I thought we didn’t like class homogenization. But apparently we need to nerf what makes prot wars and prot pallies unique and, we need to ensure all dps can have a spammable hard CC.
This is ironic because your system demands class homogenization.
Current m+ does not demand homogenization.
For really high keys yes, you’d need to but all classes can clear to the maximum loot reward level already.
There are some classes more suited to it than others but they have the advantage in other content. Holy doesn’t have a strong toolkit for M+ in general.
I see no harm in having a death count timer in addition to what we have already as an additional challenge at higher keys. There are already multiple ways to deal with a Mythic+ encounter and based on the party composition this already happens.
You haven’t explained at all how this is the case, or how the current system doesn’t. The current system has already demonstrated this. Just look at the m+ comps. Rdruid is ubiquitous, as are any passive damage healers. Tanks are now self healers.
You’re only argument is that every class would need a CC, which
A) CC is pretty much in line with classic WoW game design when CC during encounters were more common
B) CC is easy to balance because many CCs work on certain mob types and so each class can be strong in different dungeons. There’s also nothing wrong with smartly using CCs anyway. CC is a side mechanic, it doesn’t force healers/tanks to become DPS.
The game is going to be balanced around high end content, because that’s where streamers are playing, and normal players will make decisions based on what is optimal, not “what can clear”.
You specifically said prot wars would need to be nerfed. Prot pallies for healing would as well.
Removing unique aspects of tanking classes is pushing for homogenization.
WoW classic dungeon design was horrible. It was some of the worst dungeons in WoW. I am bitter because I played shaman during that time period and it was nearly impossible to get a group.
/2 “Healer/Tank lf 3 dps. Rogue/Mage/Hunter only”.
Now some classes will be avoided for certain dungeons, so the right CC can be stacked. Or you give out the CC to everyone, since it will be that important and they become homogenized.
You’re not explaining why this is worse than the current system. Having some classes be better for certain dungeons would be better than a system were certain classes are worse for every dungeon.
You honestly don’t think there would be a “meta” set up that is best for dungeons in a untimed system?
Or that some classes would be worse for all dungeons in a untimed system?
Correct and if there’s too much of an imbalance there will be class changes to help poorer performing specs to encourage players to play them.
Class changes occur all the time to accommodate this.
In any case all the best with your suggestion, I’m sure we’ve had enough of a conversation for them to make an assessment of, should they read this thread. 
Because every class is balanced around their cooldown, Paladin can have immunity to everything because they have 5 minute cooldown, Rogue can have 2 lifes with Cheat death because they have a CD, so does Reincarnation, DH can have cooldown that last longer than everyone because it has 4 minute cooldown, if they can do such cooldown every pull, then its obvious that other spec that only have 1.5 minute cds or rely on sustained DPS will be even more garbage than they already is.
Let’s say you want Paladin to not have bubble and wing and Warrior to not have massive cd like Avatar to “balance” them out, you’re basically asking for homogenization without even realizing it.
i am happy torghast will not be timed mode
So replace the timer with… say parts of the dungeon filling with Lava, or being occupied by raid boss level enemies or something. That way the pacing stays on track but no one has to look at a “timer”.
Or add checkpoint style locations where, if everyone sits around the campfire the timer doesn’t move, but cooldowns don’t tick and you are pacified/silenced. That way people can go poop or whatever, alleviating their inability to plan 40 minutes into the future.
100% the timers make them boring.
I’m ready for a tower defense dungeon or something. It was insanely popular in WC3.
See how long you could last against an increasing number of mobs or how fast they move.
I’m interested to see what they do with this. If they don’t introduce a way to challenge players, though, it’s going to end up like islands.
it is rather simple
its ever changing and they want to encourage exploring every nook and cranny… every level gets harder.
thats the challenge
Bingo i agree these timeing thing is just silly to me feels to much like greater rifts from diablo3 for my likeing lol!
That’s easy to say, but how, exactly? There’s no difference in difficulty between a boss in. +10 and a +11, for example, except that it takes a little longer to kill, and that’s ONLY a problem because of the timer. Without the timer, how do you increment the challenge? Adding mobs might make it easier for some classes, harder for others, for example.
It’s harder than it sounds. The mobs hitting a little harder and having a little more hp doesn’t make anything harder without a timer, and mobs (for example) suddenly becoming immune to CC or threat hurts some classes way more than others.
It will be a nightmare to balance.
You
A) limit the number of deaths
B) Keep an enrage timer so that you can’t just turtle a boss
from 44:04 onwards
A. Makes it easier for 5 tank, tank is way more durable and less prone to get 1 shotted.
B. 5 Tank can pass enrage timer simply because they have CDs and dont have to bring healer.
We’re talking about the possibilities in Torghast here. I assume there will be no respawn and a “price” to enter like visions are today, so death means a failed run.
For m+ alternatives, the timer (or an RPG-friendly facsimile) is really required.