i love WoW. i do, i love the game. but… i hate that blizz is afraid to leave a system behind. this is, what, our 4th mission table, and 3rd AP system? just… why? why don’t they just leave that stuff in the past, and make a single NEW system? or… i dunno… focus on shaking-up the gameplay? i mean… I think WoW’s gameplay could do with a bit of an overhaul…
4 Likes
To me, I try to limit how often I do that. But when I do, I try to pull out the key points to the post and make replies that, in my opinion, need to be made.
I try to be as constructive as possible. I wish I knew more about DH spells and abilities. I would have been happy to give the OP tips and tricks. When it came to the raid drop information, I feel that my answer got the point across. 
My apologies if you feel/felt annoyed. I too get annoyed with the “everyone hates/loves this” posts because more often then not, they’re wrong. Unless it’s about WoD. 
Preach brother. And what annoys me more is that players dont hold them accountable more.
I mean they are doing the bare minimum atm imo to keep their sub numbers going. Its the same unimaginative systems, rep grinds and chores yet people keep lapping it up like its candy.
I mean to each their own, but is all of this seriously fun? Or is it more just feeding addicts at this point?
I got suckered into a 6 month sub back in Sept so its my fault too, and I am just as mad at myself as everyone else, but I am counting the days until I am done with this medicore game.
7 Likes
And I truly almost bought into his original conclusion. Goes to show that I should have clicked on his link and read the numbers. I feel like a dummy, but thank you for checking it out and breaking it down! I’ll let my wife know the sky is not falling 
.
I agree with OP. Been playing since the beginning of Wrath and this xpac sucks just as bad as BfA. It started off great and hit a wall. Dunno why people try to defend Blizz.
6 Likes
They killed it for me , I’m the person who doesn’t raid anymore but did for 4 or 5 expacs . Who now does mythic plus for gear , enjoys the open world and pvps once in awhile
, random bg’S. The fact that I can’t get good gear and push higher keys is upsetting . Not sure why I’m still here , but I imagine it won’t be for much longer .
4 Likes
Where are people getting the numbers to say ‘majority’. lol.
For me, I agree, not that fun.
1 Like
I desagree in that, coming from 2004 playing the game having time to do the quest, be able to get all the rep you need instead grind for months and months. We pay monthly and we have work and family, been able to log, okay a few hrs and feel that I got something done and be able to have a life is a good feeling been able to play my alta and not having to grind azurite is amazing.
Is the tunning of things,
Runner 6 doungeons, one item. Pvp is really bad. Tourgass levels are terrible since you start one week later you can’t find people to do the layer you need since everyone is ahead.
If the fix pvp values and classes. Add more loot in the Mythics and make pvp, Mythics and raid be able to provide same gear levels. Let people have fun doing what they like from the game
I’m having a great time.
lol said the DH
I’m right there with you on the systems. It’s so silly having new trees of stuff to level, garrisons, class halls, covenants, it goes on. Like how many times can you reinvent the carrot on a stick? A new Tol Barad or Timeless Isle would be sick. more random caves with a few levels and a boss at the end sticking out in the world like Diablo 3
Or… Maybe it’s alot of fun for people. Myself included.
Shadowlands has new rules on Loots. It lessened the End of Dungeon Loot but it improved the Weekly Vault. This is not BFA where you just spam runs on M+ and expect a loot right away. SL wants you to focus more on your Weekly Vault.
And you are not focusing on it. You have 3x M+ runs this week according to Raider io: Mists +7**, DOS+5** and SD+2**. Your first slot for weekly M+ is from your +7, your second slot would be from +2 if you did 4 M+ dungeons. This is what you are gonna get tomorrow on Weekly Vault if you havent done more dungeons reflected from your raider io page. You are the one who did this.
Look at me, I have lower IO score than you but I am trying to be smart with my Weekly M+ Vault. I did NW+8(Completed but not on time), TOP+7*, DOS+7*, and TOP+7**. My Vault would be from +8 on first slot and +7 on second slot. Why would I run a +2? To kill my 2nd slot from Vault? No way. I am smarter now. LOL.
To be fair, from a game-feel perspective having to wait until Tuesday feels kind of bad. You play all week and get nothing to show for it until Tuesday, and then it just shows up. You have to understand humans are not as logical as you think, we still have animal parts of our brain, and so the link between the thing we did and the reward becomes weaker and weaker as the temporal distance increases between action and reaction.
That’s why I’m looking forward to badges. I want to build up towards something and then earn it that week, even if I do get capped. Ideally they could figure out a way to “flip around” the Vault but I’m not sure what exactly that would look like.
Speaking purely for myself, I do other things, and sometimes it is hard after a workout to justify doing an M+ if there’s no thrill at the end for a successful run. Not only that, you get the reward win or lose, so you don’t even really need to try that hard unless you care about competing for top IO. The only time your “life is on the line” is when you’re at risk of bricking a 14 (and even then you can get by if you can lean on friends).
1 Like
It’s like this from the past. The upgrade gets less and less when you are doing a harder content. Climbing from ilevel 130 to 171 is so fast. Climbing from 171 to 184 is still fast. But once you reach 190, it starts to get slow. And getting to 210 and 220 is way way even slow. I would say that’s normal.
BFA was just fooling us. You thought you are getting many loots. But in actual, it was really raining with GARBAGE loots and the actual upgrades really drop for us like once a month.
My progress from BFA from M+13 to M+15 was so SLOW. It’s like weekly cache was my only chance… only 1 item and it has a chance to become garbage too. SL gives you up to 3 options on weekly vault… higher chance of giving you meaningful loot. It’s way better than doing 1 option per week. I remember around 4 weeks of garbage weekly cache in BFA. Good thing, I was in Classic while I only do 1 M+ per week in BFA.
I didn’t play BFA very much, so I’m not basing it on that.
I feel like you missed my point. It feels like there’s a disconnect between the content you do and the reward, because the EOD loot is 100% garbage. It’s all about the Vault, and unless the next day is Tuesday when you do the dungeon, there’s a long delay between running the content and the reward. On top of that, if you get your BIS in the first box, it also feels like the nine other runs were pointless, while on the flip-side, if you don’t run 10 and get garbage, it doesn’t feel great to feel like you might have missed something.
The “game feel” of the Vault is questionable. I enjoy the increased player agency and the implementation is probably better than the previous system, but still, it isn’t perfect.
To summarize, RNG is RNG. It’s been like that since Vanilla. I remember on ICC-25, my main was looking for just 1 BiS trinket and it never dropped to him after 15 weeks of raiding. While my alt got the same BiS trinket on his first run and got 4x more for disenchanting. It’s just RNG is RNG.
It’s not the same. The difference is the pseudo-control of your destiny feels bad. If you raid and kill bosses and don’t get loot, you don’t get loot and that’s it. You don’t grind the boss for extra attempts at loot. You also don’t grind the same boss multiple times in the hope you get good loot Tuesday.
A more apt comparison using your WOTLK scenario would be deciding to PUG Vault of Archavon and not getting anything, or deciding not to pug Vault and your friend gets something that lock-out and you missed out. That was content that was “on the fence” for you and your decision to do or not do it could impact whether you get gear. However, it is much harder to know whether you tangibly missed gear in that scenario, and if you don’t get a drop it wasn’t that large of a time investment.
Like, to be honest, I feel like you’re still not getting what I’m saying. You’re just talking about cold logic and I’m talking about player perception and game-feel. The simple truth is that for WoW, game feel matters more than facts. A mathematically perfect and fair still can be worse for Blizz’s bottom line if it feels bad to players.
It’s just most people are frustrated with Loot Upgrades. Powerful Loots reside on the hardest of hardest content of the game. And Shadowlands is way harder. BFA was arguably still the hardest of all the Expansions and I find Shadowlands harder than BFA. It’s easy to be unhappy especially if RNG is not on your side.
I had bad RNGs in my whole life with WoW since Vanilla. But I am positive that I would get lucky sometimes… just play and play until it drops. The more chances or attempts I do, the more chances I would get it. I am not expecting to get all the BiS. I am just happy to get ONE of the BiS.
On my progression, it’s a bit slow but I dont think I hit the wall yet becoz of my limited play time. Others, hit the wall too early. I am not in a hurry to reach my wall. I am taking my time. I find Retail like Shadowlands so Casual friendly. And I am having a Blast.
Imagine a product, say a hamburger since you used food for an analogy.
I order it with cheese and pickles, but when I get it there’s just bread and a burger. I complain. They politely explain the pickles arrive tomorrow and the cheese is next week?
Are you kidding me? This game does exactly that now. Imagine NOT complaining about that and just accepting your cheese next week.
6 Likes
Source?
Best of luck in your endeavors.