/puts on thinking cap
could be a belf player who doesnt want darker aesthetics too. like one of the belf fans who prefers the holy light aesthetic. they’d probably go along with the phoenix idea. i remember being accused of trying to make blood elves look evil so alliance had the only good elf options.
Awww this means a lot. Thank you so much 
I truly regard you as a good friend of mine as well, a favorite here on the forums too. Thank you for being kind and respectful as well. We might not agree on some topics, but that’s okay, we do it in a very respectful fashion and I sincerely appreciate that. Along with everyone else who does that. But yes, we do agree on San’layn/Dark Rangers for the Horde for sure, it’s something I hope to see someday.
Haha yeeeah (love that gif), my sub expires in a month and I’m not renewing, sadly. It’s been fun and I’m happy to have worked hard on getting my ideas out there. But it’s definitely time for me to move on, especially with the trolling on here leaking in to other areas like Discord & Twitter, where the trolls have a major victim complex and try to twist things.
Yeah but I doubt they would go as far as to flag my post. I heavily dislike the ‘lightforged’ stuff and don’t flag posts because I disagree or dislike the idea, but I’m not petty like that.
Some more San’layn art!
Credit: https://twitter.com/aerococonut_/status/1452146741994672136
Playable San’layn for the Horde! Love seeing all the art being shared here too, it’s awesome 
Boogiemen!
Make people so frightened of your ideas that they become angry parrots repeating the same then in a desperate attempt to deny you!
That’s a nice one.
Love the big ears. (I said ears!)
This and the blood elf thread are the only two I want to visit now until a blue post. The OTHER one is not good for any of us lately lol
Yeah. Might be time to perma mute that one on my end. I’ll keep sharing my ideas here but I’m going to avoid anything to do with certain people. If they follow here I’m not responding.
I was thinking some more on Kael’thas as a San’layn, and had a pretty neat idea that could work for him or even whoever would lead a playable Horde San’layn faction.
If we did see Kael’thas comes back as a San’layn, he’s likely to have a huge weight on his shoulder, considering his betrayal to his people, losing Jaina, and other things. Such a road to redemption would be rather arduous and likely give him a lot to think about in his free time. So why not translate that into something with such feeling, like music?
Suppose the San’layn get stationed at Deatholme, and Kael’thas or the San’layn leader is in a necropolis floating above it. At specific times of day, they will move to an organ and start playing a mournful tune for awhile. Something akin to this:
Such a tune would echo for a decent distance from Deatholme, getting softer and softer as you get away from it. It adds to the atmosphere, makes for a bit of world-building, and really complements the theme of San’layn, in my opinion. Plus it makes leveling in the Ghostlands a lot more memorable if you occasionally hear that, find where it is coming from, and maybe stay awhile and listen.
The idea is somewhat similar to originally in Burning Crusade, where you’d give Sylvanas a quest item drop that causes her to summon some banshees to sing:
Little things like that really add to the game, making it feel more like a world and creating emotional attachment. Maybe we’ll see a “Lament of the Darkfallen” someday, which could also work.
The idea behind the organ music with no vocals is meant to you to feel the weight of the San’layn (and Kael’thas if he is around) and the sorrow that looms over them in general. Sure, the San’layn would likely stand proud and not show weakness in general, but there would be at least a sliver of lament for their situation that would reside in each of them. Music like the above I feel helps to translate it into something players can feel and imagine.
I’m sure you could work with this idea to make something really neat and memorable in the game. 
There’s no indication that the souls the Venthyr are in charge of can return to the land of the living, though now that the wheel of death is broken, who knows?
Personally, I don’t want any old lore characters back on Azeroth. It’s fun to see them in the shadowlands, but they’re done as far as I’m concerned.
I can see that view very well. I personally don’t lean 100% on the idea of Kael’thas returning as a San’layn, but I do explore the possibilities if that did happen.
You could easily just have a new San’layn character, be it of blood royalty or not, that ends up being the leader of a playable Horde San’layn faction that would still have an interesting backstory that would really grab people’s attention and emotions. There is still plenty to work with that you can see incorporate some really cool things like I’ve mentioned before with San’layn.
Kael’thas is just an interesting choice I explore because there is some potential there. As I mentioned, redemption should come from his people as opposed to party “vampires” who have sinned in life and are all about keeping up appearances yelling at him, and the idea of him leaving the Shadowlands to having the curse that his followers fell under to work towards redemption is a really interesting storyline to me, among with other types of potential I’ve gone into detail before.
Chances are that Kael’thas will just stay in the Shadowlands, and if such a thing happens, it’s far from the end when it comes to the San’layn. That’s one of the cool things about them: you can go multiple directions with them and do some really awesome things in-game.
Honestly, as long as I get San’layn on the Horde side of that character creation screen and they’re not made to be one-note evil, backstabbing jerks with low moral fiber, I’m happy. 
Big same I’m a huge Lorthemar fan in terms of who has been there for Blood Elves and the concept the Kael fans I’ve seen is he’s returning to be king of Silvermoon or that’s the dream they have and it bothers me so much
I really don’t see Kael’thas coming back and being the ruler of Silvermoon while everyone cheers and things are hunky dory, myself.
If we went with the idea of Kael’thas as a San’layn, I would see him being leader of that San’layn faction and going nowhere near any sort of power or rule over Silvermoon. It adds more to his character in such a position to being distant from Silvermoon, even if he eventually did find redemption from them. Him becoming a leader of Silvermoon again just…falls flat in many ways I see in terms of storylines.
Just my own personal opinion, of course.
It also decreases the value of the end of a characters story arc if they can just come back. It needs to have a permanent end at some point.
I agree, we really need more like this in the game, to be honest. It adds a ton of flavor to the game, and just… feels really great. It brings a lot of personality to the characters. I’d love to see more artists, writers, and musicians represented from time to time. Yes, it’s a war torn area, but there won’t be battle at every instance of every day, so free time could be used for developing those skills.
Makes sense! I don’t mind the notion as much, but I do favor utilizing the missing blood princes more than anything. I really, really want to see them again in the story. I want them expanded and figured they could be the key to playable San’layn. There’s other avenues, but they interest me the most.
Don’t forget those missing blood princes Your idea could apply to them as well. Where have they been this entire time? Are they the cause for Dreven (given we still don’t know where he came from)?
Yeah this is a really fair concern of many people, me included. I sincerely hope they look at the lore and what the community wants. Sure people can choose to be evil, but not every character will be that way, especially if the player character (like me) wants to go anti-hero. They did it with DK & DH, along with other areas ‘traditionally seen as evil’, so they can do it with San’layn too!
Tell that to the four horsemen 
And the DK hero in general. I don’t like the perma-evaporated lore in Shadowlands myself (Actually I sincerely hate it), but I wish it was like “Wellp, they’re now beyond our reach” or “reborn”.
I think there’s a fine line in being undead, and being a soul that went to the shadowlands and returned without some sort of resurrection or spell. It just gives me a bad taste in my mouth.
And I’m not talking about the cycle of rebirth that happens in Ardenweald. I feel like that’s completely different, since those beings are basically gods.
Yeah that’s really fair. Plus they don’t remember anything from the Shadowlands anyhow… if I’m going to be completely honest, I feel the Shadowlands in general was a big mistake. It just… completely shatters any mystery or intrigue. Like there’s stories where you visit the afterlife and what have you, but they did it really badly, I feel. And it feels like such a cop-out to be like “Well if you die there your soul is perma-gone”. That might just be my own personal beliefs talking, though, because I don’t like the idea of oblivion nor do I believe in it at all. I wish it was more ‘out of reach forever’ or ‘different plane forever’.
See, I wish they had gone the route EverQuest went and made Planes of existence, and yes death included. Planes of Power was one of my favourite expansions EQ did, and it would have been nice to see them incorporate the planes of existence that way. Where when you die, you head to the plane you have the most affinity for, and that could even include the elemental planes, each ruled by a deity or deities of some kind.
The shadowlands just… feels like a pale comparison to that.
Posting in this thread on this character to bump it and so that it follows it as well so I don’t have to go looking for it when I’m out of likes on my main. 
Wow. I love this! This is so neat, I’m a big fan. Yeah I wish they had put more into it too. The planes concept is great. Instead we got just… I don’t even know how to describe how much I really dislike Shadowlands, to be honest. I liked Ardenwald quite a bit at least.
Until they centered it around Tyrande, of course.
At which point I checked out.
There are no characters in WoW I am even remotely connected to or enjoy, so making all of it focused around them as opposed to zone stories like they have traditionally done in the past totally ruined a lot of it for me. I might be in the minority there, but… Blizzard is just super bad at writing characters, to the point where any of them dying wouldn’t have me batting an eye.
Makes sense ^^ YEah we’re sticking to this thread now and it’s already just a better conversation going in general. The atmosphere is a lot more calm and pleasant now. I don’t think I’m stepping back into the blue thread until another blue response comes, if any, and it’ll only be to emphasize horde San’layn.
Lol, you haven’t and aren’t missing much, all morning there it’s been about how much Void Elves haven’t gotten and how they should come before everyone else for some reason it’s gotten a bit tiresome already, especially as someone that feels like they have gotten too much at the expense of other races like Blood Elves, Trolls, Undead, etc.
