And you’re arguing that they are the same game because they have one sub.
Thing is, you’re wrong.
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![:man_shrugging:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/man_shrugging.png?v=6" ":man_shrugging:")
What do you want me to do about it?
I’m not the one who is upset that I’m getting the “free” milkshake you swore I would never get, even though I’m paying for the “free” milkshake, and have paid more than you.
I’m not the one who is upset that I was right when I told you that I could see how this was all playing out. That Blizzard was going to combine subs. And here we are, you still haven’t worked out why that is better for them, than it is for you.
As for you resenting and despising me? A long time ago, you said you were going to ignore me, block me, or whatever it is that your type think matters to me. You can still do that.
I’d go so far as to say that you are envious in how that you’re upset that so many other people who play a video game are also going to be playing the same version you play at no more cost than they already. You’re upset that you’re getting what you want, but they don’t have to do anything more.
Everyone’s paying $15 to play again, but again, you want special consideration. That’s entitled.
I get more for paying $15, and THAT makes you angry. Is it my feels involved? Or yours?
Because of minor mechanical details between builds? Or just because you say that I’m wrong?
As I pointed out, people like you said that we’d never have a combined sub, while I said that we would.
Who is wrong? Fine, call me wrong. Doesn’t change where we are now.
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No, they are separate games. Just because they are similar doesn’t mean they are the same.
And for the record, I said we “shouldn’t” have a combined sub for reasons that have nothing at all to do with them being different or the same game.
And where we are is that we have one charge for two games.
As far as Blizzard is concerned, for their bottom line, they’re going call it one game. That’s how they’re going to bump up sub numbers or MAUs for stock investors.
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That’s like saying Ford calls “automobiles” their bottom line. It’s correct, but not really.
And investors don’t care about just MAU’s unless it’s a free service that relies on people being online to generate money. Investors still care about subs.
To be clear you don’t deserve anything. That’s an overly-entitled narcissistic attitude.
You are not entitled to Classic. You do not “deserve” a separate sub. You don’t even “deserve” to get it cheaper.
You get what Blizzard chooses to do as per their business model. You should be grateful that Blizzard has chosen to actually implement Classic instead of ignoring the playerbase. You should be happy that more people will play Classic and populate the world you want because of the Shared sub enticing people who would otherwise not discover they enjoyed it.
The level of self-aggrandizing, overly-entitled, narcissistic blather being peddled by some members of the community on this topic is absurd.
You deserve to be put in your corner and told to wait while the rest of the community enjoys Classic for a few months.
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They care about money. Subs and MAUs only quantify where that money is coming from, and those investors aren’t going to care whether it’s WoW Retail or WoW Classic that’s getting the subs, just that there’s a lot of them. The bigger that number, the better.
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That’s patently not true. Investors care very much where that money is coming from. And MAUs do not quantify anything save to say how many people are online. In WoW, unlike a website or Facebook, simply being online doesn’t generate any money for Blizz. They need a sub and/or they need to be spending in the cash shop.
Regretfully it is true. Investors want results, and that means market visibility and money. They won’t care about what game makes the money, so long as it makes money.
This is why they bought King, and this is why they bet big on E-sports - visibility and a push for popularity is better for their returns.
Acti Blizz told people it was a “record year” and then turned around and fired a bunch of employees. Could they have afforded to keep them? Yes, absolutely. But did they? No. The cost vs. revenue balance won out here.
MAUs make investors feel like they’re backing a winning horse. This is the number that things like subs used to do, but Blizzard doesn’t report sub numbers anymore.
https://investor.activision.com/financial-information/quarterly-results
Their whole plan, as they have announced it, is to pump out more games faster. Cut back on support, increase publishing.
No point arguing with him. Unfortunately they won. They don’t understand the importance of server community in vanilla and how detrimental releasing it the way they are will be to that community. Retail players won’t care though, Classic will just be something to do after they finish dailies or wait for the next content drop. I’ll never know why these people are hellbent on preventing us from getting a game we love.
I’m trying to hold out hope that Blizzard will come up with something that will save Classic and give us good server community. But it’s getting hard.
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I love how you say that to the person who is actively trying to drive anyone who doesn’t fall lock step in line with him, away from Classic entirely. That sort of negativity is not what Vanilla’s community was made of.
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I’m kinda sad there are people I’ll be playing Classic with that don’t think Blizzard can differentiate between someone who logs in to play retail and someone who logs in to play Classic.
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The only thing I see him saying is that Classic deserves a chance to stand on it’s own, to be it’s own game instead of additional content for another. Retail could get away with that, they have cross realm zones and BGs. Population fluctuations wouldn’t impact them because the cross realm feature would always make you feel like you are in a full active world. Classic doesn’t have that, or shouldn’t, to be honest It won’t surprise me if it is added because I see no other way for them to fix the population problems they are going to have.
Just think about this. BFA players get free access to Classic so long as they have a sub. Classic players can only get access to BFA if they purchase BFA…Requiring Classic be purchased just like BFA would prevent many of the problems Classic is going to have at launch.
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Just think about this. Classic’s player base would expand when people are given easy access to try it, proving that it can attract non-evangelists on its own merits.
The alternative is giving a 1-20 Free Trial, opening you up for far worse abuses.
And make the game far less attractive to people not already wanting to play, thus “proving” its outdated and not worth Blizzard’s attention.
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We don’t need to increase the player base, it is a niche market at best with a very loyal fan base. Giving easy access is rarely a good thing, just look at Archeage, could potentially be one of the best MMOs on the market, but it is F2P which lead to massive amounts of alts, botters and hackers.
And by that reasoning, why require BFA purchase to play it? By giving it away for free and allowing everyone easier access to it you could expand the BFA player base?
Just make it a separate server not connected to the Classic servers. I’d be fine with retail having that.
Why do I want to play with people who don’t want to play? That doesn’t even make sense…And again, it is no more outdated than requiring BFA be purchased.
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It’s funny that you say where money comes from doesn’t matter, and then point to two specific examples of pinpointing where the money is going to come from.
So make more, crappy games? If that’s what they want to do. I’m sure they’ll grab all that money from people who “have phones”…
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So you’re not ascribing to all these other posters claims that Classic will be more popular than BfA?
Because we’re trying to prove to Blizzard that Classic can attract more people than BfA, so that they rethink their MMO strategy. Blizzard is never going to attempt to do that, and requiring a sub just makes it harder for the people who might/would change over if they knew what they were missing, from doing so.
I didn’t say “don’t want to play”. I said “not already wanting to play”. People who don’t realize how good Classic is, but suddenly find out how much better it is when they try it out.
All these arguments just come off as some elitist “We’re better and we want our own little club” idea which is not how we convince companies to start making actual progressive MMO’s in the old style of Classic.
LOL!!! Not a chance. I’ve even said as much in this very thread. Classic will do very well to reach 100k, and I feel like I am being very generous giving them that many.
Not gonna happen. Just look at general forums, retail players cry about not having more handouts than they already get. Based on what they are crying about they want the game to go even further away from what Classic is, not towards it. As I mentioned above, Classic will not come close to BFA numbers…Well, technically it may since they are giving all BFA players free access to it.
See above mentioned free trial, separate from live servers. Try away.
As opposed to your arguments coming off as entitled “I want to play it but not pay for it”? There is nothing elitist about my comment. I want Classic to be successful for the people who want to play it. If we manage to hit 100k active vanilla players, throwing ~2 million retail players at our ~3k population capped servers is a terrible idea. Even if only half of retailers try classic, that means on average we would have 272 vanilla fans playing alongside 2720 retail tourists, most of which will quit, leaving our servers dead. Unlike retail we don;t have sharding so our servers stay dead. Now we have to merge, transfer…or maybe they will shard just so they don’t have to deal with it. All of these things are terrible for classic servers.
So no, I am not being elitist. But you are absolutely coming off as entitled and don’t even care that what you are asking for will cause serious harm to Classic and the loyal dedicated players that actually want it.
I hate to tell you but that isn’t going to happen. MMOs are a dying genre. The few major ones still around all have modern QOL features very similar to retail wow. There are plenty of old school MMO reboots, all of which have small fan bases. There is just not any major money to be made in making old school MMOs like that anymore.
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He/she/it just likes to mischaracterize what I actually write to bait me into responding.
It is only a different game when one brings up having to pay for BFA’s “box cost”.
Behold the hypocrisy…
edit: also note that they never actually answered that clear and direct question.
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I would happily pay for a separate sub if required. I’m not the target audience for ‘finding out Classic is better’. I already know it is. They wouldn’t gain or lose anything because I wouldn’t maintain a BfA sub if they required a separate Classic one. That’s a non-starter.
For the rest, I disagree with you on the MMO front. The indie MMOs that are gaining popularity harken back to an older style, but lack the funding or AAA backing to be big. Games like Everquest which is a fair step more “hardcore” than WoW ever was, still have strong user bases. WoW is just the 10,000 pound gorilla that’s lead all the other AAA producers to think that its retail method is the one that makes money, when really Retail is riding a success that its slowly eroded.