.
Belmont is still there… and Voss (that for all her supposed moral highground and supposed “hate” of necromancy) still happily turned Amalia Stone into a Forsaken without her consent… and so on and so fort.
Point is, Calia has literally NOTHING to do in regards to any of the actions taken by the Forsaken and their military, so her trying to “mend fences” with Tyrande et al is stupid AF. And I rather we start divorcing from the current “braindead writting” used by the devs.
Literally irrelevant in the wake of Teldrassil et al (I mean I could have been VERY relevant on an scenario in which Forsaken fight on Arathi and Orcs on Darkshore). The whiny former Lordaeronians living on Stormwind are pretty minor in comparison with the issue regarding the Nelves.
Says the woman using the avatar representing the most criticized allied race ever on the grounds of less effort (personally I do get why you guys were gonna get Velves instead of glorified blue eyed Belves with a hardcore case of mana veganism; but most posters do not, so…)
That’s my main crux of the issue. I was initially more optimistic for Calia. If they wanted a Forsaken leader out of her there were plenty of places to introduce her early on and weave her into the story.
But BFA has came and went. The only Forsaken who know about her are some Undead Nelves who f’ed off, Calia Voss and the PC if they happen to be Forsaken. That’s it. She’s had more extensive interaction with the Alliance.
Maybe she’ll have a bigger role in SL but honestly if Blizz insists we must have a Light wielding unambiguously good undead then there’s a perfectly good Alonsos Faol just derping around Netherlight right now.
Also very connected and sympathetic to the Alliance but at least UNDEAD. Twisted into a predatory unnatural creature of shadow by the Scourge. As opposed to, ya know, brought back from death by a Naaru.
The problem is that they’ll never mend fences with Tyande, even with Calia in lead. Not until they come to a conclusion that that following Sylvannas from the beginning (unquestioningly) is the reason why they are in such dire straits as they are. Calia may be about to help them in that regard but the onus is on them ultimately to realize that they’re going to need to do some real soul-searching and maybe even re-evaluate their place in the world and even who they define themselves to be.
Literally has nothing to do with Teldrassil and completely removed from that.
Then she´s already useless regarding her supposed “diplomacy” perks… as a mather of fact she actually becomes detrimental Horde side when you take into account she literally has ZERO ties to ANY of the members on the council (ergo her political weigh with her actual allies would be pretty pathetic all things considered… she´s no Baine with a nice daddy shadow opening the doors for her, and actually her blood ties to Arthas wouldn´t make her precisely popular with Belves for example).
They kinda already did (or at least started to do as far as BfA is concerned… they never needed Calia to realize this… heck, using Calia as a vehicle for this type of “redemptive narrative” would be catastrophic preciselly cause it implies Forsaken as a race are so useless, stupid and naive they literally need a dictator telling them what to believe and how to act cause they by themselves are unable to do so).
THIS is why Calia is the WORST case ever, cause she´s nothing but a cheap “I-win the good morality and nuance” button that tries to “fix” the narrative issues surrounding the Forsaken development post Cata with zero effort.
And Calia the angel is the least indicated to guide borderline sociopaths and tell them were did they went wrong. As I said before, she simply doesn´t have the narrative weight to properly achieve this. Replacing Sylvanas with Calia is as cheap and as absurd literary speaking as reviving demon Kil´jaeden and putting him in replacement of Velen for the lols.
So by proxy of not being relevant to the current post war narrative, indeed irrelevant in the whole inmediate scheme of things? Good yopu realized this.
Sylvanas had no connections either when she first joined the Horde.
Calia is well known to the people of lordaeron.
Sylvanas is gone and they are left completely leaderless besides some vague names.
Now is the perfect opportunity for the old dynasty to return.
I understand player may not like for their own previous dislike and Alliance hand holding element but thematically Calia is probably the strongest candidate to take up the mantle of Lordaeron.
Also her dying to Sylvanas makes her a victim of her treachery just as much as they were her victims.
