I feel like often we can be quick to voice our criticisms (though valid they might be) but not the triumphs
So here’s something I feel is a triumph
Shadowy flippin’ Apparitions
Honestly, moments like when you get SW:P rolling on a large pack and watch as the apparitions swarm out are incredible
So I guess, keep up the Shadowy Apparitions goodness Blizz ![:+1:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/+1.png?v=6" ":+1:")
Unpopular opinion time:
I hate shadowy apparations. As it stands its basically shadows only real “core” passive ability. It has a nice graphic, I agree, but functionally it does absolutely nothing.
When you get down to it, shadowy apparitions are just “shadow word pain crit damage is increased by x%” except with a very long projectile animation. Its actually less useful then this passive would be, because the projectile animation means some apparitions will always go to waste when the boss/mob/pack dies while they are midair.
Not only that, but they give zero resource/have zero interaction with the spec baseline. AS doesn’t even really make it better, the insanity generated from AS this expac has been toned down to be largely unnoticable outside very large multidot pulls, with a majority of AS’s power put in its raw damage budget.
Shadow as a spec is desperately looking for some sort of interactive ability right now, and shadowy apps being a core passive that does absolutely nothing but look good is one of the places to start.
So I agree, having an army of apparitions looks really cool and is definitely one of the wow factors of the spec, I just wish they actually did anything besides damage. Making them reduce the cd/store up and get consumed/used by some ability would make the passive way better.
Granted we would actually need a cooldown in the first place, and really, I wish they do give us something.
They give ‘free’ damage don’t they?
Yes, but damage isnt mechanically relevant or interesting, that’s the point.
By “they” I meant the Devs, and by “something” I meant a meaningful DPS cooldown.
Sorry if I was ambiguous.
I have no problem with Shadowy Apparitions being made into a more synergistic part of the SP kit. As you said it’s inherently weaker than a straight damage buff thanks to the (rather lengthy) travel time naturally causing loss of said damage, so I think they have a bit of power budget there to add extra components to it
I was more just pointing out that I enjoy the visual aspect of it and would like it to remain as a part of SP in at least some fashion
Certainly true, but I think from a ‘flavor’ perspective, it’s a pretty cool way to implement “ability does x% more dmg” in a non-homogeneous way.
I definitely agree we’re hurting on some interaction, but I see that as an overall design flaw rather than blaming the spirits. RIP level 75 talent tree - I’d much rather just have the insanity from spirits baked in, and AS swapped with tentabro.
I miss when they looked like our character, and not some undead lady coming out of me.
Mine look like a large Tuaren.
Sure, but not every spell has to be an Insanity generator or have a proc of that.
The issue for shadow is that nothing has any interaction.
Insanity isn’t a resource we can interact with, it’s a glorified timer, and once your rotation gets into full swing, like in raids, that really shows.
I mean the same thing is true with Malestrom and Energy. I can only think of Death Knights, Hunters, and Warriors that get to manipulate their secondary resource gain.
Malestrom is just a byproduct of casting a normal rotation for Elemental and acts as a timer for Earth Shock (their ‘big spell’).
Energy is a glorified timer for Feral and Rogues, I don’t think Rogues can even manipulate their Energy like a Feral can try and line up.
I’ll grant that having Voidform be a talent and having another ‘base’ way to spend Indanity would be better design, but as far as not having a way to interact with it beyond having a ‘Colossus Smash’ window for damage and some talents that can try and keep the buffs, theres not much that makes Shadow special.
I see what you’re going with here, but you forget that while rogues and shamans have abilities which cost that resource, that they can choose between and choose to use or not use, whilst the maximum they can hold is larger than the cost of any individual spender, shadow does not have that.
Shadow is designed to be a builder spender without a spender. The resource generation is near automatic, by pressing the buttons in order of which deal most damage, but where they differ from others is the spending of that resource is also automatic, given that spending is a gradual drain that you have no interaction or decisions over.
We’re a little off topic here, but my comments made towards apparitions are that they’re literally just additional tacked on damage numbers. They don’t do anything, they don’t change anything, they don’t make you think about anything, they just happen. Given the spec currently has absolutely nothing that would make you change anything or even think about anything, I feel like nothingburger passives like shadowy apparitions are wasted potential.
They add class flavor and looks.
I mean Shadow can choose to not go into Void Form and just never interact with that part of the spec. It would be about as useful as an Elemental Shaman not using Earth Shock in the corect priority.
I think it’s designed to be a spec with an interesting gameplay loop of getting into and out of Void Form to maintain a higher overall Haste average on the fight as well as getting access to more damaging spells, it’s a lot more like a Colossus Smash window from what I can tell.
I just want them to work off VT crits too…
Except earth shock does not cost an entire maelstrom bar. You have leeway on when you want to spend it. I think the thing that makes shadow feel worse in this aspect is how, unlike other specs that want to optimise their resources and not overcap, shadow is not only incapable of being efficient with insanity, the spec is actively incentivised to waste it as your insanity bar is completely irrelevant to your spell priority.
Which is nothing, from a gameplay perspective, which is the point. Also why does something that feels so “cool” do basically nothing, you’d expect the things that look awesome to BE awesome, wouldn’t you?
Fair enough. iirc it’s 60/120 of the max bar. Still it’s so high in the priority of the spec that it’s spent as soon as possible unless theres a debuff on the target before malestrom cap to increase damage taken.
I mean, sure? But if everythign affected everything in the spec we’d end up in a situation of overwhelming complexity or ignored complexity from the spec.
As far as the ‘looks’ thing goes, I like to think of the difference in the same way as comparing Ret Paladins to Arms Warriors; both do the same effective thing but Rets are covered in shiny procs and sparkles. Rets have a spec identity from them glowing like Holy warriors, where Arms has the identity of smacking things with a big ‘stick’.
If you want a flashy caster that looks great there are other flavors of ragned DPS that can try and fill that, personally I like the small extra-dps shadows that attack the enemy. It fits the class theme. Sure they can be more itneractive, by like giving 5 or so Insanity when hitting the target (which would make Crit a tiny bit more valuable afaik), for now I don’t have a problem with the proc. It’s cool, looks cool, and doesn’t need to do more than a bit of damage to impress me.
Self quoting to emphasise edit.
This isn’t a slippery slope though, this is a spec that is crying out for something to actually do beyond pressing 123.
Missed the edit while replying, sec to read.
And I’ll grant the fair point about the inability to manage Insanity compared to other specs. But isn’t that part of the higher-end play of the spec, to manage Insanity so that you get as much bonus Haste as you can over the entire fight?
Utility Spells, making sure you manage resources as effectively as possible, juggle CDs, and deal with mechanics as needed?
People used to have the same complaints about Arcane (from ~3.2 to 5.1) and those complaints never accurately described the play of the spec. Even in the simplified state it was in at the time it was never as simple as ‘press 1, 2, 3’.
People now have the same complaint about Beast Mastery, and I can verift that the complaints don’t come close to describing the spec’s needs to be played well. Juggling Frenzy stacks compared to Barbed Shot’s cool down is a challenge, and you have a pet as well as mechanics to do on top of that.
If you want complexity I can suggest playing Elemental, Destro, or Demo.
Nope. There’s no management of insanity involved. You press your stuff on cooldown for maximum damage, this is also maximum insanity per second, and therefor longest possible voidforms. No management at all involved.
Shadow single target is. Maintain dots, bolt on cd, SWV on cd, flay as filler.
If you cut out redotting (Oversimplification therefor somewhat proving your point) the rotation boils down to VB, SWV, MF, VB, SWV, MF, VB, SWV, MF…
1,2,3