Probably enough times to counter those who think shams can’t tank past 30.
Just because your experience with shamans tanking SM+ is bad, it doesn’t mean shamans tanking SM+ actually is bad.
No one is trying to argue that they are tier 1 tanks like warriors or druids (maybe tier 2 for druids). But how many times do YOU need to be told from other shamans with their experiences before you listen?
this is my 2nd classic shaman.
Both were enhance-ish specs. Both were and will be wpvp focused. my first was part of the original pvp earned-rank grind, believe rank 13 was my highest.
We do not tank. We can support and offer our ‘tank’ abilities if the tank falls…
but the primary focus of the enhance tree is to survive pvp and a support role in bursting and disabling enemies. You can adjust this to more team play or solo or both. Shaman change the battlefield with earned knowledge of how/when to use our totems…this is our strength.
Tanking is just not our role, try not to recreate the wheel… try instead making it better.
If you say ‘omg but we have hate tools!’…
we do! but its to save our allies from death, not to tank in leather/mail…when others clearly have better gear/specs to do that role…
1 shield does not = tanking ability… it only allows you solo stuff even con, cause they will beat the snot out of you without it.
My best advice for you in this spec…
do what you want, then come back and re-read all this advice from other shaman.
p.s. the plural of shaman is shaman.
just want to emphasize enhance shaman are devoted to always watching the battlefield, especially the melee area. We are the first stop gap, fighting alongside the tank to enhance melee and change things that go wrong. This is our role.
wf totem, purge, tremor, grounding, earthbind, stoneclaw, magma, resist totems… the list goes on…
where shaman heals and caster dps are very exact in what totems they can use/need… enhance cover the area they cannot. We are the joker up the sleeve.
Why are there so many garbage threads?
this is classic, not retail.
if you stack agility past 30 like you are stating,
be prepared to die alot and often.
If you do not stack stamina as enhance you will die faster than everyone else, everytime, and that’s talking only pve.
In the end, it’s a pvp game, if you can be killed in 1-shot, you will be target #1 that the alliance craves,
(also the main reason enhance were targetted by alliance in the old days… all crit, no hp. Go re-read the endless tears from shaman forums back then. You need to balance stamina in any enhance spec.)
and oh yeah, you won’t be tanking past 30. There just isn’t gear avail to shaman to make this happen. We wear hunter gear.
This was in vanilla days.
Proof this has been done.
I’m all for shaman trying it out, in the end it’s your gold to respec, and it will be expensive.
but for all these folks here saying they are trying something new…
you’re not. you’re just not, get over it, we been down this road 1million times.
YOU’RE NOT TRYING ANYTHING NEW OR THAT HASN’T BEEN TRIED!
we’re not tanks, it’s not our role, our role is totems. figure it out.
No this is retail, not classic. lol no s*** sherlock
Hey, riddle me this, when did I ever say to stack agil as a tank? It’s obvious that I’m stacking agility to DPS, not tank. I even mentioned that if I were to tank, i’d stack stam gear instead. Seriously, go reread it lol.
And, “in the end, it’s a pvp game” lol. Dude no one here is talking about shaman tanks in pvp or endgame. Just dungeons up to 60.
I’ve been stacking agil as a lvl 31 enh sham while dpsing in PvE content which is good.
I won’t be tanking past 30? You sure about that? If I were to link a video showing a shaman tanking in lvl 40 and lvl 50 instances where he was tanking, would you believe me then? Probably not. You’re so incredibly ignorant and stubborn that that you wouldn’t believe the truth right in front of you lolz.
And oh yeah, seriously go reread my post hahaha. You’re addressing topics that you clearly don’t understand.
Actually, for the most part you want to stack agility for tanking also. There are two reasons for this. First, flurry is one of the only talents in all of classic that increases attack speed, and so as a result, is one of the only things that effect Threat generation per second. Since rockbiter has a native x72 TPS generation mechanic, flurry is incredibly powerful at keeping threat up for tanking.
Second, In terms of mitigation, which is the primary issue with shaman tanking (Ie itemization does not provide a lot) dodge is the easiest stat to stack for survival. Thus, Agility provides the best options per Stat: Mitigation value, and threat per second generation. In theory, Str is slightly better, but then you lose threat generation.
This is the CURRENT mind set of optimal shaman tanking build, but we are exploring alternative ways to address both mitigation and threat generation rates.
After lvl40, Warriors/Paladins get Plate, Druids get Dire Bear Form, and Shaman get nothing. For the next 4-5 levels or so, you can continue to Tank alright relative to the Plate users, but the Druid just instantly blows you out of the water and the others catch up when they replace all their Mail gear.
At lvl60, you’re too squishy, have no taunt, and really struggle with AoE packs, to the point that it is a troll idea to do.
Shamans start with leather, and gain mail at 40, in vanilla.
Shamans natively have the most passive mitigation generation from talents.
Shaman shave the lowest cd taunt, half of warriors
Shamans have an aoe taunt, and all tanks except druid struggle with this. Explosives are the solution for all classes.
Ok sure. I won’t argue that. But tell all that to Tio lol. He’s the one claiming shamans can’t tank dungeons
So you start out weaker than all the Tanks and only upgrade marginally past that to a gulf that’s even wider than before.
Which doesn’t matter when you have Rogue or Hunter Armor and Health.
/facepalm
Druids have Challenging Roar and if you need Engineering to hold AoE threat… you’re really bad at Druid/Warrior/Paladin.
Half my ZF runs I’ve ended up having to tank. Either the warrior isn’t confident los pulling or i’m pulling before I kite with stacked mages.
When you pull big, you’re more of a shepherd than a tank.
I’m not clear on what the goal of this thread is.
You have opinions bordering on flat assertions about feasibility, with defined limitations (i.e., no raid tanking). Are you just looking for assurance that you are correct?
I wouldn’t go out of your way to tank 5 mans. It’s nice having the choice when there are no other options left but you’re better off as an off tank at best.
Enhance has great utility, aoe dps with ravager + magma and can throw out clutch healing to save warrior or mage to secure that the big pulls go down smooth.
Having to focus on holding mobs together on top of all that without help can throw you off assisting in those previous mentioned.
I really see they were meant to be tanks, too bad Blizzard changed their mind, but my experience is that I was running a dungeon and I would steal all the threat from our real tank, he was getting mad he was like “you are better tank than I am” , but I had a 2 hand axe, not a shield.
The idea of a spec that can be tank and meele with the change of weapon and what spells you use is great because for dps you would use flame shock and 2 hand weapons with fire enchant on weapon and strength totem.
Tank use Rockbiter is the earth weapon enchant that keeps threat by auto attacking, for this reason a faster weapon is necessary so you use a 1 hand weapon, and so the other hand should have a shield for that extra armor.
Earth shock causes extra threats, I even think can be used with rank 1 so you don’t waste your mana.
stone skin totem.
It is a fun class, but keep in mind maybe end content was not made for shamans to tank, and Blizzard changed their idea so there will be the point in Vanilla where they get rid of the shaman tank idea, won’t be able to use shields or generate enough theat, and you will become a dual wielder.
Druids start out with leather.
Shamans have more talents for block, dodge, parry and armor bonus.
You dont.
They start off viable, but the higher you level the less viable they become.
By 60 they aren’t really viable unless maybe you severely outgear the dungeons.
There are only 3 tanks in Classic, Warriors Druids and Paladins and pretty much only Warriors are viable progression raid tanks.
I don’t think they changed their mind at all. Shaman are the perfect hybrid support but that doesn’t mean that we were ever meant to be main tank material.
As melee dps, you have strong clutch off healing and can assist by pulling threat and being somewhat chunkier than other dps. You are not a tank.
With a Bear Form armor multiplier that makes us the equivalent of Mail+
Avoidance isn’t mitigation, blocking is meager, and Druids get the same +10% Armor bonus, but ours multiplies on top of our Bear modifier. Multiplies, not adds, that’s why Druids have insane EH.
You do. You don’t have Health/Stamina modifiers so whatever you wear, that’s what Rogues (pre-40) or Hunters (post-40) can and will have. It isn’t like we have tons of sockets to stack Stamina gems instead of Agility.