Genuinely curious. When have the Forsaken been told “Serve or die.”? Unless there’s something very new abound, the Forsaken opening experience starts with the choice to serve or not. If the newly raised were murdered for not serving Sylvanas, we wouldn’t have characters like Lilian Voss. She’d have been killed the moment she declined.
That being said, this is is no way, form, or fashion a defense of the way the raising of night elves has been handled. The story is a mess in that regard. With a little bit of effort, could it have been better? Absolutely. However, as it currently stands, the level of dissonance is jarring, particularly because these are night elves that came to Darkshore for the express purpose of retaking their homeland from the Horde.
That particular incongruity could certainly be hand waved away as mind control, but doing so and applying it universally creates inconsistencies with previous Forsaken lore. In the case of say, Godfrey, it’d be really, truly stupid to be killed by a being you were mind controlling…
Appreciate the source. It’s an interesting read, but it also presents the same sort of contradictions we run into elsewhere. We do meet Forsaken who are not loyal to Sylvanas, and these characters stand against that narrative. It’s rather jarring.
More likely the answer just lacked full clarification since it noted ‘they are given the same ultimatum that other Forsaken are offered’ and we know going off to do your own thing was a clear option.
That or battlefield raising is different and they shouldn’t have called back in that manner.
There’s no hard and fast rules to what happens to you when you die, or how your perception changes. It’s been described in some sources, like Edge of Night, that it’s utter torment, and that’s about all we know about it. Whether that’s got anything to do with an undead being killed again, we’re not sure. Probably.
You’ve had Sira raised nearly immediately, but it was clear she harbored resentment in the time between the burning of Teldrassil and her death.
You’ve had Delaryn raised a few weeks after her death, though the last thing she saw was her home in flames, which was a symoblic immolation of everything she thought she stood for in the name of her god.
Unrelated, but you also had Nazgrim reanimated years after his death as a Death Knight. And he seemed all too happy to go back to fighting and killing stuff. He actually seemed relatively unchanged and adapted quite quickly to his undeath.
Seems to really be a case-by-case thing. I think something would actually be lost and less compelling if everyone came out the other end the exact same way.
It’s been a while since I listened to the audio book but he definitely goes to the Undercity at least once to talk to Elsa on behalf of Anduin. I think.
I don’t remember any positive declaration of being part of the same faction, though.
I just recall the scene where Anduin is talking about the Forsaken. Just makes it sounds like he considers himself one.
I also never thought you were inherently evil." “But you thought us capable of doing evil things,” Faol said. "Don’t worry about that. That’s nothing more than being observant. I’ll be the first to admit the Forsaken have done terrible things.
Yeah it really doesn’t it make it clear whether he’s talking about whether or not the capacity of evil is inherent in just being undead, and then drawing on the Forsaken as an example, or whether he considers himself in the same flock.
Foal bugs me. If only because I think he and Calia are about to be utilized to shove some awful ‘new lore’ about Forsaken down our throats.
It would be interesting if the story flips at some point and Calia starts light forging undead, starting with Nathanos. He all of a sudden feels a bonded connection with the light and the living again and rejoins the Alliance to redeem himself and “save” the other undead
I wonder how Forsaken players would feel about that?
I’m personally not looking forward to any aspect of Lightforged Calia rearing her ugly head. When I said I wanted development of Forsaken characters, I didn’t mean rule of cool characters like Voss and Calia.
I wanted more Shademaster Kiryn, Batrider Cullen, and Belmonte.
And Natalie Seline would’ve been great as a Forsaken character.
“How would the Forsaken – a Horde faction – feel about their champions switching to the enemy faction when the Horde constantly bleeds heroes and almost never gains new ones?”
But Bagrand, what if your leader was 10 seconds too late to save you, even though she was actively trying to save you? What if she carried the vengeance of your deity to wreak havoc on the enemy?
Clearly, you would be Forsaken. Because she and your deity forsook you.
I think it’s less the “what if you lost a thing” and more along the lines of, “Would it be considered mind control by the people claiming being made undead isn’t some sort of mind control?”
![:thinking:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/thinking.png?v=6" ":thinking:")