As a footnote, 8.3 is also rather … predictable and unremarkable so far.
We know nothing about any interim patches guiding us from 8.3 into 9.0. Its a very, very dry period for content after what amounted to … one of the smallest content patches I can recall in ages. The droughts of BfA are severe.
If the foundation is rotten, nothing built upon it can be of sound construction.
I don’t know why anyone trusts Blizzard to deliver a good story at this point anyway. They blew the last of their load with Legion.
Well, Blizz likes saying these sort of things as a supplement from actually doing real work in “enduring” the Horde. Also, pretty sure Saurfang died right after he said that. As for the Alliance reps, well … they’re plot devices being used to protect the Horde from Blizz’s own stupidity.
Beyond that, there is one thing I am sort of appreciative of in the situation we find ourself in in 8.2.5. The reason the Horde exists still is because it actually did do a pretty good job of weakening the Alliance during the War. The Alliance could still absolutely beat the Horde, but the Horde ARs mean that the costs of wiping out our Faction would be catastrophic to the Alliance. Its the old saying, “Sometimes vengeance is a luxury not everyone can afford”.
We broke the blue team just enough to make them question if they can really pay the price of enacting the vengeance they seek. Varian’s threat … has lost its fangs.
When was Arathi Highlands ever modern alliance territory, anyway?
Yeah, that’s a big plus. “Our homicidal rampage was so bloody our victims can’t even fight back! Huzzah!”
Sort of like the Kaldorei Empire did to the Trolls? Or the High Elves did to the Trolls? Or the Humans did to the Trolls? Or the Scourge did to the Trolls? Or the Kul Tirans and Naga did to the Trolls? Etc…
Not everyone gets vengeance in the Warcraft setting. In fact, many races have never gotten it; and never will. As for my point, this War only amounted to a situation where the Alliance needed to decide if it could afford to continue the conflict beyond what it is right now; which would increase the costs to them immensely … even though I have no doubt they would destroy the Horde in the end. How much is left of the Blue Faction afterwards … unknown?
If nothing else, the Alliance did make out like bandits when it comes to territorial control. All the NE lands back, and with no real way for the Forsaken to reclaim their lands … every single territory the Forsaken held from the EK Alliance up until now.
Point well taken, Benedickt.
Then they must start laying down a new foundation upon the decaying corpse of the old.
If lightning can strike once and birth one of the most popular games of all time, I’m certain it can strike again.
While the occurrence is incredibly rare, it’s not impossible.
Look man, I want to be optimistic … but at this point I’m not even convinced we’ll see the bare minimum of what I want to see from the Shadowlands; a setting I’ve been waiting years to explore. De Otherside being a 5 man dungeon; Draka being one of the two “Horde” Characters advertised. No sign of Vol’jin or his personal narrative progressing…
What I want is simple. I want dead characters being used to develop living ones; on both the Alliance and Horde. Chief among them is Lillian Voss, who could be a fantastic Forsaken leader with just a little TLC. I don’t want dead characters being waved around like a cheap nastalgia gimmick and stealing that development themselves; outside of Vol’jin … who’s path seems grander than most. I dont want Bwon being murked in a 5 man … solidifying that no PC race in this game has it worse than the Darkspear. These are small desires…
None of those involve playable factions. The Alliance is being told that the Horde can just come and burn one of our capitals full of civillians out of the map, and we are powerless to do anything in retribution. Again. The best we can do is hold on out until the Horde comes to their senses and stops their murderous rampage, and then we go back to living together as if nothing happened, minus one limb. And that’s awful.
Boy I can’t wait to play in the smoldering corpse of Teldrassil, or whatever was left pf Ashenvale, if the Horde even left Ashenvale anyway.
We’ll be lucky if we get to keep anything from the Forsaken. Calia and the Forsaken meeting in the Eastern Kingdoms doesn’t bode well for that though.
Yup, sucks to be you! 
We had no more control over Teldrassil than you did; so, we the Horde players dont get punished more than we already have for it it seems. We had no choice but to sit on our hands waiting until we were convenient enough to turn on Sylvanas; because it would have been inconvenient for her story if we had done so too soon. There is a reason that Blizz sort of just didn’t have anyone on the Horde talk about Teld, they couldn’t figure out a way to write the Horde around it while also keeping them the useful vehicle they are. So they hid them pee-stained sheets!
As for Calia, deal with the devil. Lose your entire racial fantasy to a character who’s the equivalent of the dad that left to get cigarettes 15 years ago and now wants to be in your life; or never get their lands back. Forsaken, why cant you be like you were when you were three?! And the NEs thought they had problems losing no important characters and being able to regrow forests so quickly they can portray Blight as about as powerful as a fart in the wind lol!
Those important character allegedly exist to protect and lead the non-important characters, and boy did they fail spectacularly this expansion
I’m not asking for Horde players to be punished, but it seems we can’t even touch the faction without the playerbase disintegrating
OK, then what punishments do you want? Because you already suggested that you be allowed to kill off the remaining faction leaders.
Who, btw, outside of the ARs … the only two Racial Leaders left on the Horde that were actually in charge during the War are the two least contentious to the Alliance. Baine, who as soon as the plot let him gave one hell of a gift to Jaina … and Lor’themar … who turned as soon as he was given a viable alternative to Sylvie; Saurfang returning with Thrall. The remaining core racial leaders are Voss, Gazlowe, Thrall, and Rokhan … none of which were leaders of their species in the War.
So are you going to execute them as well? What about the ARs? Thalyssra and Mayla both wanted to turn immediately, and like Lor’themar did the moment they had a viable alternative. Geya’rah is a brick, who hasnt been on the world long enough to know anything that is going on. What about Talaanji and Kiro? Seems there is an eye for an eye thing going there with those two.
For some reason they thought it would be a great idea to reduce the horde to a purple alliance this expansion, so I can’t really see them going out of their way in providing much even if only to repair the damage done.
I did no such thing, but anyway
Example: Horde gets kicked out of the Cenarius Circle and banned from Hyjal and Moonglade for life. No matter how much Hamuul tries to defend his fellow students.
In exchange, they could, I dunno, set up a big Horde-themed druidic center in the island they just got with a higher Wild God population density than Hyjal?
And for Lunar Festival, go celebrate it in the big ancient Night Elf metropolis you got in Legion?
Example: Night Elves and allies managed to kick every last Hordie left in Feralas. In exchange, the Horde starts settling in Dustwallow Marsh, which the Alliance no longer has any interest in?
Faralas is just as much Tauren territory as it is NE territory btw. They are also an ancient race, so unless you’re suggesting that because their nomadic they aren’t entitled to their ancestral lands … OK? Desolace is also historic Tauren territory. Stonetalon also has a decent Tauren presence.
As for the Cenarian Circle … I could care less, but considering there was like zero representation of Horde druids in this entire expansion; and even all of the remaining big name Shamans were absent … seems these punishments are rather arbitrary. But, whatever, kudos. As for Dustwallow … I would like to see the Troll populations start building there. They need some room to grow.
Though tbh, if the Horde was allowed to start settling Northrend … at least a lot of the resource needs would be satisfied. Howling FJord, Grizzly Hills, and perhaps even the ruins of Zul’drak are all serviceable locations.
I do enjoy that the main story beat of this xpac is to end the cycle of hatred and it just has players hating each other, I guess war never changes
Yeah yeah, now shoo, get out, lose something. You can keep Desolace all you want.
Something something condoning their faction. Get out.
Anything to show the Horde can’t just come, burn down an island full of Night Elf civillians, and get away without any loss, any retribution.
I’m OK with it.
The Tauren could start reflecting different natural environments, like the great plains. Trolls can deal with tropics, swamps, and desert biomes. And if we’re lucky enough to get the Kelfin added as Gob customizations, we could get some knowledge on aquatic biomes. The Cenarius brand of druidic magic did always come as a bit stifling on the “huge forest biome” shtick. He’s not called the Lord of the Forest for nothing I suppose. Big trees! Big trees everywhere! 
That’s too optimistic. The hypothetical horde druid population would be just as relevant as the blood elf magisters are to arcane things.
But, it would be so cool! We’d get more active participation from the more nature centric Loa! We could get Garm for the Aquatic Nature knowledge; Har’koa for the arctic terrains; Gonk for rainforests; etc… Honestly, the addition of the Loa to the Horde in a more official capacity opens up whole new avenues for relations with the natural world. We wouldn’t need to be reliant on the NEs lore anymore to have a connection with the Life domain.
Maybe we can even get an expansion on the lore for the Earth Mother for the Tauren! As well as “Sun” lore as several Horde cultures worship it.