How long did it take Frost DKs to convince Blizzard 2H was more enjoyable and thematic?
That’s the kind of time it takes to convince these clowns Voidform is a dog. They even ignore the outcry on Twitter.
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build-spend is boring, people like that kind of style should play a warlock or a mage
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or a melee spec since that’s their thing and they need to stop giving that ish to casters. Hated it when they stuck it on locks, hated it more when they stuck it on spriests, really do not want them to trash Mages w/ it.
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They didnt even do a rework like they said they would for 8.1. It was the same exact spec just with a numbers bump and some PVP changes. The only positive change was azerite fitting.
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build-spend isn’t boring. it’s just one particular flow of gameplay - implementation matters here. I find the ret pally build-and-spend flow pretty boring, but I fount it way more engaging on WW monk or orb SP.
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The key to making a good build/spend system is in having multiple builders and spenders.
You need multiple ways to build your currency - and usually systems have this - so Mind Blast, Shadow Word: Death, etc - all builders.
Where these systems often fail is that they often have only one spender: Devouring Plague. Psychic Horror also spent Shadow Orbs, but didn’t do much of anything in most PVE raid content. So there was a single output to that system, and I get why that bothered people.
A good build/spend system needs both. If we go back to Shadow Orbs, we need to make sure we get a second PVE spender beyond - presumably - a Devouring Plague redux.
So just to outline what a good Shadow Orb system would look like in Shadowlands, if the devs cave to our will, and my dreams come true:
Shadowpriest can accumulate up to 5 Orbs.
Builders:
- Mind Blast - generates 1 Orb
- Shadow Word: Death - generates 1 Orb
Spenders:
- Devouring Plague - spends 3 Orbs - single target DOT
- Void Torrent - spends 3 Orbs - single target, short duration, channel
- Void Eruption - Spends 3 Orbs - burst AOE damage and applies Shadow Word: Pain (replaces Dark Void talent)
Then I’d add a whole talent row of builders, such as:
- Coalescence - passive - Generates 1 Shadow Orb every 12 seconds, reduced by haste
- Domination - passive - Critical Mind Blasts & Shadow Word: Deaths generate 2 Orbs, and you can now hold up to 6 Orbs at a time
- Archangel - 90s cooldown - 18s duration - grow black wings, generate 1 Orb every 3 seconds, and you can cast while moving
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Exactly. more options on how you spend your resource more dynamic play-style. I would even through some cc and utility spells that consume resource.
with that being said hear me out you guys. What if they made voidform not ramp up but gives you a fixed buff straight up once you enter it and takes longer to drain up insanity. Right now you get 20% damage buff they can turn it up to like 30% throw a 15% haste and 15% crit.
what this would solve is:
- gives you an incentive to stay in voidform
- makes it less punshiable if you drop voidform due to fight mechanics ( it removes the peak window situation)
they could even change up the spells when you enter voidform so you’re not bashing void bolt nonstop
The most important thing is that voidform lasts respectively long enough for you to be able to react to mechanics and still pick it up.
what you think?
The problem with this is just how barren the rotation shadow currently has, is. We currently have 3 core dps spells and 2 dots, and none of those spells interact with eachother in any way, it’s just a priority based on short cooldowns.
That sort of rotation does not hold up on its own 2020. It just doesn’t. Currently its fine because the maintenance of voidform takes up people’s attention, but once that’s taken away the rotation doesn’t hold up.
The spec wouldn’t just need another button or something, the core idea just isn’t there anymore.
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After playing other classes it seems weird that it makes no difference whether or not pain or vt was on the target when you cast bolt, void, or flay. Theres no interaction at all.
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All the interaction shadow has is through voidform, but its pretty much completely one sided.
In most interactions, a button does a thing, that thing informs when or why you might want to press some other button, and sometimes that then influences something else and creates positive feedback, or a chain of interactions.
With voidform, everything generates insanity, voidform keeps going, but voidform never influences what buttons you’re pressing or why you would want to be using them at a given time. The trail stops. It goes into, if you’ll pardon the pun, a void.
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so what do you suggest are you with a revamped voidform or shadow orbs. personally initially i was against voidform and pro shadow orbs but then people keep mentioning how ret pally is so boring ( which they truly are) and now i’m like maybe keep voidform just revamp it.
make our spell have more interaction with each other. Don’t ask me how and if its going to stay remove the ramp up and make it a very impactful good fixed buff
Voidform, to me, isn’t a mechanic. It’s a button with a cool name and a cool visual. Untie names from mechanics, build cool mechanics and interactions you want to play, assign names later. That would be my philosophy if I were trying to solve this problem.
Voidform to me sounds like it could be a 2-3 minute cooldown, but it would not be part of the core mechanic or design of the spec, in the same way that no major CD is necessary for any other class to function rotationally (Not talking about performance wise). I’d completely scrap shadowfiend and PI for shadow to make space, since they’re both dull.
Now you’ve taken voidform completely out of the picture in terms of its influence on the mechanical workings of the spec, you could just bring back shadow orbs, you could do something new. It doesn’t really matter.
There’s no quick fix to solve shadow’s current problems, you can’t just tweak voidform’s current mechanics “a little” . It all needs to be torn down and built back up for us to really move forward.
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so in other words you just want voidform gone. you literally didn’t add anything to this conversation other then that you think voidform ( not talking about the name or button, when I say voidform i mean the ramp up mechanic itself, OBVIOUSLY) is bad and you want it as a cd.
I agree to an extend however this never gonna happen blizz is holding on to voidform till the end
You’d be surprised how few can make the distinction.
That was the example I gave, but it was more to say there’s a lot more work than simply removing the ramp from voidform’s current design and keeping everything else the same.
Then we’ll never move forward. We’re stuck in the loop of Blizzard trying to work an unworkable mechanic.
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well they have said that if there is a huge rework they want to patch it in alpha real soon so they can test it. so we will see. one streamer confirmed that and also said that if they don’t patch it soon most likely they won’t touch the class. fingers crossed
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It doesn’t matter what they think in a case like this. They can either continue to hold the spec hostage and watch players reroll away as I did, (and this was all because some developer and his damn ego is too proud to admit that he utterly screwed up, and wanted to put his mark on the Blizzard cash cow), or he can submit, design smarter, and accept that very, very few players appreciated having their spec deleted by a Developer with a design pen itch.
MAKE PRIESTS LIKE THEY WERE BEFORE LEGION. NO. MORE. EXCUSES.
While I have no faith in our words being headed, that’s where we are. No more compromises.
Reverse and delete Voidform or just reroll as a Mage. Then you’ll be cared for, because the Mage lead actually gets traction in the Developer meetings and manages to design things that are enjoyable for the class. Shadow by contrast is a cheap after thought.
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I wish they would do more to interact with our dots as well. Maybe while our dots are on a target and your Mind Flay it extends the duration of your dots by 1 second per mind flay tick and they do extra damage or something fun? I dunno, like someone said above, there’s just no interaction between most of the shadow priest spells and it’s boring for the most part.
after doing some bgs as shadow priest and me trying to go in with an open mind I’m astonished on how Dispersion is still in the game. it is the worst defensive cd in the game let me tell you why.
Dispersion:
Disperse into pure shadow energy, reducing all damage taken by 75% for 6 sec, but you are unable to attack or cast spells.
Increases movement speed by 50% and makes you immune to all movement impairing effects.
Voidform’s Insanity drain is temporarily reduced by 100% while dispersed.
Castable while stunned, feared, or silenced.
so it’s basically a 6 sec self stun for 75% less damage. you can’t heal yourself you can still get CCed and damaged. I think they should just change its name to Suicide. oh, and it’s our only defensive spell on a 2min cd.
guys honestly just roll a mage.
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I did, though I never played much Shadow Priest.
In general I think “channel” type abilities are fun to use. Mind Flay, Soothing Mist, Arcane Missiles, Drain Life, Mind Sear, etc.
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Ya I like channeled spells like Mind Flay and Void Torrent.
I’m a little more on the fence about Mind Sear, part of the issue may be that it does negligible damage in BFA, but even before that it’s just sort of a boring AOE spell - not unlike Blizzard, Rain of Fire, etc - also boring.
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