Once again I post about the Deathstalker mark + ER bugs
Would be amazing to have some communication that it is being looked into 
Except rogue is the only class in the game (outside of mage with cold snap) that has historically ever had cooldown reset mechanisms dating back to itâs original core design. Premed says hello. So CDR and the addition of multiple charges was their way of iterating on premed since again rogues are the defacto most CD reliant spec in the game.
Warriors on the other hand historically never had any CDR/ CD reset mechanics. Anger management was a paradigm introduced in much later expansions. Your argument is also moot because it systematically stems from you not enjoying the added depth and complexity of having to actively and manually manage/time vanish for the CDR.
In favour you are ok with a passive implementation which is what warriors have. Mages also have an active component via shifting which you concede as being problematic so your only real issue seems to be having an active management component.
If Sub reduced the CD of everything by passively attacking and not just Dance you would be ok?? Cause that fits your definition of âcore aspectâ of the class?
Where your definition seems conflated as a passive vs active narrative.
As someone that posted daily on the beta forums for âcopiumâ and saw the net result itâs almost sheer delusion to think they will action the sweeping changes required to remove CDR within this PTR cycle which will leave us in a band aid state till another true rework happens probably years down the road.
This is such a pivotal change that really requires visibility
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I really do think it should be made baseline. Its a nice facet to play around.
My point was more that warrior are now built around their core GCD, sub rogues were not, the talent tree had more friction because of it.
I am 100% in agreement this needs to be talked about and seen by the devs, just not with keepin Dust at all cost as opposed to an actual redesign around it if thats what they want to do
Your points about warrior still donât overly resonate with me Anger management was mostly always a choice node so not something you have to opt into same with dust. The only difference is AM is completely passive and Dust is not.
The wider difference is that AM only impacts damage and nothing else where dust impacts the ENTIRE kit which makes its removal in a vacuum far more debilitating
Yes and again till they are ready to spend the cycles and make sub work without CDR (which I have repeatedly stated is possible) they should unequivocally leave it alone.
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Updated notes.
Flagellation being aligned to 1m and tuned accordingly
itâs not tuned accordingly though
it was buffed. to keep it the same it would have to be 8 sec 8 sec 33% reduced dmg
ER is gone though
no more ER no more SND
weâre getting somewhere
sepsis back to assa please and thank you
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5 bad changes against 1 good change. gj blizzard
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Activating Coup de Grace no longer grants 1 second of immunity that prevents player actions for the duration.
Wait, are we immune during the Coup animation lock? Iâve never seen it mentioned anywhere before.
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The changes to Echoing Reprimand area look good at first glance, but seem a little vague. When I tried it, it was supercharging CP 1 and 2. Based off the tooltip, that would make spending them add 1/2 CP to their cast, making the finisher as if it was a 3 or 4 CP finisher? IMO, if that is the intended behavior, that seems really not worth it. That said, I do like that area basically becoming passive. I know some do not like the supercharge mechanic, but if tuned right, it hopefully will be an option, not required.
The tea change, lowering the threshold, is a good thing. However, I still the the general idea is not a good one. As multiples have said, putting a passive choice node on the talent is probably the better idea. Similar to havoc/mayhem for destro locks.
Interesting way to give some PVE value to subterfuge/without a trace for assassin. Will have to see how that shakes out. If shadowdust is indeed leaving, subtlety might need something in this area too probably from a PVE standpoint. IIRC, only dance has a damage amplification on it, not vanish or subterfuge, unless the idea is the 25% buff to shadowstrike from true stealth is the intended benefit.
Coup having the animation lock ( I wouldnât call it immunity, pretty sure you could still die)gone is long, long overdue, but still appreciated. It still isnât playing its actual animation unless you use it from range and trigger the charge. Not a huge deal, but still a bug I notice.
Deathstalker, which hasnât seen any changes, really needs a lessening of restrictions on applying the mark for assassination. Even with the subterfuge changes, it is entirely too restrictive on applying the mark in case of not getting the ambush off on a pull. I would still say tying it to just garrote (preferred idea), or just ambush so blindside can also do it (less preferred idea) is needed. Since quite a few mechanics rely on having it applied, it is detrimental having such a restriction on it, especially with subtlety able to use dance (~20-30s cd) to apply it, on top of vanish with currently negligible dps value for dark brew builds. Also, garrote is a muscle memory first attack for a lot of people, so ambush is mildly throwing a wrench in there for some lol. You still would have managing the mark as a gameplay element, because, in theory, if you are just moving the thing around with garrote instead of the darkest night primarily, you are costing a lot of damage. Just need something in case the mark is lost.
I also do think carnage (improved garrote and master assassin are fine) should be decoupled from stealth. Having an aoe tool tied to stealth doesnât feel great to me. Decoupling it from stealth, even if it is just rupture, I feel would be fine. Garrote historically has been a stealth ability anyway, so it having perks (iron wire, improved garrote) tied to stealth I do not find too onerous.
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Want to reiterate that removing Shadowstep from outlaw for a 2nd Grappling Hook charge is a net nerf as the skill fails half the time due to terrain pathing issues. It fails all the damn time.
Shadowstep is reliable and having both gives some measure of flexibility unless you manage to fix the serious issues with Grappling Hook.
Also I hate Crackshot and being forced to use Vanish as an offensive CD.
This feels super degenerate and I donât know why you wanted to turn Outlaw into a dollar store Subtlety version.
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- The First Dance has been redesigned â Remaining out of combat for 6 seconds increases the duration of your next Shadow Dance by 3 seconds. In PvP combat, the effect requires 10 seconds out of combat and increases Shadow Dance duration by 2 seconds.
Umm so functionally this reads as your first dance will have 3/2 seconds increased duration. If you are fighting a boss or in Arena being out of combat for 6/10 seconds just wonât happen. At the very least this should trigger after the next vanish.
What is the end goal here? Just feels worse and extremely underwhelming.
- Any fixes to the stealth and vanish bugs?
- Any real adjustments for the removal of CDR which impacts the entire kit?
- Sub just feels like it keeps getting systematically nerfed.
Why is sub getting the most neglected when you decided to make the most drastic change to it and have yet to address rebalancing the spec overall
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I am firmly against the change to thistle teaâthat is, unless a more imaginative capstone ability is added in its stead.
That being said, I actually love the CDR of Sub rogue play style. It adds a level of decision making and resource management that adds depth to the specialization. Several of the comments below are very insightful about the pros of having added that mechanic. I really hope youâll reconsider that one.
Ugh⌠I also had to reread this and edit my post. I really liked sepsis. Being able to apply a conditional ability and then have it also serve as utility was a really smart move. I am really not a fan of a more reductionist approach to a rogueâs toolkit.
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This is not the behavior, the graphic is deceptive unfortunately. Shiv = 1 or 2 charges of a buff called Supercharge. When you press Shiv, your next 1 (or 2) finishers will count as if using 2 (or 3 if talented) extra CP.
This means if you finish on 5 the finisher will be worth 7 (or 8 if talented in Focused Induction), if you finish on 7, it will be worth 9 (or 10). This process is automatic, the graphic is just not meant to act like Echoing Reprimand did previously. Test it with Rupture time, youâll see the difference straight off.
Yes, please, Deathstalker is still one of the worst tree in terms of having potential extended downtime without any benefit from our hero talent. Granted this is made worse by bugs and Darkest Night randomly choosing to not give you mark back or disapearing, but we need DS to be working with our rotation not against it.
Mists of Tirna Schyte, during the maze, those damn &@#?$@?&$ fey spirit things keep breaking stealth when revealing themselves, its obnoxious and forces us to like range 40 before going in. So many stealth bugs.
To be fair you could already play brew without Dust, the perception that Dust was required in all things is part of the problem what made it required to be removed, imo. Still a few months to go before 11.0.5 so lets keep asking for Sub to get actual love following this change, I hope we can be heard on this one.
Over reliance on vanish is a hot topic for sure, not one that is very fun to work around imo so, I hear ya on that one
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Also also;
Supercharge that makes finishing moves act as if they had 5+ CP should be fixed to consume a Deathstalker mark, and those that act as if 7+ should consume Darkest Nightas well.
Please fix those bugs so we are not stuck the exact same as ER is right now on live.
Oh and the random occurrence of Darkest Night not applying to your char properly needs fixing too~
i dunno how supercharge is going to compete with all the options in the final gate
in fact, the rogue tree final gate is quite busy
Indeed, lots of 2 point nodes too.
We are going to be going down 3/5 branches fully most likely and no dipping a point in lethality for example
im curious who is giving this ideas to devs and why they are saying âomg its amazing i will do right nowâ
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The ER replacement is straightforward and much better then.
The notes do say it is supposed to include any interaction that the extra CP should provide, like CDR.
Hopefully the fact deathstalker hasnât been touched yet means they are still working on it.
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Yeah its big hopium that it WILL work with DS!