Rogues have far too much burst, mobility and control… and self sustain.
Something needs to be done about the insane amount of time you spend not doing anything vs them.
Trinket Blind, stunned from 100% to dead. Don’t trinket blind, they restealth and blow you up. Trinket blind, they vanish and sap and stun you to death.
This game is broken.
Well rogues can’t 100-0 if they don’t pop cds, so I would prob save trinket for when the rogue open with blades or vendetta other than that don’t trinket because 9.5 out of 10 u won’t die if there are no offensive cds being poped
Rogues don’t really have cooldowns. I have a rogue, I’ve had one since nov.2004.
Currently with the crit Lego… if a rogue can get back into stealth he’s bursting you like crazy.
Shadowdance is almost always up, everytime you do a finishing move it lowers the cooldown by an extreme amount.
Rogues do have some cooldowns to help with the burst, but again if they’re in stealth with the 100% crit chance legendary, they’re bursting you hard.
Rogues can always pick and choose when they want to fight, they can easily run and easily recover and then control the engagement all over again.
The class is broken because they lack sustain but have HUGE burst, Huge Control, and great mobility and self sustain.
The class IS broken. (either that, or I’m salty from play my terrible DH and getting stunned from 100% to dead from them in every BG… but even so, you can still get stun locked from 100% to dead on a class with over 30% vers. That’s pretty stupid if you ask me)
I’ll bite. Rogue’s do punish DH pretty hard. That I can agree too. I don’t struggle at all versus DH equal gear. It is about the only class that simple to beat though(warrior is easy sometimes if they are bad ones). I don’t really think that is specifically a rogue issue though as I’ve heard rogue has been DH’s bane for awhile. Could be intended, or an accident that they left to seem intended. Maybe thats why they gave them spectral eyes. Who knows.
To better help you OUTSIDE OF 1v1, force them to blow sprints steps evasions and cloaks before they run out of dances, and when they are out of dance for 10 - 15 seconds, nuke em. Especially if timed after kidney, you really know they have nothing defensive left. Pay attention to you and your teams DRs too. Rogues go down so fast that bad CC can ruin them. Also shadow blades means CC them. No CDs and a dance, probably best to kite around as it WILL damage you some, but gapping his damage during a reg shadowdance should be healable by your healer. You got to counter his CDs, and if you ever see him popping defensives “during” his offensives, remember the game is heavily in your favor in about 30 seconds.
Don’t worry, your cries have been heard. Patch 9.1 will nerf Subtlety.
Not true, I’ve died plenty of times without those being popped. The amount of damage from opener is crazy with the leggos and covenant abilities.
its cause ur a trash player who doesn’t pop cd’s.
Learn 2 bop. Or trinket.
“the covenant abilities”
LOL WHAT? Coming from a PALADIN??!!
Ashen Hallow and Divine toll blow ALL rogue abilties completely out of the water.
Echoing Reprimand was OP for like a week, then it got nerfed into oblivion.
Sepsis is hot garbage.
Bone spike is still tickling, and Flagellation is only good if the rogue gets a full KS worth of uninterupted burst on you.
compare that to your covenant abilities there bruv. Every 1 minute u just destroy someone with divine toll if the conduit procs.
IF you are losing to a rogue as a ret paladin, YOU EFFED UP.
Rogues entire pvp tool kit is designed to be used with mages. Its the only viable DPS partner right now.
its really not difficult to quantify.
I mean, feral druids wreck rogues in 1v1’s. They are a complete wall. Game isn’t balanced aroudn 1v1
I do pop CD’s my guy. Do you just think any rogue is going to sit there while I pop BOP and let me hit them? No. They have a very strong elusive tactic of hit and run using their impressive toolkit. HOJ and slows are not going to work, and you know that deep down. Ashen Hollow is not going to kill a rogue if they leave the area. Divine Toll is not gonna K’O anyone with the recent nerfs. If you want to compare day 1 stuff, ER > DT.
Thank you for the tips, but how do you deal with vanish into restealth wait after that?
you don’t bop, u trinket. then u stun to force his trinket, then you judge and mount chase him with ur slow so he cant reset. If he vanishes, congrats, u just won that trade, and u still have bop and bubble.
“hoj and slows are not going to work”
Why not precisely? Hoj Is insanely strong, and slows against rogues with no peel absolutely cripples them.
if you forced a vanish that means UR AHEAD IN THE CD GAME.
now when he re-opens he has no defensive option to fall back on.
thjen when he re-opens with a stun you BoP yourself, and now he’s forced to run again. Or you could sit out his stun because you will probably survive now (since he wont have shadow blades) and then trade with him, and bop his incoming blind
Then, you keep urself alive and keep him from restealthing with slows + self heals.
Then, by the time his next go is ready, forbearance will be up and you have bubble,
If you are losing to rogues in 1v1 as ret, its cause ur playing poorly.
also, GAME ISN’T BALANCED AROUND 1v1
You know it’s funny that I always see Demon Hunters complain about rogues this expac. in Legion and BFA, I don’t think I’d ever lose to a rogue 1v1 as a DH. I’m not saying rogues don’t own DH’s, mostly when 1v1, but it’s just the state of the game. No reason to cry about it.
The only reason most people (I feel) even cry about rogues is just because they can’t see it coming (stealth), unlike with rets, warriors or DH’s hunt or something.
THIS IS EXACTLY IT.
100000% PRECISELY.
getting 100-0’d in a HoJ from a ret with wings, TV, Divine Toll, Seraphim, Wake of ashes combo is fine.
Getting 100-0’d in a triple condemn Sharpened warbreaker stormbolt MS is fine
getting 100-0’d from a boomkin solar beam + convoke is fine
getting 100-0’d in a monks insane pets + fists of fury + rising sun kick is fine
Getting 100-0’d in a mages combust combo is fine.
but WOOOOOOE BETIDE if you get 100-0’d from a rogue blowing every CD he has on your from stealth. THATS just OP.
And yet 1v1’s happen all the time in BG’s, and even Arena situations.
Here’s the scenario.
A rogue opens on you with a 5 combo point kidney (they can then follow with a dance cheapshot), you trinket and blur… then they blind you immediately and re-stealth/re-open. If you don’t trinket the opening stun, then you’re dead. If you do, again you’re blinded and they re-open and you’re dead.
Basically: Don’t trinket Blind, then they re-stealth and then re-open… you trinket the Kidney they cheapshot short during dance (to get slightly more dps in) then immediately blind. Then they re-stealth and re-open…
Now you don’t have Trinket and they open again killing you. (because now you can’t even trinket.)
Yeah, but at least Ret’s don’t have multiple stuns (and their stun can be dispelled, unlike the rogue’s stuns). You can see their burst coming from a mile away.
When a Ret uses seraphim and they have FR, and Wings off cooldown… you know to get ready to trinket or run, or both. (Seraphim is on the Global, Divine Toll is on a Global, Final Reckoning is on the Global. You have a minimum of 3 seconds to react to a Ret’s Burst.)
Rets are EASILY kited, Easily controlled. Rogues are not.
An exaggeration.
Convoke isn’t the problem, bear form is.
Monks do great damage to be sure, but they’re pretty squishy overall. Pet’s are easily controlled, snared kited, etc. Xuen hits too hard.
Mages 3 shield Legendary is the issue, not their burst.
LOL WHAT?.
(body seems unclear is it a complete sentence)
I can guarantee your not playing your class right.
It amazes me how some people think it’s difficult to beat a rogue. I can beat them and I suck.
I realized this guy has no clue when I saw his gear was worse than mine. OOF