huh? who’s running to the moderators? this is a great discussion. some are more on point than others. you ok there my drunken dwarf? lol
What “future interests”? Gilneas’s future interest is in not getting conquered, and the Forsaken are one of the only major factions that might be inclined to be a threat. Turtling up and being a hermit kingdom didn’t work for Gilneas before and there’s no reason to think that changed. And conquering the Forsaken is clearly not in the cards now.
So, they need to be allies, and alliances are built on cooperation, not benign neglect. A neighbor you never interact with is one you probably wouldn’t think much about offending or even attacking. A neighbor that you have a history of cooperation with is one you’re much more likely to remain friends with, for both sentimental and practical reasons.
It’s like why the US has bases in NATO countries that are perfectly capable of defending themselves, like the UK and Germany. They don’t need the US to be there, and US interests don’t need them to be there, but because they are there carrying out joint missions and exercises, the bond between allies grows stronger.
Even if the Gilneans didn’t need Forsaken help to retake Gilneas, it’s better that they went to the effort of inviting them, because it will put them on a better diplomatic footing going forward. It will make both the Forsaken people and the Gilnean people less likely to want to continue the conflict between them - which was enormously damaging to both sides - and strengthens both of their security.
Diplomacy is not a zero-sum game, certainly not between just two nations. Tess did not pursue Gilneas’s narrow interests at the expense of the Forsaken’s, but by strengthening the ties between their nations, she’s put Gilneas in a better position on the world stage.
Who is trying to figure out the logic of things after the fact? if you read what i am saying carefully, you will realize what i’m saying makes sense.
we were chased from our homeland.
we were abandoned to our fate.
we had to deal with demons running the show. we overcame that. we continued to be attacked.
zero overtures from the alliance to help us pursue the right path as they see it.
the alliance teams up with the horde, what 12 times counting this latest romp in the dragon isles?
the undead continue to squat on our capital.
we want it back.
not sure this is clear enough?
Same as any religious cult does in the real world, think of it like Mormons and suddenly you understand how they work and get people.
The thing is, the Forsaken aren’t really a threat as of the start of the battle. They haven’t held Gilneas since King Varian evicted them. Calia had negotiated the non-aggression pact. Tess clearly has a friendly relationship with them through her Uncrowned back channels. The Scarlets, on the other hand, are actively occupying her land and conspiring to kill her people. Those are the hearts and minds she should care about, and as a fully human Gilnean, she’s in a unique position to win them over to a peaceful resolution. Instead, she sides with the Forsaken, further feeding their hatred, encouraging their conspiracy theories that actually aren’t even theories at this point, and undoubtedly fueling their recruitment propaganda for as long as she is still on the throne. It was a mistake.
Mormons haven’t been militant for quite some time, but then there was the Mountain Meadows Massacre, so I see your point.
Im surprised that this post hasn’t been taken down yet, because people analog your scarlet crusade to real life racism.
I made a post about how I thought big kinook (the azure span cooking event guy) was actually kidnapping people and taking them to a secret underground tuskarr tacklebox factory which wouuld explain why there are thousands of them around dragon isles, and that got taken down. It was a joke post but the whiny crybabies of the forums got offended and it was removed.
The Scarlet Crusade propaganda actually refers to “pure bloods” and is explicitly written as racist messaging. Calling them racist is something the game does, so I’m not sure why the mods would have an issue with it here. Making up weird tuskarr trafficking stories is something else, though.
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ok
you are much more eloquent than i am. and though it is not lost on me that you aren’t siding or approving of us, you do see what I am saying. The Gilneans made a mistake siding with them. The only way to finally when us over is to at the very least stop inviting them over for dinner.
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No, of course not. But Tess is not concerned about this battle. Tess is concerned for the long-term security of the nation. The time to become friends with the Forsaken is now, while they’re weak - frankly, while both sides are weak. If she leaves it until later it will be too late. A strong, resurgent Forsaken nation with no ties to Gilneas is a threat. A resurgent Forsaken nation with a history of cooperating with a friendly kingdom on their borders is less of a threat.
Good heavens, why? They’re clearly not going to be dissuaded by mere words. They’ve worked themselves into a propagandistic frenzy sufficient to get them to march from their own country to the ruins of another country just to prevent a third country from possibly putting someone on its throne. That’s not going to go away because of a speech or two.
What Tess needs, and what Tess did, is to be diplomatic to people who are vaguely capable of receiving that diplomacy, who are still undecided on the future of Gilneas. Not the ones who have already made up their mind. You might as well try to diplomatically convince a wolf that smells tauren burgers.
So? Nobody listens to cult recruitment propaganda because it makes sense. They listen because their lives are miserable and hopeless and they need something, anything to fill that void. (See e.g. literally everything the Twilight’s Hammer has ever said or done.) If the Scarlets continue to win converts in Gilneas, it will not be because the Gilnean leadership failed to refute their arguments in a well-reasoned debate, it will be because that leadership failed to make a country worth belonging to.
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Omg no not a Scarlet Role Player 
Casual reminder, Scarlet Crusade have never been the good guys, nor will they ever be the good guys.
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I think this line sums it up pretty well.
It’s fine when it’s in game, cause they’re in-character and such, but when they bring it onto a real life platform like the forums, it’s weird.
And no, I’m not referring to LARPers, that’s different.
To be fair, you’re cutting out a very important part of my post. Scarlet RPers are strange. I’m a Roleplayer, and I don’t do stuff like this.
I was not talking about you mate.
Should see them live, on RP servers.
The collective REEEEEEEing from people at their existence is palpable, but Scarlet RPers also tend to be insufferable.
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They’re the Washington Generals of Warcraft. 
Oh I do see them all the time. And every time their characters aren’t universally loved they start complaining oocly.