Do you realize that in Legion when teams had the option of Master Loot, you also already had the option of doing Personal loot?
You could join any team that used Personal Loot, and there were teams that did use it. And any pug group was already required to use Personal Loot.
We’re not talking about forcing you to use Master Loot. We’re talking about not forcing everyone else that wants to use Master Loot to have to use Personal loot. And plenty of us are happy to have that come back as only 100% guild groups and even in just Mythic raiding.
We’re just asking for our options back as players. Then you can do you. We can do us. And everyone can go their separate and happy ways.
Or do you feel entitled to being able to force those of us that preferred sticking together with teams that used Master Loot to have to do things your way and your way only?
I don’t think he realizes that he had the option to use Personal loot, and not just in Group Finder but with any guild that decided to use it. There’s a lot of people in this thread that have the misconception that when Master Loot existed, they were forced to use it.
What the raid leader says goes, and his officers. This is even more true with pugs. Removing master loot protects the players, and not the cliques…
You are saying no one is forcing me or anyone to use master loot, but the bottom line is, everyone would be forced to use it again, not because they are wanting to, but because the people who put the raid together or guild together want to be in total control of who gets what. It’s been like that since the begging of time. Players are greedy…
The only reason master loot was a thing, was to stop players from needing on things they didn’t need over someone who did need them. They have fixed both issues with personal loot.
That’s inaccurate. If people wanted to use Personal Loot they could have used the Group Finder. And if you want to clear raids on Mythic you need to be sure that your team is at its most optimal by distributing loot based on what’s BiS for your spec and class. Otherwise if you have 12 people geared and the other 8 rounding up scraps, you don’t clear the raid.
You areleaving out key points to make your point seem valid.
Group finder? So you mean LFR and and 5man dungeons? Right… so pretty much if u want to do any other content besides queued low level content, u must adhere to the raid leader or guild leaders master loot rolls. Such as the typical old school. A b and c are all on reserve, all plate on reserve etc etc.
Pugs stopped having the ability to even use Master Loot at the start of Legion. Completely removed. Gone.
So pugs are not an issue unless you are completely ignorant of what the state of the game was and simply have no idea what you are talking about.
Secondly for guild groups, you were not forced to be a part of a guild that used Master Loot. There were guilds that used Personal Loot as it was an option. And you had your choice of team.
People decide what guilds to join. You don’t and didn’t get conscripted and forced to be part of a team that used a loot method you disagreed with.
You could seek a team that used Personal loot. I sought a team that used Master Loot and specifically EPGP as I didn’t want one using Loot Council. And we both could be happy. The team elected and consented to their loot method of choice.
Ultimately that’s what we’re talking about here. Having the agency and ability to choose what suits you best. When all options are open, players have the freedom to pick what they like best, and join like minded teams of players and everyone can be happy. When personal loot only is forced, whole swaths of the player base that preferred having master loot are left gettting shafted by what they view as an inferior and crappy feeling loot system.
And your view on why master loot was needed is just flat out wrong. It existed so players had a choice of how to go about gearing their team. Forcing personal loot has broken that.
What? No. I mean the Group Finder. You know what that is right? The tool that allows you to join any group for pvp, island expos, M+, and yes raids regardless of the server that you’re on?
Bro I don’t think you know what I’m talking about.
Stopped reading after the 2nd and 3rd paragraph because as usual, you and others can’t refrain from name calling or implying people of being ignorant because my opinion differs from yours.
On top of that, your 2nd and 3rd paragraphs make no sense in response to what I wrote, especially since I am talking about if master loot was reimplemented tomorrow, the effects it would have on the raiding community like it used to have.
Keep banging your head on the keyboard though. I won’t be responding to u again.
Look, I’m not namecalling. Ignorance has a defined meaning and is part of the language for a purpose. It’s not a derogatory statement, it’s simply as it’s definition indicates, you are lacking knowledge or information.
That is clear from your statements above. Pugs did not have Master Loot in almost 3 years at this point. Yet you cited them as a problem.
Legion solved that. The discussion here in this thread is about the title: “Remove force personal loot in guild raids”.
Guild raids. We’re not asking for Master Loot to come back for pugs, I have yet to see anyone in this thread asking for that. I know I certainly haven’t. I was 100% fine with Master Loot going away for pugs back when it happened.
So why did you bring it up? That shows you have a lack of knowledge in this issue. You’re complaining about something that isn’t an issue, wasn’t an issue since Legion, and no one here is asking for as though its some kind of valid reason for not allowing guild groups to utilize Master Loot when all of their members consent to it.
If you are going to make false statements and expose yourself as not understanding the issue at hand, expect people are going to call you on it. That’s not name calling. It’s simply pointing out that you do not have your facts straight.
The removal of choice was just terrible. I get why they did it because I’m sure their GMs got flooded with tickets thinking they got ninja’d, but it’d be interesting if people just complained because they didn’t get an item they wanted.
It’s crazy to me to see that people still use the “oh the guild leader would give items to his GF” or something like that. Well if they did do that, find a better guild. Those guilds aren’t going to live that long if that stuff happened on a regular basis. I’ve left guilds where I didn’t agree with their loot process when I couldn’t even use the item that dropped.
Unfortunately, i just don’t think they’ll go back to ML at all, which sucks.
Their posts were essentially: Give us options.
Your rebuttals were: If ML comes back there won’t be any options.
Your rebuttal is illogical. In Legion (what they’re asking for), you had the option to be in a PL guild or a ML guild. If you don’t like ML, then don’t join a team that uses ML. Join a team that uses PL. There were plenty available.
As for pugs… they’re an entirely different animal. In WoD, pugs were allowed free rein of ML… and they abused the crap out of it… Reserve runs (All plate reserved! DK Tier reserved!)… Ninja RLs… etc… etc… etc… Rightfully… bliz took ML away from the pug community. It’s too easy to abuse and too anonymous for players to be held accountable. In Legion, it had to be an 80% guild run for ML to even be an option (I’d be fine with this turning into 100%).
If you sign up for a guild, that expressly states that they wish to use ML… then complain about ML… That’s sorta on you at that point. If your RL tries to act like a little trumped up tyrant and tries to force everyone to use ML… Then simply leave the guild. I don’t know why you’d want to play with someone who’d abuse you that way anyway…
It’s decisions like that that stopped me from trying anymore in PvE. And with the decision to continue ignoring PvP players on the vendor with bad class design means that I will just stop playing retail all together once Classic comes out. I’ll dabble in 9.0 but if it’s another misfire then it’s another xpac that I’ll be clocked out on.
back in the day I had the time to play and make raids and they ran the DKP system and it worked fine as long as leadership stuck to thier guns… Im sorry for other people who chose to make thier bed differently and get married or go to school or start another job or have other self imposed responsibilities… I chose a guild for dkp system and dedicate myself to a routine so that I can perform well in a raid and be an asset… but it takes time away from rl =s should not the “workhorses” in a raid be rewarded for thier work or should the casual player that has more rl responsibilities and cant raid often be outfitted before everyone else thats already died 100x learning the mechanics ?
Because it doesn’t when you have an organized group of people who raid together every week.
Sockets and secondary stats often make lower item level gear better than higher item level gear, but the loot trade system is based purely on ilvl. So pieces go to waste because they cant be traded.
Happens pretty much every raid night. And I’ve seen it happen way more often than the alleged loot shenanigans that apparently plague organized groups in this game.
