PvP gearing is bad and not fun (HELP)

I think WoD's gearing system was better than Legion's gearing system, but I still never really saw the incentive to keep playing after you finished that season's set. Sure, I kind of enjoyed playing a bunch of characters, but that's really the only reason why I played a bunch of different ones - because it felt like there wasn't much left to accomplish after the set was done for one, so I'd just start over with the next.

I'm not even sure how they would have transitioned WoD's gearing system into legion given that the rest of the game rewards gear completely randomly and gear vendors with guaranteed item levels at current tier just doesn't fit with that. You'd also run into a bunch of dillemas involving secondaries and item levels, since you don't get to choose the secondaries on the gear that drops in world content or m+. So they'd likely have to make your current season's pvp gear set ilevel at current LFR level and make it scale to heroic level inside of instanced pvp or something (since you got to pick the best secondaries). But then you would have a set of gear that changes ilevel and then also a template that then changes your stats based on that ilevel, and you'd be even more gimped in world or pve content. I don't think any of that would increase incentive to pvp in the current environment. I think participation would be just as bad if not worse had they kept WoD's system.

Having gear that was only accessible at a certain rating was always the carrot on the stick for me to want to tryhard and increase rating back in bc, wotlk, and cata. I think the progressively increasing ilevel reward based on your rating solves that because you always have a potential upgrade and you know higher rating = better gear, but the follow through on the system just isn't there. For all of that to work, the item levels need to be on par with the rest of the current content or it's still just as irrelevant as before. Here's my best crack at an idea that attempts to bridge the gap between old and new systems to maybe get the best of both worlds:

What if prestige was seasonal and you received more honor per win the higher rated you were. Your available drops go up in ilevel as you increase prestige. Make the honor gains scale exponentially with rating such that you couldn't just spam a bunch of low level games and feasibly get super high ilevel.

Then, instead of having gear randomly drop for you, you have a currency that drops from wins and issued to you when you increase prestige rank. This currency could be a token that matches the little emblem thing that you already have for each prestige rank and each higher rank of this currency rewards you an upwardly scaling base ilevel piece of gear when you trade it in. You take this currency to a vendor who either gives you a piece of gear or a loot box with a piece of gear in it.

Maybe if they don't want it to be an exact trade (i.e. let you pick what piece of gear you want), you would get to pick from a loot box that has a weapon that costs x number of coins, a box that has a chest/legs/helm/gloves/shoulder that costs y number of coins, a box with belt/boots/bracers/back that costs z number of coins, or a box with neck/ring/trinket that costs the least number of coins. That way there's still some element of randomness, but you're not trading the same amount of currency for a weapon or chest that you'd be trading for a pair of bracers or a ring. They'd also need to make sure that the ilevel tiers per prestige rank are similar to the item level of gear you'd be getting from equivalent pve content.

Add on top of this the ability to get some kind of marginal yet non-negligible honor gain from a daily random bg, pvp world quest thing (bfa) suitable for your prestige level to incentivize mild participation in all of the other pvp content for players across the spectrum of skill/rating. Just my best crack at a go-forward idea that might be better but not exactly "earn points + trade points for gear".
01/11/2018 01:41 PMPosted by Lothlòria
Been a while since I did any areas (due to many toons with sub-par gear therefore, I cannot put out enough DPS to live long) but I don't recall every win dropping gear.


Oh thought you meant BGs since you said 870 gear.. idk what arena drops but I don't think you get gear after every win there.
01/11/2018 02:54 PMPosted by Jugajr
01/11/2018 01:41 PMPosted by Lothlòria
Been a while since I did any areas (due to many toons with sub-par gear therefore, I cannot put out enough DPS to live long) but I don't recall every win dropping gear.


Oh thought you meant BGs since you said 870 gear.. idk what arena drops but I don't think you get gear after every win there.


No you were right, I meant BGs. When I used to arena (I don't, can't find a regular player for 2s) I didn't recall stuff dropping after every win :)
Just bring back pvp gear vendors again. Make pvp great again. Make BfA “pvp expansion”
What if prestige was seasonal and you received more honor per win the higher rated you were. Your available drops go up in ilevel as you increase prestige. Make the honor gains scale exponentially with rating such that you couldn't just spam a bunch of low level games and feasibly get super high ilevel.

Then, instead of having gear randomly drop for you, you have a currency that drops from wins and issued to you when you increase prestige rank.


Only reason why this wouldn't work is because people would find a way to cheat the system. Players would queue in Arena or BGs (Bot if need be) and play 100 games at 1500 rating and be higher "prestige" then those who do 10 games at 2500 rating.

Even though higher rating would reward more honor, you'd still face players who are 1500 being as geared, or more geared, than 2500 rated players. It's adding more unto a system that already works off rating levels.

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In MoP and a little bit of WoD, players felt like they could customize their gear more for pvp situations. But in reality, there wasn't much to customize.

The PvP gear on the vendor had set stats, like we weren't putting the stats on this gear. My helm had haste/mastery on it, and I had to wear it for the 4 piece. And the 4 piece was too good to not use. My best stats were Mastery/haste.... so I bought the mastery/haste belt, boots and bracers.

There wasn't RNG stats on PvP gear, and I feel like people are forgetting that. I had the Haste/mastery honor belt and on the 8th week of the season, after I farmed out my conquest points I bought the haste/mastery PvP conquest belt.

Yes, you could socket your gear differently, but sockets gave a slight adjustment to gear overall. If you had 3 stam gems and 3 str gems, you really were only changing your char by 4-6%. Sockets, while giving the illusion of customization, really didn't change your gear that much.

"NO!!!! I gem'd full stam and my health increased by 15%!!!!!" - random forum poster 2k18

Okay, well how about that +10% stam talent we have... isn't that like gemming full stam???

Point being, Blizzard can give you that same 'feeling' of changing sets in talents. And if you were the rogue with 3 crit gems, an int meta gem, a few haste enchants, and rocket launcher glove enchant... well you were probably doing it wrong.

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Also remember, you were only getting 1-2 pieces of loot, depending on rating, each week. For the majority of WoW PvPers, it was one. I mean, the RNG system kindof sucks... but its kindof nice to get more than 1 piece of gear a week.

The only benefit of this old gearing system was giving a carrot on a stick, on a weekly conquest cap, to players. Since you were only getting 1 item a week, it felt terrible to miss a week's worth of 10 games. It felt more like playing for conquest then playing for fun. (Not to mention felt kindof bad if someone wanted to skip an alt one week)

The point is the gearing system from previous expansions weren't the best.

In Legion the way gear is given isn't terrible, the foundation is there, but the delivery isn't.

First, item level needs to increase and scale with rating. We all get that. A mythic raider shouldn't have a higher template in PvP then a 2800 rated player.

Second, the mandatory versatility stat on PvP gear needs to be removed. Versatility means nothing in a templated PvP system, in outrageous WPvP damage, and is terrible stats for most specs in PvE encounters.

Third, while under 2000 rating, loses in arena need to award 2 Echoes of Battle and wins in arena below 2000 need to reward 5 Echoes of Battle. This will give players who go 12-7 a chance to purchase a piece of their tier from the Vendors in Dalaran. This will help players achieve their Xmog set. The Echoes of Battle gear from these vendors are set at 915 item level to ensure no 0-10000 exploit farming. It is set at LFR level. (I mean really, if you want to lose 75 games in a row to by 2 items.... I guess)

Forth, while over 2000 rating, loses in arena award 5 Echoes of Domination and wins in arena above 2000 rating need to reward 15 Echoes of Domination. This will give players who go 4-3 a chance to purchase a piece of their tier from the Vendors in Dalaran. This will help players achieve their Xmog set. The Echoes of Domination gear from these vendors are set at 930 item level. It is set at Heroic Raid item level. (45 consistent wins to get fully xmog)

Disenchanting PvP gear now rewards the Obliterum crap instead of additional Echoes of Battle.

Fifth, something to consider as an added bonus to PvPers for random BGs. Add a new buff to the Random BG template that increases your primary stat by your current 3v3 rating. A 2200 rated player can then go into a BG and feel more powerful then a 1200 rated player.

Sixth, add a non-armor storm drake for duelist baby!
The exponential scaling part is what's supposed to buffer against people cheating the system like that. Kind of like how when they were still coming out with new AK tiers where you could spend 20 hours a day grinding AP but the levels weren't really "accessible" until the next AK came out. Something like 1 win at 1800 = 1,000 wins at 1600. 1 win at 2,000 = 1,000 wins at 1800 (or 1,000,000 wins at 1600 lol) etc. I.e. If a high prestige level requires the equivalent amount of honor to 20 wins at 2,000 to complete, you'd need to win 20 million games at 1600 just to get to the next tier of tokens.

You could also do stuff like grant elite xmog appearances at different prestige levels. Like prestige 18 (which would require honor equivalent to say like 20 wins at 1800 to get) you get the current seasons elite boots belt gloves and back mog. At 19 you get helm. Shoulders at 20. Etc.

Also versatility is not guaranteed to be on a pvp drop. Look at my currently equipped cloak. Secondary stats are 100% random in arena just like in m+. Edit: okay never mind I forgot that I didn't log out in that cloak but I am currently using a 920 crit mastery pvp cloak in my pve set.
nah the mechanic of pvp boosting during pvp combat was the best solution

made it not matter to pve players and worked well keeping pvp BIS for pvp

also ensures the best pvp gear was obtained from pvp, instead of pve which many pvp'ers aren't fans of
Why there is STILL no #soloque is beyond me at this point. Plenty good ideas on this thread but that one is a no brainer since forever.
01/11/2018 12:25 PMPosted by Bladèe
Told people this Xpack would suck for Pvp and be more dedicated to PVE content..

No one believed me...

I don't recall if I saw you claiming that, but I would have told you there was a good chance you were correct. And it turned out you were correct.

It was very obvious that casual PvP reward was basically removed.

I wonder if other people predicted this. Oh wait!

https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20748974720#post-6
01/11/2018 05:06 PMPosted by Zaim
Fifth, something to consider as an added bonus to PvPers for random BGs. Add a new buff to the Random BG template that increases your primary stat by your current 3v3 rating. A 2200 rated player can then go into a BG and feel more powerful then a 1200 rated player.


I do not do many 2v2 and I do not like 3v3 really hate Arenas. my love is just a lot of BG's I never complain about gear catch up in the old days. where it would take me 2 to 3weeks longer to get the gear I was working towards a goal.

There a lot players just like me that just love and have time to do BG's so your theory would locked a lot of us out of being competitive in BG's.
A false hope from blue
same old canned reply "we're looking into it we'll fix it maybe vaguely perhaps though we can't share the plans we don't really have or ever communicate during testing periods, we'll see what happens!"

got old the day i started browsing forums
It's been a little over 2 months that I had good gear drop that I need in a BG. It's been 870 gears for the longest time now if we had a vendor where I could get gear that I need and could use would be great.
Do we even have a PVP Developer that actually PVP's?
01/12/2018 10:11 PMPosted by Bdm
It's been a little over 2 months that I had good gear drop that I need in a BG. It's been 870 gears for the longest time now if we had a vendor where I could get gear that I need and could use would be great.
Do we even have a PVP Developer that actually PVP's?


no one in blizzard play pvp, they just calculate and simulate damages outputes, this is why pvp is sucking since cataclism.
01/13/2018 10:59 AMPosted by Removevidas
no one in blizzard play pvp, they just calculate and simulate damages outputes, this is why pvp is sucking since cataclism.


You may be right xd. Wow, getting a great PVP Developer like me hitting the Powerball we can always dream.
01/12/2018 10:11 PMPosted by Bdm
It's been a little over 2 months that I had good gear drop that I need in a BG. It's been 870 gears for the longest time now if we had a vendor where I could get gear that I need and could use would be great.
Do we even have a PVP Developer that actually PVP's?


True dat. Every drop from PVP I get is 870. When I have to do the daily dungeon to get the "Wakening Essence" to upgrade my 970 gear, it's 870 gear as well.

It's VERY apparent that Blizzard DEMANDS you do Heroic Raids if you want to get gear. Otherwise they prefer you be a scrub in 870 gear getting your head bashed in in PVP matches by dudes in 960+ total iLvl gear.
Hotfix PvP vendors back in would be a start.
1 Like
I agree man bring back the old system
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Yes a hotfix vendor in 7.35 would give me a lot more faith of Blizzard wanting to make pvp more enjoyable for the incoming BfA
Translation....This game blows. Im moving to San Diego and Im goin to hotfix this !@#$ myself