I never said that having 2 pets would be the default. Nor would it be mandatory…
I only said that the effects provided by Animal Companion could be baked in to become baseline. Meaning we could choose to call out 1 pet or 2 without having to pick a certain talent to do so.
Especially as Animal Companion as a talent is nothing but a passive damage boost and an aesthetic choice.
They can balance w/e is put in as a replacement for AC as well…
Besides, as someone who prefered the Zoo-playstyle over the Frenzy-maintenance, I want to be able to play with 2 main pets + Dire Beast(Legion version).
Yep, hence why adding in something like a shared CD or a Sated debuff would solve that issue. It’s not exactly a big problem.
MM doesn’t have 100% mobility.
And the point here was that they took MC from being a baseline ability and locked it behind a specific pet type.
The point here is that it was better prior to that change.
Not talking about tranq.
Not talking PvP.
It’s about bringing something more to the group, not just in PvP, but in PvE as well.
SV is just a mess man. Like why would someone be a trap expert and be a melee fighter? Traps in real life are for when you don’t want to be up close. They are to keep the enemy away from you.
What’s the point of trapping someone and being right in their face lol.
You did. You said exactly this lol. An ability as a baseline passive effect is both mandatory and default. You’d have to bake in the execute talent passive to do this as well, since it’s only balanced against this. Otherwise we would always be locked in to 2 pets with no recourse, since our new passive would increase our DPS more than a negligible amount. If Blizzard can’t make arcane shot worse than CS, which was their whole shtick when they brought it back, there’s no chance they would balance this in any meaningful way.
The pet purge was only baked into tranq as an effort to not only bring balance across specs, but to make it so BM wasn’t so locked into SB’s, bats, rays, spores, etc. Yet they still are default. Every class could use a defensive dispel. Every class could use a purge, BoP, bubble, etc. But why? It’s not something we’ve ever had? How would we define which debuff type it would purge? It just seems strange to start asking for something this powerful out of the blue.
Bringing more to the group should be prio 1 for whoever is designing hunters, especially in a time where AMZ just came back and covenants are messing things up as much as they are, but there is no justification to replace pet purge with a dispel relative to adding anything else. I’m not sure why it’s your hill to die on here. Especially since literally everything just has to be on the GCD now. I’d rather not stop DPS to dispel some who tanked an AoE mechanic, lose the global, and potentially have to reposition my pet, just a headache.
Adding in a scuffed lust is not what this game needs right now. Refer back to my Arcane Shot statement. There’s no chance they’ll do this and make it work as you described, or in any capacity that isn’t just as broken as last time. It lived for 2 patches because of this inability to balance it properly.
MC being baseline was fine, but we have posthaste now. It being a talent is the same as choosing a pet, in some respects. Now that we have posthaste for disengage, it seems fair that if someone were to opt out of this and take binding shot, that having to choose the pet with it would be the next choice.
Can’t have our cake and eat it too, that’s how we get nerfed to the bench and lose what little group utility we have right now, because the powers that be can’t balance the game.
I was looking forward to playing Survival as my new main to get away from something tedious like roll the bones but having to maintain Hunter’s Mark on every target in every dungeon…in every encounter is a lot worse. RtBs looks good again in comparison.
Only compounded by the GCD. Ideally for me, they’ll just remove the damage component(Edit: Obvious caveat that we would need to be rebalanced around losing this 5%). It still keeps it’s flavor that way and is still just as viable for PVP.
2nd choice would be that they just take it off the GCD and leave it as is. Less than ideal because we still have to deal with it every target switch when it does absolutely nothing but passively boost our damage, it’s just boring.
I suspect we’re getting door #3, which is Blizzard pretending the feedback we’re giving doesn’t exist and shipping the ability to live as is. F.
Pretty much, which is why it’s second choice. I don’t want it removed, I like it’s flavor and it will be really nice for PVP, but I realllly don’t want to have to push this button every time i swap a target. Even more-so if it uses a global.
I’m not a design expert, I just know what feels bad to me.
The second choice should be to keep it on the GCD, and change the damage component to some addition utility. People have given some pretty good suggestions.
Suggestions like 3% leech for all damage done to the marked target, or increasing the range of all attacks against the marked target by 5 yards.
3% leech still feels bad. Having to use a passive ability which has no direct effect on anything every time you switch a target doesn’t feel good either. Not a good solution at all. Edit: It’s like taking the baseline buffs some specs bring just for existing in a group for crit, leech, movement speed, and flat damage, and making us have to use a global for it for each enemy
It’s not about making hunters mark feel worthwhile, they literally baked 5% of our damage into it, it already is worth using. Using it just feels horrible.
I’m not opposed to additional utility. But we have an ability which we are already greatly incentivized to use, so making it be made more mandatory in 5-man fast paced content isn’t going to help the initial problem of not wanting to press it solely because using that global feels terrible.
I’d take SS or something over this iteration of mark for dungeons.
The point of making it additional utility that is not damage based is so you don’t have to use it on every target. If it was just a utility spell, if it’s not up you don’t actually lose dps for not having it up and because it wouldn’t be damage based you wouldn’t be balanced around having it up.
No, we aren’t incentivized to use HM currently, we are required to use it. There is a difference.
Making it purely utility would make it less mandatory than it already is. As it stands you need to have it on every target, which is impossible. Making it purely utility means not having it on every target doesn’t slow the group down because the hunter can’t do 100% dps to all targets.
Honestly, why MM doesn’t have a talent row for buffing HM is beyond me: extended range, HM automatically moves to your current target once your marked target is killed, HM on everything in a 10 yard radius of the target…
I mean, there are a lot of ways blizzard could change HM to actually be something fun/interesting/the feels worth, using. What we have now is boring, uninspired, clunky, and going to be absolutely horrible to press.
You’re right. There are a TON of great suggestions. Any one of them would be better than what they’re doing with the 5% damage component.
There has been a lot of constructive feedback for this ability that would make a lot of Hunters quite happy. With all of the great suggestions, I don’t understand why HM is still in Beta in its current form.
Looking at the immence amount of time so many have dedicated to provide constructive feedback and positive suggestions on the hunter beta thread; I’d say they’ve missed many, many points
Here’s Shadowlands in a nutshell: “We’d really like to work on something as fundamental and basic as these broken specs, but we really need to balance these five borrowed power systems we inflicted on ourselves.”
You want to know why they won’t make any major changes to the classes? Because they keep on doing this dumb crap to themselves. They’re like those people who spend all their time buying new holiday decorations when the foundation of their house is crumbling. They’re the people who will spend thousands of dollars on gym fees and fancy exercise equipment at home yet eat thousands of calories of crap a day and won’t get enough sleep.
Right now, if Warcraft was a car, it would be the Honda Civic with the huge spoiler and racing stickers all over the place owned by a guy who hasn’t taken it to a mechanic in months.
I thought this at first too, but they have a place for PVP-abilties, and they’re not found in the main spellbook.
Arcane shot might be good for some burst damage though - providing it still deals more damage than CS. If they tune it to deal less damage, it is useless to us for everything including PVP (probably). They should add it to the talent tree as an optional replacement to Cobra Shot, and let it do more damage but ignore armor.
Of course, if they did that, they couldn’t claim to be base-lining it, and they couldn’t claim to be returning a class-wide ability. /sigh So stupid.
The whole thing bugs me. It’s not as bad as other changes, but it does feel like we have the same class designers we had for Legion, and they’re just as lazy and inept now as they were then.
Animal Companion could easily be made into a passive choice rather than a talent-based one. They can just unlock the current baseline restriction that allows us only one active pet. Then, they can add in a passive effect which takes effect whenever we have 2 main pets active at once, causing the damage total to be split between those pets, while they’re both performing the same attacks.
Like I said, similar to how the LW-effect now works for MM. Just that it simply modifies pet damage.
It would still be a choice we make, calling out either 1 pet(doing 100% damage) or, we call out a second pet as well(resulting in them both doing 50% damage each). The actual choice itself, would be one of aesthetics. Not about damage.
An ability(pet based) which would dispel 1 harmful magical effect from a friendly unit upon use, with a defined CD, is hardly too powerful…
Not entirely sure what you’re on about here but…my “hill to die on”? Really?
A defensive dispel on a set CD is hardly too powerful. And it does make sense thematically. Just look at the plethora of pets/beasts in the game. Why shouldn’t some be able to help others in various ways? Some beasts are made of magic after all.
Again, really? A “scuffed lust”?
When did I ever say that this was what I was after?
The broken part was how you could bring more hunters to essentially vastly extend the periods of unrestricted movement for everyone.
If you add in a mechanic which prevents that, it could still be useful, just…not broken.
At this point, the increased res time for pets is far worse for us than anything like the above would be for other players.
Again, if you take into account what effects/abilities other classes have access to, then getting an ability which frees us from roots/snares/slows on a 45sec CD isn’t exactly that big of a deal.
Agreed.
I guess the question then becomes:
Why must it have something more than just the stealth-detection/prevention?
who tanked an AoE mechanic, lose the global, and potentially have to reposition my pet, just a headache.