Hold your tongue, boy. Some might argue that rogue has only one spec and that is sub.
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Or… they could just bring back the old talent trees instead of using a necklace to put a band-aid on all the specs to make them actually useful. Its quite embarassing to have these “cookie cutter specs” and people live and breathe on these sim sites and they still have to number crunch away. I mean if you have gear that procs damage of course your dps is going to be higher than the stats you actually need with the sim sites.
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Subtlety is the only rogue spec I enjoy playing. It literally embodies the definition of what a rogue should be, someone that sit’s in the shadows undetected and literally blows it’s target up and disappears. In legion’s burst was where it should be, you could global a tank in an opener in seconds in world pvp and leave them there with their jaw hanging on the ground wondering wtf just happened. Vanish was on a 45 second cooldown with talents and there was another talent that made all your abilities come off of cooldown faster while in stealth, making vanish like a 20 second cooldown, man that version of sub was amazing, I want that back.
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Oh where have I seen posts like this before…
Time and time again people ask sub to get buffed, then the community goes in an uproar because it does stupid amounts of damage. Then when it’s toned down, it’s a “useless” spec.
Go play shaman if you want to see what happens when you over-tinker with a class. I promise you it doesn’t necessarily get better either.
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GETCHUR HANDS OFF MY DICE! if anything they need to buff sub and outlaw cause lets be real, if your paying attention rogue only has one spec for pvp the rest of it is memes. sub can play with fire mage. outlaw cant play with anyone… I love some random bg’s but damn I didn’t want to have that and m+ be my only viable options to preform without having top notch rng.
imagine being outlaw main but hating m+. not the idea of m+ but the execution.
(not going into details here, wrong forum). in order to get my main essence for pve and pvp I have to push arena rating as outlaw rogue because im an outlaw rogue and cba sub or assa. now, who wants to play with an outlaw rogue in arena? heck! I don’t even want to do it… this game sucks so bad rn imo. my alts have been murdered by essence grinds. its outlaw or bust. looking like bust more than outlaw. and im convinced there isn’t a single pvp dev at wow department. there cant be. its that bad. the pvp dev is nothing more than a sticky note on a tack board.
Outlaw healer is less bad than sub healer. Sure outlaw can’t do double dps twos like sub can, but i’d definitely do way better as outlaw in 3s than I do as sub.
Ranged blind with shorter cd than trinket has no counterplay. Every even numbered blind is just a massive win condition and outlaw can still burst with correct traits.
If assa were to get gutted which it won’t they love training wheels being the best specs. Then outlaw would be what everyone defaulted to if they didn’t reroll from not knowing how to play anything besides assassination.
Mage: Not Melee
Hunter: only 1 of 3 Melee
Warlock: Not Melee
… might want to read before you reply.
All 3 of the classes you listed are ranged classes and have at least 1 spec that allows high movement or requires limited movement, and all 3 also have at least 1 spec with pets that have to be controlled… making all three specs within each class significantly different from each other.
Thats quite a bit of diversity between specs, as opposed to a melee DPS where none of the 3 specs have pets to control, and none have ranged movement but instead all 3 involve the same narrow positioning… which is probably why movement rich Demon Hunters didn’t need a third class.
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The “press your buttons correctly and top the dmg” role
do you think outlaw is viable in pvp?
If viable in pvp means it’s possible to get r1 (top 0.1% not number 1 on ladder) in arena, yes.
Competitive against tournament level players playing tournament meta comps, no. It’s still better than sub in that category though. Assassination is obviously the best of the 3 at every level of play for almost every type of comp.
Roll the bones RNG doesn’t matter as much as it did in legion, the ranged blind shorter than trinket is massively broken even with grapple having chance to be CC’ed/no mortal strike. Try outlaw rmpal where you can between the eyes kill target with hoj sheep on cd or outlaw ele druid and just coordinate using your stun on healer with lasso on kill target.
Sub thug cleave can kill bad teams with bad positioning/cooldown management, but as soon as teams stay spread out 40 yards away from each other to prevent setups you fall behind. Sub doesn’t really have the ranged answers that outlaw or the sustain pressure/60% snare assassination has to not even care about goes.
That getting kited going for setups problems happens a lot for sub because of snares (sub fire since sub 30% snare/fire 20% flamestrike snare or survival rarely using slows in thug cleave). So for sub the only consistent non-tilting option is sub frost RMD and just getting a CC chain off in dampening.
Someone might wanna edit the thread title after the outlaw nerfs. 
Shut the front door, schoolgirl tentacle elf.
A dual pistol wielding stealth rogue? Oh, yes. Gnome God, yes.
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After they almost nerfed Outlaw 30% of damage. I will say the talent is totally ruined. Look at their brilliant change on Sub. Now there is only one spec for Rogue. Bravo!
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We did NOT have 3 unique specs in classic. We had combat with mandatory talents taken from the other trees. You have a choice of combat dagger or combat sword. The rotation was backstab 5 times slice and dice, or sinister strike 5 times slice and dice. If by some miracle slice and dice still had 9 or more seconds on it when you made 5 combo points, you could eviscerate. You would top damage meters and be bored out of your mind.
I agree they should be a double revolver welding class with attacks like pistol whip for a stun a rapid fire attack and a finisher called head shot when target is at 10% health
It’s not a 30% nerf in my experience. I’m doing about 5-7k less overall in the couple of keys I’ve done than I would’ve before the nerf, and my SIM has me about 8k below what I was at yesterday.
And oddly, I feel like I’m doing more ST. Had some really good boss fights in those keys where my ST was higher than what I felt it should’ve been, even with crappy rolls. And just did a heroic raid clear where I upped my record on some of the ST boss fights by about 10k overall. Jacked my parses from blue/green/grey to orange/purple/green. (Last two gave me guff.)
Look.
You can insult my family…
You can insult my class… server… or race…
But i’ll be damned if you insult my spec
Combat maces were better for PvP because of the chance for stun.
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You contradicted yourself in two sentences. If blizzard didn’t care about balance, why would they nerf subtlety? Why would nerfs even exist?
I’m leveling sub right now, he’s lvl 115, and thematically sub is the coolest out of the three. The biggest issue so far is the flow of the rotation is a bit clumsy and for a spec that is designed around finishers, doing that seems underwhelming. Most of the talents are really but how they fit together doesn’t make much sense.
It would be really cool to see sub rogues to use something other than two daggers to differentiate them from assassination rogues.
I really like the theme of sub rogues embracing the shadows, however there are so many classes that uses shadow magic that it kills theme diversity a bit.
It will be interesting since it is the least played spec to see what Blizzard does with sub going forward.