Let’s not even talk about guild perks which were utterly crushing to small social guilds.
Or merging 10 and 25 mans and killing a lot of play that allowed mingling between progression raiders and more casual players. And causing a ton of strife in guilds.
No. We did NOT ask for changes made to old xpacs. That is a recent malignant faction in the community.
We only ever asked to replay the xpacs we liked instead of retail. The SAME service pservers gave except on official servers. Not some Frankenstein version of wrath or whatever you newcomers are trying to shove down our throat.
Changing wotlk/other xpacs until it fits your preferences was NEVER the reason classic was fought for or came about. It was about an honest recreation of the game we missed so we could replay it instead of retail/pservers
Wotlk is not vanilla. Sorry. It makes changes to the game that you dont like, ok, but its other peoples favorite xpac so who are you to change it? We got vanilla and tbc with its systems and now its time for wotlk and its systems.
Que bgs anywhere, dual spec, and yes LFD are wotlk systems (not content) that are synonymous with wotlk. Wotlk made changes that lead to where we are on retail, yes, but people who love wrath want wrath. You want to make a ton of changes then wait for SOM wotlk. Instead youre trying to change / ruin an xpac people have been waiting over a decade for.
I got spammed with the “WALL OF NO” for years and years and years so dont tell me what classic came about from. It wasnt “change the old xpacs till i like them”. We just wanted to replay vanilla onward again because we enjoyed them over retail & unsubbed cuz pservers provided this and blizzard didnt but we wanted blizzard to. Now theyve done it & you want to change everything b4 we even get to play it again lol wait for SOM & shaddap.
The move to 20 man only probably did more harm then we’ll ever know.
Do you remember when the 20man change happened off the top of your head? WoD or later?
They changed it during wod prepatch.
The lack of server community can be squarely pinned on the fact that realm populations have ballooned to absolutely ludicrous heights. 5,000+ active players in a single faction is way too big for an individual to have a sense of community permanence.
It’s literally only because of server population that the LFG channel is spammed so quickly and why you might never see the people you played with again once you leave group. Blizzard has propped up these grotesquely enormous servers by keeping layering in the game, and at the end of the day, it’s not really much different than connected realms or cross-realm zones. At this point, I think bringing back sharding would probably be healthier for the community than layering is.
If you play on a smaller server, you’ll see a much stronger sense of community. The biggest realms are just way too big.
What evidence have you seen that “masses” of any kind have quit the game? TBC Classic’s population doesn’t seem very different from Vanilla Classic, and TBC has always been the least popular version of the game (of the first 3 eras) for private server communities.
Why do people keep saying that TBC Classic is dead or that people have quit? Where’s the evidence?
Dungeon finder is just one of many things that is harmful to the community aspect of the game. Anyone who thinks it is the sole community-killing aspect of Retail is just dense. But I don’t think there are really many people here saying that dungeon finder alone did that.
Insisting that everyone who disagrees with you is X/Y/Z cartoonish bad guy isn’t a good look for you. I am none of those things and I hope dungeon finder is never implemented in anything with the Classic tag, even if they continue moving forward through WoW’s history.
I’d also like to point out that I dislike those things as well, though common ground probably seems impossible for you.
Did they ever say they were going to revamp the tool for TBC Classic? If so, I missed any announcements they may have made on the topic. Anyways, the stuff they’ve talked about on revamping the tool in Wrath seems pretty concrete.
I thought we’ve already addressed this – Sub counts don’t give us anywhere near enough information to glean any knowledge about dungeon finder specifically. If for some reason you did want to do that, the only thing we could say for certain is that the sub count remained stagnant when dungeon finder was released and then went into freefall.
But again, there’s no point in trying to find any arguments for or against dungeon finder in the sub count. There’s not enough data.
Did I say it helped with no doubt, or kinda plays in it favor…
But seems it didn’t hurt it at all…
They did prior to launch, once, and then never spoke of it again.
It’s not like the LFG tool is any more social than LFD, click button, get group, kill dungeon, leave. It’s up to the people to be social.
We wouldn’t need an addon if we could actually read LFG chat instead of reading about 12 mages boosting and 20 GDKPs going on.
It’s what they’ll do to wrath classic because they are too lazy to make the retail LFG tool not show ilvl and put it in wrath.
Not exactly, no. Some people have been wanting the RDF throughout classic - at least in TBC. Blizzard announced that they were going to implement the LFG interface and then eventually did so. The same exact one that was in TBC originally that nobody really liked and eventually was improved.
I have no doubt that at some point in Wrath Classic they will gives us something very close to the group finder that is used in retail but limited in scope to fit whatever their new weird vision of a “classic community” is. What is frustrating is that they’ve basically left well enough alone for years and now suddenly they want to start monkeying around with things. Particularly since they’re planning on making changes that quite a lot of us absolutely do not want.
Do you mean concurrent players? The average server back in Vanilla/TBC had more than 5,000 subscribed players per faction.
A community where no one talks in all the groups I have pugged on Benediction…real social community we have here…
The community is harmful to the community aspect of the game.
You mean the same people who quit after phase 2? Or the people who support buying gold? Or are you talking about the people who engaged in cross faction communication to setup world buffs and make cross faction agreements for bug farming during the War Effort?
The only way to save the community is to ensure there is no community at all.
Can’t have a toxic community if there is no community:
Now that is something I have every confidence the current dev’s do have the talent to do and could pull of…
You know what? Let’s talk about Guild Perks. Let’s talk about how the developers of the most successful MMORPG still haven’t found other ways to incentivize guilds other than just - that’s who you raid with. Or not.
Like, ok, they tried Guild perks and that was ultimately unsuccessful. I get it. But that was like ten years ago, nobody has had any other ideas since? Garrisons bombed (because of course they did!) and players are still asking for Guild Halls and … crickets. I mean, City of Heroes (and Villains) had Super Bases and they got shut down ten years ago. No, I don’t think there’s any causal effect there.
Like, instead of Guild experience, maybe give some kind of perks based on Achievements. Or Guild Talent trees where the GM gets to choose to put points into increased chance for bonus rolls or Rare>Epic quest reward upgrades or something.
Make the in game voice chat allow to use if for the guild chat so it’s not limited to 5 players.
Something, anything.
I actually liked Guild perks =(, my guild wasn’t particularly large at the time yet we still unlocked the majority of them. I think if they reversed the power scaling of the perks (I.e. give the most powerful perks first followed by the minor ones) it would help to keep smaller guilds together.
I think mythic+ ruined it more compared raid finder. Why raid when you can get better dungeon loot?