Revisiting: Tirisfal Glades

Because she could’ve put the fire out if she so chose?

I suspect the real answer is they didn’t think that hard about it, and everything involving Tyrande or Elune were a half-cobbled scramble to try to appease angry Nelf fans. If Nelves usually end up in Ardenweald anyway, then her conversation serves no purpose. If she didn’t have the power to prevent the dying elves in Teldrassil from being shuffled off to the Afterlife, their conversation doesn’t make sense. “In the wake of tragedy, sent the cascade of souls . . .” = A very bad thing happened then I sent the souls to the Shadowlands instead of doing X. It seems most likely to me that X means the souls would have remained in Kalimdor, and wisps establish that precedent since Classic WoW.

If Elune could have interceded directly in that capacity, she’s got a lot more to answer for than Teldrassil. Favors to her favorite (AKA priestesses channeling the power of their goddess) are one thing, but if she could just go “lol no” to every invading force then she’s either lazy, spiteful, or both. Not that catapults launching napalm across the English Channel is any less stupid.

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What is this ‘if’?
It was only fire.
She is a goddess.
She controls the tides.
One of her titles is literally ‘Tide Mother’.

I think it’s less that the citizens and leaders were a minority of opposition than the plot needed Sylvanas to get from A to B to C, and any other members of the faction being logically consistent would have derailed that. Most writers encountering that problem would have enough self awareness to realize they were writing a terrible story, but Blizzard brand storytelling thinks irreparably demolishing lore and characters for the sake of some stupid expansion roundtable pitch is just the greatest.

Helya got done dirty by Odyn, but she is 100% an antagonistic force. Regardless, it’s more about Sylvanas going off to do a selfish quest in the middle of the Legion invasion than anything else. An absentee Warchief putting a champion in charge of the Forsaken doesn’t change that she was conspicuously missing for what was thought to be the greatest existential threat to our faction and planet in the universe. At least with Garrosh he earned his stripes and following in Northrend before he went off the rails.

If Elune can just show up and put a stop to anything she doesn’t like, why was The Legion a threat? Old Gods? Fel-crazed Warsong? Her influence is shown through intermediaries or worshippers, occasionally rituals, likely due to the D&D elements baked into the setting’s DNA. I don’t think Elune herself is capable of acting in an unrestricted manner on Azeroth, even if the feats in question would be easy for her to deal with in theory.

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I didn’t say she could defeat the entire Burning Legion, Kil’jaeden, and Sargeras.
I said she could extinguish fire.

I was highlighting that if she can take direct action on Azeroth, she could soundly trounce all of those threats except for (maybe) Sargeras, who was not directly involved in Archimonde’s climb to Hyjal. Many deific powers cannot exert influence here directly, thus intermediaries, avatars (Night Warrior), and the like.

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I know what you were doing. Reframing my argument is utterly superfluous. She personally picks up Ysera and delivers her to Ardenweald. She can affect the physical world, as she does with the Tides which she is Mother to, she just chose not to because Blizzard – who said she was the ONLY True Deity at the time – decided that she did not.

And, again, really need to stress that extinguishing fire is definitely within her capabilities, and “”“not defeating the Burning Legion Herself”"" doesn’t mean that it isn’t.

Either she can directly affect our reality or she can’t. If she can, that implies a great many things are allowed to happen that she could have prevented. If she cannot, that is a simple answer for why she could not stop the burning. Given that pretty much every instance of her power on display involves an intermediary, I’d say it’s safe to assume the latter.

TIDE
MOTHER

Whoah, the moon affects the tides? CRAZY. Let’s caps lock about it some more.

Hey man. You’re the one who apparently isn’t grasping that she can affect the mortal plane, despite copulating with a deer and controlling the tides. Now that I’ve completed my Torghast run, here’s a more complete answer.

Divine interventions
When the night elves rode into battle, the Sisters of Elune fought side by side with the sentinels, singing to Elune and calling upon her power. Oftentimes the lunar goddess responded by visiting her wrath upon the night elves’ enemies. It was even said that the priestesses could bring a semblance of the moon into the noonday sky, lending some of Elune’s strength to the nocturnal night elves. After the battle was won, the priestesses prayed over the wounded and brought them healing.[25] Other divine interventions were granted by her including:
The ability of calming races engaged in battle by singing a song of peace at night, until sunrise.[37]
The ability to heal or grant a follower the gift of healing.[35]
She also created a physical shield around Tyrande to prevent her from coming to harm in Azshara’s palace, defending her from the likes of the jealous Lady Vashj.[38]
Causing a rain of solid moonlight to fall when her priestesses face enemies.[39]
Elune created the wildkin to watch over sacred sites.[40][41]
She made nightsabers silver and black so they could meld into the shadows on a moonlit night.[42]
Elune created the Gem of Elune to allow direct communication with her.[43]
Elune provides her chosen High Priestess with psychic visions, warning her about a possible trouble or giving hope in times of despair.[44]
Elune appears to be capable of cleansing the deepest corruption from a living creature. Notable examples of this are her salvation of Avrus Illwhisper,[45] redeeming the Fallen Priestess into her original form,[46] and in particular her redemption of Eranikus.[47]
In Warcraft III, Tyrande states that she relies upon Elune’s power to remain hidden during the night. The night elf racial, [Shadowmeld], is a blessing of Elune upon the night elves.[48]
The night elf racial [Touch of Elune] provides all night elves with a special passive benefit at all times, slightly increasing their Haste and Critical Strike during the night and day, respectively.
The talent [Fury of Elune] allows balance druids to directly call upon the power of Elune, calling down “a beam of pure celestial energy” to inflict Astral damage against enemies.
Other druidic abilities and talents such as [Moonfire], [Elune’s Guidance], [Full Moon], and [Blessing of the Ancients] appear to call upon Elune’s power as well, sometimes alongside that of An’she, as well as [Starfall], an iconic druidic ability shared by Tyrande and the Priestesses of the Moon.
Elune is depicted to have some power over the element of water, or at least over the tides, permanently banishing water spirits using the [Orb of Elune],[49] and Ebonhorn was also able to use [Mu’sha’s Tears] to represent the element of water in a ritual in order to see the ancient past.[50]
It is believed that Elune granted the Scythe of Elune to Velinde Starsong.[51]
Elune blessed the Ancient Guardian Omen with immortality.[52][53]
She granted a vision to Zamael Lunthistle to recognize the wrong he did.
After worgen arrived to Darnassus, Elune granted Tyrande a vision of Goldrinn being killed by demons during their first invasion, and of a spectral wolf, indicating the coming of King Wrynn to the city and Garrosh’s assault on Ashenvale.[54]
Guided the spirit of Shalasyr from her remains and allowed her husband, Jarod Shadowsong, to relive all the tender moments of their marriage. Meant to be a private experience, Elune showed only Jarod what she did, even excluding Tyrande who was officiating the funeral.[55]
When Ysera was corrupted by the Emerald Nightmare and mournfully killed by Tyrande, tendrils of moonlight reached down from a lunar eclipse and cleansed both Ysera and the Tears of Elune from the Nightmare’s taint. Vegetation also grew where Ysera’s corpse had lain after it vanished in the daylight.[56]
When Broxigar’s hand was burned by Illidan Stormrage, Tyrande prayed to Elune, and a stream of silver light encompassed the priestess and wrapped around Brox’s hand. As the moonlight touched his fingers, in a few seconds the burned flesh healed, the gaps where bone showed through regrew, and the horrific injury utterly vanished.[57]
When Tyrande was captured by Queen Azshara’s men, she was locked up in a cell. Elune protected her from all physical and magical harm while she was imprisoned, making her immune to torture. The Highborne thus tried to starve her, but Elune had also greatly diminished her need for sustenance, filling her with the moon goddess’s love.[58]
Blessed kaldorei banners.
Shrouded the entire region of Darkshore in perpetual darkness by causing an unnatural lunar eclipse, greatly empowering all the night elves and worgen who fought with Tyrande to successfully reclaim kaldorei lands.
Daniss Ghostdancer channels the power of Elune into the Drums of Primal Might (although noting that Elune’s power was taxed by Tyrande being the Night Warrior), allowing the harnessing of the “raw, primal might of the slain beasts” into “instruments of destruction” against the Horde.[59]

^ The Demon Soul, chapter 8
^ The Sundering, chapter 4
^ The Sundering, chapter 19
^ A [59] Guardians of the Altar
^ Ultimate Visual Guide
^ [Nightsaber Cub]
^ Priestess of Elune#Cutscene at the Altar of Elune
^ Stormrage, chapter 5
^ A [7-30] In the Hands of the Perverse
^ N Enchanting [10-45] Washed Clean
^ Transcript of Eranikus’ redemption
^ Warcraft III: Reign of Chaos Game Manual
^ A [5-30] Power Over the Tides
^ N [10-45] To See the Past
^ A [30] The Howling Vale
^ Moons + Explosives = Lunar Festival!. Archived from the original on 2012-02-08.​ “Driven mad by the Burning Legion’s tainted magics during the War of the Ancients, Elune’s blessing of immortality means that [Omen] will forever be cursed to return in his maddened state at the advent of a new year.”
^ N [1-60R] Elune’s Blessing
^ Wolfheart
^ Wolfheart, chapter 9
^ N [10-45] The Fate of Val’sharah
^ The Well of Eternity, chapter 8
^ The Demon Soul, chapter 4
^ A Leatherworking [50] Make Some Noise

That’s a long list of Elune behaving like a deity in Dungeons & Dragons, which is exactly what I likened her to. Omens, visions, blessings, limited manifestations, etc. Complete with a Forgotten Realms style “Chosen” in Tyrande. Although I see no reason, given some of the blessings they were able to invoke before, that a bunch of priestesses couldn’t have called on her to protect the tree or its people instead of just making them comfortable while they were cooked (apart from Sylvanas’ narrative singularity aura, of course).

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She controls the tides and selectively makes her followers immune to damage, my dude.
She also passifies armies. That alone qualifies your worry.

A priestess calling on Elune’s power or blessing isn’t the same as Elune taking action of her own volition. Again: she behaves just like a deity from D&D. Even her influence over water/tides is facilitated by artifacts. None of that is a coincidence or groundbreaking, given Metzen’s background.

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You mean the ones who hurled a meteor at Ishtar because the King Priest said he was more holy than they were and he deserved to be deified? :smirk:

Elune passifying the armies wasn’t a priestess calling upon her. Nor was it when Elune made Tyrande immune to torture. Nor when she created Moonkin. Nor when she birthed Cenarius. Nor when she personally came to claim Ysera. Nor when she was the Tide Mother.

As you yourself said,

And she can and does.

Unther’s pantheon were an exception to the rule, so no, not like those Gods (iirc that was another quasi-setting that got bolted onto The Realms because TSR). More like Mystra, which is precisely who I had in mind with her pet Chosen that mirror Elune and Tyrande.

I’m not aware of Elune pacifying an army apart from the priestesses singing them to calmness in the list above. Tyrande is her favorite priestess, so that is an intermediary who wields her powers. Ysera being cleansed at one of her holy sites with Tyrande and other priestesses in attendance doesn’t exactly qualify as anomalous either (also an intermediary who wields Elune’s powers to some extent, enough so that the Winter Queen called her Elune’s pet). I have no clue how the moonkin were actually made, or if she and Malorne physically hooked up (both Malorne and Cenarius have ties to the Emerald Dream, though, so maybe?), and I don’t recall reading or seeing her actually controlling the tides. Most of that stuff sounds like creation myths and are usually expressed in that way in-game.

But even disregarding all of that, even if I agreed she can do whatever she wants on Azeroth, that just leaves us back at Elune being a goddess aware of problems who does nothing to stop them. Which leaves her at knowingly allowing the burning to happen. Not a great look.

To us. Not to rando orc grunt #125.

What about black magic? Has she done that in the last few expansions at all?

I see it as a small compensation for Bwonsamdi being stuffed into Ardenweald’s broom closet instead of getting his own domain. It makes sense that he’d know more about what was going on there than a being who is completely outside of the Shadowlands.

What do you want? No race have goten any of their beliefs prooven true expect the trolls. Which compensation also?

Let’s be real—the writers clearly have been changing their minds about this stuff left and right over the last few years. Probably the changes started around the same time they came up with that wretched cosmic map and then started to retrofit all established lore into it. No in-game religion came out of that unscathed.

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