Remove the ‘timer’ from M+ and replace it with a ‘death counter’

Accidents are a different issue for me entirely. I don’t get on anyone’s case for mistakes. I take issue when people who are trying to rush me, despite my routes obviously working for the 10-11 keys I do, decide that I’m not pulling big enough and they want more.

I may be misremembering, but don’t you push high keys? There’s a point where the boss difficulty starts to escalate. But for the keys that the overwhelming majority of M+ players are experiencing, there is no way to be stuck on a boss without catastrophically misunderstanding how to play. There is almost no mechanical overlap, and the pass fail mechanics are a simple matter of not standing in something. If the unavoidable damage gets too high for the healer, or if the group just doesn’t have the damage to kill the boss before an enrage or running the healer oom, those are the only real legitimate fail points for a dungeon boss. It’s hard to get easier than, “push your buttons and don’t stand in bad.”

It’s a question of which one is harder though.

People on the low end frequently fall victim to ara-kara’s last boss for example.

So if people can’t do certain mechanics, they just die.

Trash at least allows for CC and killing one and wiping (and doing slightly easier trash.)

My only real issue with a “death counter” is the idea that it would be group-wide.

One person dying over and over shouldn’t be able to eat up the entire death count.

Then it’s a catastrophe if I die once because Timmy the Tard already died 10 times and there was only one death remaining on the counter.

The last boss of Ara-Kara is an outlier, I will concede that point for sure. It is by far the most mechanically challenging boss in all of the M+ dungeons. It has mechanical overlaps, a tool kit requirement beyond just damage, and individual positioning awareness far in excess of any of the other bosses.

The pair in Stonevault is another I might accept as harder than most bosses for a lot of players. But these are exceptions to the norm, compared to trash pulls that often have multiple high priority casts going off alongside tankbusters and unavoidable damage spikes requiring cds, as well as some cleave and positioning placements. Even if you can ultimately brute force it, the skill set and focus requirements for successfully doing most trash pulls are a lot more demanding than what is needed to successfully execute most bosses. Outlier bosses aside, if someone is struggling with a boss, not making a mistake which can happen to anyone, but really struggling with it, they almost certainly aren’t up to the task of contributing anything meaningful to the trash.

Keep timer for launch patches then remove timer for .5 patches?–or vice versa? Feel like no timer for launch would help people learn dungeons then add prestige timer for .5 patches

Generally speaking bosses will be the final wall a lot more than thrash for even when you deplete the key you can just throw yourself at thrash and whittle it down overtime little by little even if need be.

Correct

Also correct. Risk is not needed and too many people fail to grasp that if your not doing 12’s and higher…+1 is perfectly fine and in every dungeon getting +1 means you can eliminate a ton of risk.

Unless you’re pushing for score but even it’s pretty flexible. Though having said that this is also a reason there is a disparity of skill in mythic plus.

LOL you’re so unbelievably disconnected from the mythic+ community if you think removing the timer is a good idea. To be honest the fact that devs have even considered it tells me these devs should be fired for incompetence. If you don’t like the timer than stick to delves.

Yeah let’s let the guy who doesn’t even have his mythic 0’s done to tell us what blizz should do to mythic+… go away bro like wtf.

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The timer is fine. What needs to go is key depletion.

Just let us pick the level of M+ we want to do when we start the dungeon, like we do in delves. Then the challenge of overcoming tough mechanics is center stage instead of babysitting the key’s level.

i think you’re cherry picking l. that’s what i think.

The timer fails because of too many deaths. Ppl die from poor performance. Remove the timer and ppl will still perform poorly. If they change the timer to a death limit, ppl will just bicker about what constitutes a fair number of deaths before the key is bricked.

What am I cherry picking? It seems like you don’t even know what that means based on how you used it.

nice try. you’re cherry picking data, because it’s obvious you’re not factoring in the variables that would go into why people prefer xyz dungeon.

well, keys won’t deplete at 12 anymore. that’s always good.

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I’m literally not cherry picking data. Nice try. More people don’t want dungeon crawls than those that do.

based on what data? not that i disagree with you, but your appeals to the masses are weak.

It’s historical analog. From playing over 1000 keys over the seasons and which dungeons are the most run and popular.

that doesn’t mean they “prefer” anything. again, you’re making inferences based on nothing but your personal preference. stop appealing to masses when you’re doing nothing but giving your opinion to someone you disagree with.

It does and I’m literally not making inferences based on “my personal preference”. When did I state that they were the dungeons that I enjoyed most? Oh right, I didn’t.

What exactly do you think you are doing by engaging with me from something I posted 200 posts earlier?

don’t deflect. This is becoming tiresome. stop appealing to masses and stop trying to defend your opinion with data that you haven’t even interpreted.