Rating loss? Tell me you don’t participate in the subject your commenting on without telling me? 
Show of hands, who has lost rating to a failed key? Anyone?
That was referring to pvp, i shouldve been clearer 
fixed it now
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Either way, I don’t pvp but I wouldn’t want to take something away from those who excel at it. Just because I don’t participate doesn’t mean I want to ruin it for others. See where I’m going with this?
I see where you’re going but i disagree with saying that it takes away and/or ruins anything. I think not progressing your rating (in pvp or m+), failing to upgrade your key or finish a m+ dung in general is failure enough without needing to deplete the key or losing pvp rating points. There is a vendor that allows for key depletion already, so if u need to downgrade a key if its too hard, u can. The game doesnt or shouldnt do that automatically.
So, buy a carry. Get a key, it never drops so you terrorize random pugs until someone carries you over the finish line and repeat? No thanks. Too many carried to where they are now, gotta pass. If you can’t clear a 15/10/ whatever, you don’t get the rating of someone who can. The group was bad you say? Cool, try again and build it better. You honestly think some of these ppl are gonna downgrade a 15 (max level vault) that they can’t time instead of trying until they get the carry? That’s silly.
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And yes it matters if they are showing 20 15 runs and the rating to match but have no idea what they are doing and waste other people’s time.
We do it all the time in my guild and ive seen it in pugs for sure. Its not that silly
One option I first saw here on GD and have brought up a few times in these discussions is for keys to have a certain number of charges before they deplete.
So failing a key doesn’t necessarily = deplete. If you complete the key it goes up (if timed) or stays the same (if not timed) as it does now, if the key isn’t completed, it simply stays the same level and loses a charge.
each key could have maybe 3 charges. if you put together groups that are so bad, you can’t complete a dungeon in three times, then you deserve the deplete lol.
some possible drawbacks
- this definitely benefits people at the top end, because they can simply walk out of their dungeon and reset it to start again at the same level. I don’t see that as a negative
- this could absolutely hurt pugs, because at the first sign of a mistake the key holder could simply disband the group and make a new one. there’s less incentive to stick with it.
I’m not sure it’s a good solution. At the end of the day the best solution is to stop pugging. network and run with friends. I refuse to believe that finding people to do keys with is an insurmountable task. I know because I do it. a mediocre, crotchety, past middle aged, super shy, introverted, kind of adult. if I can do it, you can do it.
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It really is. You ever pugged into a group of 15 or higher and had someone not know a basic boss mechanic? I have, was an 18 btw. Totally carried. Perhaps you believe that, and maybe the people you know don’t want to be a burden but I can assure you there are many who do NOT care at all.
That would be better yes, but then the outcry on GD would be nutty. They won’t say they ate the mech 5 times and died, just " I GOT KICKED AND THEY WOULDN’T REINVITE ME!!!"
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oh lord, imagine the tears if they didn’t degrade at all and the kh just booted and started over for every mistake? LOL
I mean it’s already happening in bad groups so why not? Personally if I created a bad group I rather kill the key early than sticking it out.
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GD repeatedly says how it hurts the keyholder. I’m with you there, if it is gonna be a slaughter that lasts way too long, I’m just as likely to bail on my own. I failed to make a good group, no worries, try again. I fail to see how that concept is so difficult for so many here.
I agree with this except i would just remove key depletion because all it takes is 1 player to screw over everyone, esp the key holder. Happened last week, 4 guildies and we invited 1 pug with a good raider.io and they bailed on the first wipe leaving us all with a wth moment. The key depletion was just adding insult to injury
Let me guess, everything was going perfectly too (except for the wipe), and they left for no reason?
Also, why do people believe that a “good raiderio” score is a valid indicator of whether or not someone is going to leave? This seems like common sense to me, but based on how many people can’t seem to spot this on their own, I’ll spell it out.
Inviting someone with a score closer to yours will more often than not match you with a player who is similar to your ability level and be less likely to be upset over a mistake that you’re likely to make.
Further, inviting someone who will benefit from completing your key will more often result in them staying to the end than inviting someone who will not benefit from just completing. Again, a more similar io score to your own will help, but looking to see what their highest score in the key your running may give you some insight into whether or not finishing will help them or not. Are they targeting a piece of gear that they’ll need to finish to get a chance at? Do they need the completion to add to their vault slot? How can you find the answers to these last 2 questions, I don’t see that information in their score???
TALK TO THEM FFS.
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Easy to abuse
- Don’t interupt
- use CDs on small packs
- pull extra
- break cc on first boss plaguefall
- stop healing
- pull too many packs
- don’t dispel
- don’t stun
- keep dieing
so easy to force a group to force disband
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Though i agree. From what I can tell leavers are generally 2 type of players. Angry noobs who think they’re better than what they really are and/or skill player who had enough trying to carry the team.
Ofcourse there are the trolls but i barely see these. I probably seen maybe 1 or less every 100 keys I pugged.
I personally left keys on last boss simply because of annoyance. We wipe 3times on last boss of sd simply because people don’t understand the mechanics of the fight on a fairly decent level key. Even after you explained it to them after the 1st wipe. And honestly anything higher than a +2 you shouldn’t be explaining anything. People should do their due diligence to research the fights
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There would be far fewer complaints on GD about this if people only did this 
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Problem with inviting people higher than you (assuming they were, not looking you up) is that they will see mistakes someone with less experience does not. Seeing people do stuff that to them looks silly gets tiresome really quickly, not to mention most would assume if you are running a key, you either have some experience or at the very least have looked it up beforehand (no, this does not apply to higher/even mid keys–everyone should have practiced before putting someone through that). I understand that is your opinion but there is nothing you can say that will make me agree. We are already rewarded for failure and shouldn’t be imo. To have a key that never depletes is silly when the challenge is to beat the dungeon, with the affixes, in a set amount of time. Maybe you should take a 5th guildie if this happens more than very rarely.
As many have stated before:
If it happens to you more than most other people running keys, you are the likely problem. So in this case, you or a guildie.
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