Let’s say you put down a circle on an opponent. The circle is not all that big. On live it takes me about 2 and half seconds to walk from the center to outside of the edge. For argument’s sake let’s say it takes 3.
Assuming your enemy has no mobility skill, and you are just whacking at it. You have enough time to hit one festering strike + 2 sourge strike, resulting in 2% DR from your opponent, at which point you’ve lost pressure because you have to wait for your apocalypse now, and the DR only lasts 12 seconds. I’d consider that to be pretty useless, potentially below 0 value since you just wasted multiple GCDs accomplishing 2% DR.
And that’s just the best case scenario. Let’s say you are against an enemy with mobility such as mage who can instantly move out of your circle, then you have to invest grip + stun in order to keep your enemy inside your circle. Asphyxiate lasts 4 seconds, so you can potentially get 1 festering out plus 3 scourge strike (if you are lucky), resulting in 3% DR, after wasting major stun CD as well as grip. That’s a major blunder, because you will not have any GO anymore, and 3%DR is not enough for enemy to not pressure you.
If you insist, please feel free to get on beta and queue a skirmish and see how it is.
Edit: Using stun lock / CC chain gets you wins in arenas, and let’s be honest you are not going to invest that on a circle that has no kill pressure with DR that is too low to even be considered. So if you are not investing stun lock on the circle, you put it down, enemy walks out, 0 value.
Sure, 2%? Right. If you dream about 2% DR / str then I don’t know what to say. I encourage you to go into beta and try it out. And like I said, you most likely won’t even get that. Your opponent will simply walk out. And if you actually stun them, then you have just wasted your first GO potential, which is even worse.
You are making my point. Abom is indeed 0 value against certain opponents. Sometimes I don’t take it if I am against double priests. And i have the choice to not take it should I choose to, but I can’t do the same with covenant abilities.
Not sure what your second quote is about. If you have a question please state your question.
Regardless I think I am done with this conversation. I already said this many times, this is a problem for me. You are trying very hard to tell me that this is not a problem for me, and I am not sure why. Maybe you are just that much better of a player. Maybe your skill is above all. But who cares? It’s still a problem for me.
This comes down to my choice, right? If I and my teammates lose a match, inevitably that thought will come to us, if I had necrolord mass grip there perhaps I could’ve won. Could I? Maybe, maybe not. But I don’t wish for that to happen, nor do I wish that on my teammates.
Talents / gears allow us to switch at will to suit content, I am not sure why covenant abilities can’t. Again I don’t wish to argue whether Blizzard should make this decision, it’s their game, I will have to live with it. I am simply saying this is a problem for me, and may be for others. Whether they think alike I really have no say, none of us does.
There’s a primary issue with your mentality though.
It’s less about me feeling like I have to be optimal in all specs and all types of content in the game but instead me looking to be at my best in the specs and class I want to play.
It’s not an unrealistic demand because that’s how the game has been for quite some time. It’s not hard for them to recreate that.
The same sort of thing can already happen. I’m playing a healer with no battle rez when the battle rez could have saved us.
Ret is a little less strong than another dps spec, and so we wiped at 1%.
None of these arguments are new, they’re exactly the same arguments that led to utility spells being removed and class homogenization, which players complain about all the time, but without seeing the connection.
They want to do something different. That is whole point.
If the argument is: you can’t do this because I might have a sub-optimal ability in arena on a character that doesn’t focus on arenas, then that is an unrealistic demand.
Or my off-spec is a little less effective sometimes than it might be in a different covenant. Same thing.
You are not wrong, and I agree homogenization is not the way to go. I am not arguing against that, I don’t think any of us is. What we are asking for is freedom to choose. As far as I can see homogenization and freedom to choose is not conflicting.
Oh okay, so they are not the same. The article showed weapons that go with the covenant sets, that you get off vendors from raid drops. That made me wonder if the covenant sets will also be from the raids and will be replacing regular dungeon-themed armor sets. That seemed like it would be excessive and rather meh after a while.
So far we have just seen the covenant set and the first raid, but I think raid sets will be by armor type throughout the expansion, and then there will be some covenant-themed appearances also, basically like the artifact weapons/order hall appearances.
I am hoping for a solo challenge in Torghast, or a similar thing, a bit like the mage tower.
There were similar variables, though. What was the chance that your main character would have the best raid dps spec and the best arena spec? Only if you were lucky.
That’s why there were countless threads at that time about balance and tuning.
Yes, of course, there is a different wrinkle here. But there needs to be room for some variation if they are going to try something new.
If a particular hunter spec is pretty good in arenas, does it really matter if one covenant ability is a little better than another?
Yes. 100% it is. Because as you push into the higher ratings every fine detail matters more. Especially in longer Arena games.
And it didn’t matter about being the best raid and arena spec. Nobody who has more then half a brain is going to request to be the best in all avenues the game has to offer. The thing is though that it doesn’t restrict our want to minimize the gap between being an asset or being a liability.
The spec I played was looked down on in both raids and Arena at the time. But because I was enabled to optimize myself with Legendaries, PvE and PvP Talents and with gearing, I was able to push content to get pretty much all the Elite tabards and my first actual CE achievement.
I don’t need to be the best class in Rated PvP, Raiding and M+. But if I’m allowed to optimize myself for each one I can guarantee you that I can still push and do well. Unlike the current system that seems to want to restrict me of my ability to do that.
It’s actually showing to be exactly like that. I said this earlier but for me, as a MM Hunter my primary choice for Rated Arena will hands down be Kyrian for denying opponents LoS and the Steward who opens up the opportunity for Rogue vanish like resets. The secondary choice seems to be Venthyr. Problem is neither of those Covenants are the ones I want to play.
Not to mention that there are scenarios where someone can choose a certain spec and choose the best Covenant for that but then find that it’s actually pretty garbo for the other. That’s not a good feeling.
Now you are saying that you can pick the best covenant for arenas, but it’s not the one you prefer for other reasons (I guess for aesthetics?).
Or that an off-spec might be garbo, meaning not quite as good as it would be with another covenant.
That’s nothing like having trouble pushing content. It’s not remotely similar.
It’s a new thing, and I get that the novelty of it can be unsettling, but many of the arguments being made against the feature are hyperbolic in the extreme.
I never presented it as a personal problem. My stance hits a lot of different points that have already been made by the community. Which a lot of it I agree with. For me, it is more an aesthetic choice.
I have a guild that I’ll be playing with. Primarily PvP but I’m sure there’ll be some casual Heroic Raiding and M+. Issue is if this was Legion I’d be in trouble because while pushing Mythic content I was doing Arenas on off nights. And a system like this would throw a wrench in the gears for pushing rating.