Looks like another week without communications over what is happening with Ret and their vision for the spec.
2 Likes
There is usually a couple more late Friday. Surprised we haven’t gotten our weekly hunter update. Yet not holding my breath either
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Same… 
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Meanwhile Warriors gets detailed walktroughs of changes, tuning and bug fixes.
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And it seems it wasn’t too late for Priests too, since the last post for them has lots of nice explanations.
Would be nice for us to get one too… but i’m not holding my breath.
3 Likes
Well here we have it. Put a nail in it…
No comment on direction, no plan for the future, no clear concept for what the class strive to be. Radio silence the whole way through.
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/dragonflight-class-design-progress/1346916
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The only good thing is we’ll be nuts in pre-patch. Don’t need to buy DF for that, at least.
bump had it with this false ret dev bum
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At this point. i’ll be happy if they just remove GCD from horse.
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dude that honestly the elast i expected out of a full on expansion revamp, we dont get even that.
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Lol 100% agree all other melee class have a lot of gap closer with short CDs
I personally agree but if blizz is dead set on not letting it happen id at least like one of 2 things to happen. 1 give our cleanse a magic dispel again like in lich king. 2 give imancipate back.
if one of these things dont happen we will never be in a better spot fun wise in pvp. thats just my opinion though
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DK are supposed to be juggernauts as we are. Yet they have Grip (1/2 global) and Deaths Advance (off the GCD) on top of Wraith Walk. Its a joke.
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I always have to remind myself that we are the class that is supposed to remove effects that hinder our movement…when BoF is not even baseline and you can easily make talent builds without it. Not to forget there are a lot of npc spells that can’t even be removed by BoF.
7 Likes
Yea its pure garbage. The least they should do would be giving us Freedom baseline again and making the current talent a give 30% extra MS. But these devs have 0 clue. Theyd rather give us some more throughput talents so we have even less of a choice. The class tree is pure garbage.
5 Likes
It literally takes 15 minutes to make decent and not OP design for Paladins and to fix the Class tree.
Simple changes that can be done to improve the Class tree significantly:
1. Freedom baseline and place Unbound Freedom in its place - we’re supposed to be a class that excels at removing movement impairing effects, we should have it at a baseline level and others have gotten PVP talents in their class tree.
2. Divine Steed baseline and off gcd, place Seasoned Warhorse in its place and make it 3 seconds duration increase - it simply needs to be better and should be baseline as we’re the sole melee class without a movement ability baseline.
3. Seal of the Templar increases auto-attacks as well (it’s far too important for us with the way Art of War works) and is active at all times when chosen - just like Acrobatic Strikes.
4. Holy Aegis - increases armor and stamina by 2/4%, instead of crit - this frees up 2 points for PVE DPS, we’re also the only class plate class without stamina talents in our Class tree.
5. Greater Judgment switches places with Fist of Justice. - so we’re not forced to take it.
6. Rebuke switches places with Turn Evil. - to have easier access to it without going through FoJ.
7. Holy Avenger goes down to 2 minutes - so it’s actually competitive with Divine Purpose.
8. Obduracy switches places with Incandescence/Touch of Light so we chose dps talents only in the last part of the tree, also buff Obduracy to 10% move speed and 4% avoidance as it needs to be better.
- A bit more complex:
9. Avenging Wrath gets back the 20% crit chance increase - something else should be placed in the class tree as an option, what option is that to get back an ability to its former level versus choosing Crusade?
10. Blessing of Sacrifice goes baseline and put Blessing of Might in its stead - which gives 5% AP to the party/raid so the buff is more common.
11. Blessing of Protection goes baseline and put Blessing of Kings in its stead - which gives the new Mark of the Wild buffs so the buff is more common.
So in the end we have 4 extra points (2 from Holy Aegis and 2 from Fist of Justice) to spend where we want/need them instead of them being forced on us, we would have actual choices to make.
- Other changes:
12. Divine Protection reverted back to 1 minute cooldown - so that it’s competitive with Shield of Vengeance.
13. Shield of Vengeance and Divine Shield off the gcd - 1-1.5 sec off gcd won’t make them OP… there’s no way, let’s not exaggerate.
14. Move the following talents from the Ret tree in the indicated spots: Exorcism > Shield of Vengeance/Divine Protection > Hand of Hindrance > Exorcism - that way we don’t have to waste a point for nothing on Hand of Hindrance, in PVE at least, so we can reach Relentless Inquisitor without sacrificing a point on a useless talent.
15. Judgment grants Holy Power for Holy Paladins - this would facilitate HP generation at range, to help with the intended ranged builds.
16. Restore Avenger’s Shield to generate Holy Power - why change the current gameplay into something that most players won’t like? rebalance SoTR some other way, maybe grant it charges and a small cooldown?
7 Likes
These were legit my only, ONLY, expectations to DF…
-
Retribution Aura Redesign
-
Steed, SoV and Eye for an Eye off the GCD.
-
+15% passive movement speed
If they could have just done those 3 things, I would’ve considered DF to be a step up from Shadowlands.
We would have made progress. But I guess even that is too hard. 
Edit:
Auras of Swift Vengeance renamed Heart of the Crusader.
Heart of the Crusader.
Talent
Requires Paladin
Learn Crusader Aura and Retribution:Crusader Aura
Increases movement speed by 15% and mounted speed by 20% for all party and raid members within 40 yards.Retribution
When any party or raid member within 40 yards dies, you gain Avenging Wrath for 8 sec.When any party or raid member within 40 yards takes more than 50% of their health in damage, you gain Seraphim for 4 sec. This cannot occur more than once every 30 sec.
Took me all of 3 min to fix 2 of the problems…
7 Likes
One thing I don’t understand is Divine Steed; it seems safe to say that at least 80% of players have a problem with the current iteration, so what do they do?
Remove it? No.
Offer alternatives? No. (In fact, they take away any semi-alternatives, LAotL)
Fix any of the issues (Off the GCD, unaffected by slows, shorter CD, longer duration)? No.
…and to top it off, they make it mandatory by having it be the only prerequisite for Avenging Wrath. SMH.
6 Likes
With yesterdays changes, I must reiterate that we need someone from Blizz to come down from their ivory tower and talk to us.
Over 900 replies and little to no interaction in the thread.
Messages are being delivered through the general notes and are cryptic and tone deaf.
Sadly we don’t have a “Naowh” to raise awareness about how their changes are kiling the spec ( such as what he did when they were planning a nerf to blood DK that would have killed it completely in season 3).
You introduce worst and less predictable ways to gain HoPo (Sanctification, Inner power) compared to AoW. And then nerf BOTH AT THE SAME TIME because we have access to too much HP generation, wtf?
Furthermore the AoW change is nerfing consecration generation TWICE.
Less procs lead to less consecration on the ground which means less HoPo ON TOP of Sanctification nerfs. Not mentioning the trickle down effect on Ashe to Dust and Seraphim uptime.
I won’t even go on the spellwarding change…
EDIT:
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/en/wow/t/feedback-paladins/1289849/969
No, no, no, no
This is EXACTLY one of Ret problems. PVP affecting class design and making it feel terrible to play for the whole game for the sake of balancing PVP.
If what a class does in the game in general is problematic in PVP you address it in PVP only, you don’t break the class for the rest of the game.
If giving mobility to Ret is a problem because “PVP gamemode” then either modify it just for PVP or adjust the damage for the increased uptime.
8 Likes
Only one possible conclusion: they want most of us Rets to switch over to Evoker
2 Likes