Oh, sorry, I meant how was the 20 back and forth petulant replies over “taunt-able bosses” going “wheres your list”, “wheres YOUR list”, “but her emails…!”, etc. relevant - seems a lot less relevant when ya’ll just reply with the same thing over and over with minimal deviation. 
Dead horse.
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I’ve stated repeatedly throughout this thread that Paladins can tank, but they are still inferior to their Druid and Warrior counterparts.
Despite this, every Paladin and their mother has come to this thread to insist that they can tank as if I’ve ever stated otherwise.
Then why bother posting cynical garbage like this?
What’s your goal here? Why bother posting such trash no one cares about, then back-pedal to claim the opposite of what’s clearly implied by the negative tone of your first post in the thread. You can say one thing, but the tone you write in, and the fervor of your “anti-suboptimal spec crusade” says another.
Every thread like this gets cluttered with your trash, but it’s true what they say; the empty barrel makes the most noise.
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No goal in particular. I just like discussing things.
No one cares about? You wish, bud. Fact of the matter is many people care, which is why so few people play and/or bring these kinds of specs.
I think a Paladin in a guild called Willingly Suboptimal throwing around the word trash is quite amusing, though. Maybe someone like yourself doesn’t care. That’s fine.
Say that.
There was absolutely no backpedaling. My stances have been consistent throughout this thread.
I absolutely back everything I’ve said thus far, the negative tone of my initial reply included. Nothing in that implied they couldn’t tank; merely that they had issues.
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And I’m supposed to believe that? Tell the truth, be an adult.
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You caught me. I’m part of an elite cabal of elitist min/maxers. We’ve been theorycrafting for over a decade, and unfortunately the numbers revealed a disturbing truth: so-called “meme” specs are actually the best in the game.
In order to maintain our superiority over the lesser beings we call “casuals,” we have been consistently leveling alts and pushing “good” specs to the absolute max and uploading logs of our kills on those characters, all the while running on our mains, but not uploading the logs, all to create the illusion that “meme” specs are bad.
It is absolutely unthinkable that some filthy pleb might be on-par with us, so agents such as myself are sent to the forums, Reddit, YouTube, Twitch, etc, to convince anyone trying to play the same specs as us that the spec is bad, and to dissuade any others from attempting it.
Thankfully, their supposed inferiority has been burned into their minds, such that even those who prefer those specs “know” they are bad. Any time someone comes along and proves they’re not bad, though, we must rush to quash the peasant uprising, as it were, lest we be overthrown as the ruling elite.
… meanwhile, in reality, the truth is I just enjoy discussing things. Be an adult and accept the truth.
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Maybe shift should just delete his Druid they are inferior to warriors after all. No need to embarrass himself posting on a class that isn’t optimal. 
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Druids are better Tanks than Warriors right now, and will remain so in terms of TPS all the way through to the end of Classic. The EH gap between Warriors and Druids only starts to close late into AQ40 but whether or not that actually matters is entirely another thing. The Avoidance gap always favors Warriors but again, unless Healers are OOM or threatening to OOM, this really isn’t all that relevant.
With DPS specs playing and gearing appropriately, upping TPS seems to be the highest priority, which puts Druids on top, followed by Warriors, followed way below that by Paladins.
The Paladin butt-hurt brigade is cute and all but y’all way too sensitive.
I’m fully aware of all that. But ultimately warrior trumps all so that makes Druids zeros not heroes. Same as paladins. That’s how people like shift think. It’s most optimal or nothing at all.
Have you read his insights on classic about classes? That post was good insight on his feels of how he should only bring warriors(ultimately just not when there’s no warriors at 60 and not fully geared in epics)
If this is true, then by logic paladins are superior to druids in that they do more TPS until druids get fully decked in AQ gear. They also have the niche of being able to do massive amounts of threat when away from the target as they have a larger resource pool than either warrior or druid.
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Psst. I think Plaguelust is forgetting about that whole “druids usually explode when any of the bosses in Naxx even so much as look at them” thing. TPS means nothing if you’re pushing up daisies.
Point me to the part of my post where I said people should delete their Paladins just because Prot is inferior.
I’m betting you can’t. 
Have you?
Nice try, bud.
Nice strawman, bud.
Never said anything of the sort.
Not even close.
I’m not even in my BiS threat gear, and I hit 600 damage (non crit) every 1.67 seconds with Maul. Unbuffed, I have 25% crit chance.
600 * 1.25 = 750
750 / 1.67 = 449
449 * 1.75 * 1.495 = 1,174
I can do Faerie Fire every 6 seconds for 108 threat.
108 / 6 = 18
Three Swipes in between every Faerie Fire. 120 damage each.
120 * 1.25 = 150
150 * 1.75 * 1.495 = 392
1,174 + 18 + 392 = 1,584 TPS before buffs.
Versus a Paladin’s… 60 * 10 * 1.9 = 1,140 / 1.5 = 760 TPS.
A Prot Paladin stacks 1/4th the raid as the same class to do half of my threat and a quarter the DPS.
I also have 60% damage reduction before buffs, 14% dodge chance, a taunt, an AoE taunt, don’t have to worry about my mana, and don’t spend 54 silver a minute to do my job.
Oh, and as far as Onyxia is concerned, I can swap out of Bear Form and attack her while she’s in the air.
I can’t imagine this really being useful. The only situations that come to my mind are fights where Taunt works and is more useful.
Do you think Feral Druids are all wearing cloth and not sitting in Bear Form, or something?
By the time any Feral Druid tank is in Naxx, they’ll be nearing the armor cap and taking ~70% less damage, and have close to, if not much more, than 20% dodge. They’ll also have over 10,000 HP.
Druids will be fine if they’re actually tanks and not Resto Druids wearing healing gear.
But I thought you wanted to stack your raids optimally with 20 warriors or whatever which doubles our threat from Gbok and it’s not like Gbok is the only thing we are doing we are still auto attacking and using holy shield bro 
and yes I was teasing you a bit in that post so I’ll apologize.
You never said for us to delete our paladin but we also don’t care to be optimal you do that was my point.
That was always the point. We are having fun trying to make a square wheel run for the luls and you keep coming by to remind everyone hey guys circles are better and squares will never work no matter how many corners they cut the
And yes I did read your post.
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Nice strawman, but no.
Which does not make up for the difference in TPS, but you’re right.
Interesting way to make that point. I care about being optimal, but that doesn’t mean I care about you being optimal.
Okay, so you’re just deliberately misrepresenting me. Classy.
lulz 10 characters
It’s a stupid mechanic and should be fixed.
Compelling argument. Still waiting on your list.
i only debate with people who know what they are talking about
Yeah, they’ll have near 10k HP. They’ll also still die very quickly compared to a warrior. Face it. Druid tanks are not as good as warrior tanks in raids. Period. Full stop. No argument to be made. It is not mathematically possible for a druid’s mitigation to compete with that of an equally geared warrior. Bear druid is every bit as much of a meme spec as laserkin anywhere but dungeons.
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