I rerolled from my warrior main that I played since TBC to Prot Pal because it has incredible spell mitigation. So it’s pertinent to the topic.
Then trolls chimed in and disputed it for the sake of arguments instead of understanding how mechanics work. Blame them for making this into where we are now derailing the thread just because they have ADS (Abomb Derangement Syndrome)
Gladly would love to talk about how Prot warrior needs buffs and flat % dmg mitigation and a spell reflect rework with D stance again though. Or maybe an IP rework too. If we can stay on topic great and talk about Prot warrior vs Spell dmg because they need some massive fixes. Or you can just reroll to a spec that can easily handle it as I did. That was my fix.
Yes, folks are aware of builds that favour magic mitigation. No, they are not half as effective in PvE as you are claiming it to be.
Please stop spreading misinformation. If prot paladins were as effective as you claimed in PvE they’d have been much more popular last season than they were.
And nobody is trolling you. You’re just making false claims and trying to prove it by “But I did it in PvP!!”
The only misinformation I have read was the few trolls that make an unverified statement. If I am wrong always happy to admit it though. However I’m not so I will continue playing a spec that has OP magic mitigation. Doesn’t matter if you believe me or not does it. Just don’t spread misinformation please and thanks.
Now perhaps you guys should stop derailing the thread? Thanks! How about talking about Prot Warrior or the OP.
The real question is how you can be so arrogant while drawing false conclusions. You haven’t even run any high keys or completed the mythic raid… Prot Paladins were known for falling over in those, by the way–especially the high keys.
I’m not going to argue with you in regards to PvP because I don’t do it enough and don’t care to but you need to understand that PvP and PvE are different. The damage profiles are completely different and you cannot achieve “near immunity” to magic in PvE content. Not for very long, anyway.
You aren’t on to some big secret that somehow eluded the entire rest of the WoW community. You’re just drawing false equivalencies and touting them as fact.
Correct that is an area of the game I don’t have any interest in competing in.
You don’t have to do it to realize that almost all damage in PvP is magical and Tanks take 50% increased dmg in PvP yet Prot Pal is able to easily mitigate magic dmg. So the harshest magic dmg environment is in fact PvP yet Prot Pal thrives I wonder why
Yea you can and that is why the #1 parse on mythic Maut months ago was a Block capped mastery Prot Pal. Which keep in mind while also being block capped your dmg reduction standing in Concentration is 55+% flat dmg reduction to go with block.
To say Prot Pal is objectively weak against magic when you can 100% spec to nullify it makes this claim false.
If there was an entire Mythic that had 100% magic dmg Prot Pal could cruise through it as if it was physical if you spec that way. It’s their strength not weakness. Then lets not forget they have way more big buttons to press against magic if for some strange reason they need them. That is why they can continuously mitigate magic with nigh immunity.
I didn’t derail it I only provided a simple answer then the usual suspects made ridiculous claims.
It would be great if we could just talk about how Prot warriors are weak against magic and possible solutions. If the solutions don’t sound attractive then I have enjoyed Prot Pal since it’s OP against magic. Seriously lets focus on Prot Warriors please and thanks. They need some buffs.
Spells don’t hit even half as hard in PvP as they do in high keys. Some of these spells get to where they hit 800k+++ while you’re also getting chunked by physical attacks because prot paladins had more gaps in their mitigation than the average skyscraper has windows to look out of.
That is not near magical immunity as you claimed.
Maut does relatively low damage compared to monsters in high keys or later raid bosses too. Not to mention most competent raid groups can kill him in a minute and a half or so–in other words, the stacks never get very high.
It can be objectively weak to something whilst being relatively strong compared to its competition.
Then stop talking about it like you have a foot to stand on. The damage profiles are different and you haven’t the faintest clue what you’re talking about.
Even at block cap, even while standing in consecrate a Paladin in a high mythic + key will die to these casts if they are not interrupted–or immuned with divine shield but then you’re in trouble again when it runs out. They can hit for 800k or more in high keys and there are usually multiple casters and melee attacking you simultaneously.
You want near magical immunity? Do it the way all the other tanks do it: interrupt the bleeding casts.
You’re not face tanking it for long in a +25 though.
I’d prefer to talk about prot warriors but you’re making unsubstantiated claims and you don’t have the experience to back them up.
I get that you want to stick it to Drez but you can’t expect PvP and PvE to be the same. They aren’t at all.
Yea spells hit that hard If a 300-400k spell on a normal target hits a Tank that takes 50% more dmg then has 10+ debuff stack from FC. You get to way more constant big damage you have to mitigate.
You are just wrong mathematically and mechanically.
No one is talking about physical so who cares. The discussion is spell dmg or magic dmg so physical mitigation is irrelevant to the thread.
The math says other wise. Magical attacks can’t kill a Mastery Prot Pal that is block capped standing in concentration. It’s way to much magic mitigation and mitigation is factored in before Absorbs so you don’t even have to use big defensive CDs. Not to mention you have 2 immunities to magic and 2 defensives.
As stated before it’s not a weakness though Prot Pal has OP magic mitigation and you are just rambling on derailing the thread.
I want to stop talking about it but you keep dragging this out when already factual answers have been provided. So please lets talk about Prot Warriors I only offered Prot Pal as an OP magic mitigation Tank for someone that needs one.
No they won’t it’s mathematically impossible. An 800k dmg magic attack can be mitigated without using either 2 defensives or 2 magic immunes. If I can fully absorb 200k+ attacks where they do no dmg do you think 800k changes that? It doesn’t due to extreme magic mitigation before absorbs. Not to mention I have to tank those types of attacks while FCing and be constantly ready for them.
Again no one is talking about melee dmg so it doesn’t matter.
Good then talk about Prot warriors. I do have the claims to back them up though since I compete in the environment that has almost all magic dmg. While taking 50% increased dmg all the time and then pick up a flag that gives me another debuff. I have to stand there and face tank 100% magic dmg so I know what I am talking about. It’s literally my job in RBGs!
It’s relevant to mythic + or raid because the damage types are mixed. That’s something you seem to fail to grasp.
I said 800k + you genius. I was trying to give you a reasonable average. There are spells that can hit you for well into the millions if you let stacks get a bit high.
Those spells have to be interrupted or dodged. Otherwise you, like every other tank, will die without an immunity.
No. PvP and PvE are not equivalent. At all.
You do not have the experience to make such silly claims.
That’s in normal and he was stacking absurd amounts of versatility corruptions for most of those, not mastery as you’ve claimed.
Quite frankly a DK and a DH can do the same thing, just not in a reasonable timeframe like he could because he was abusing Avenger’s Shield resets to do reasonable amounts of damage.
Heck, I’ve solo tanked almost all of heroic on my DK. lol
Rextroy used exploits that got patched, this isn’t a crutch you can use. Unless you meant all along that you need exploits in order to be invincible as you claim.
You guys crack me up so this discussion went from Prot Pal being weak against magic dmg to now having to Solo Mythic Wrathion to prove how strong it is? What?
You aren’t making any sense. Keep in mind though Prot Pal does have many solo Raid kills as world first which just proves how OP they are mechanically.
No it’s not relevant because we are talking now about magic mitigation and your claim that Prot Pal is objectively weak against magic. Which Prot Pal is in fact OP against magic.
Again feel free to post your silly claims on the Arena forums and get laughed out of there with a claim that Prot Pal is objectively weak against magic.
Sigh…
I have a better idea how about you tell me how many millions of dmg a spell needs to do to actually kill a Prot Pal in 1 shot. Yes I said millions.
Wasn’t basing it on Rextroy at all just you started to talk about Solo Raid kills which are irrelevant to the discussion so I linked one.
PVP is not equivalent to PVE. You’re denser than a ball of lead.
If Prot Paladin was as good as you claim it was in PvE it would have seen some representation in the content you claim when, in fact, it saw very little because it had some serious issues.
I’m talking about prot paladin in pve. Talking about something in isolation is pointless and unrealistic.
You’re also apparently unable to understand what people are trying to tell you so quit derailing the thread.
I know since PvP is almost all magic dmg and PvE isn’t. Again we are talking about magic dmg mitigation. Please follow along.
We are talking about magic mitigation which Prot Pal is OP against. Again if there is ever a dungeon with almost all magic dmg then Prot Pal would be the only viable tank. Since they are the only tank that has OP magic mitigation. It’s that simple.
Well I don’t care about PvE the topic is magic mitigation and how to mitigate spell dmg. I said I rerolled to Prot Pal since it has OP magic mitigation. So anytime you want to get actually back on topic then please do. Heck maybe even bring Prot Warriors into the convo.
No I understand completely we are talking specifically about magic mitigation. Some ridiculous person said that Prot Pals are objectively weak against magic. Which is completely false (I am only arguing that single point). Again if you stand by that false claim please take it to the proper forums which is the Arena forums with that claim. Where the players do 100% magic dmg and constantly cry about fighting Prot Pals.
Are Prot Pals objectively weak against magic dmg? False
Are Prot Pals incredibly strong against magic dmg? True
Again…If you will
If you don’t feel like answering that or making a thread in the Arena forums with your false claim can we just move onto talking about Prot warriors…Yikes.
Yes, Abomb. You’ve stumbled across a supremely overpowered super secret build that the entire rest of the community somehow missed despite the ludicrous amount of data we have at our fingertips.
If prot paladins were as good in PvE as you claim they’d have seen more representation. They aren’t, so they didn’t.
They are highly represented in PvP though where there is almost all magic dmg. This is my entire point!!! They are highly represented
Heck even the only Tank at the AWC tournament was…wait for it…Prot Pal. It’s because they hard counter magic dmg and last season was a Caster Meta. You can’t be this stubborn
We didn’t miss it and have been running it in PvP.
Again all I was doing was stopping the misinformation that Prot Pal is objectively weak against magic dmg. It isn’t. I have proved it time and time again.
Please answer any of the questions or don’t. If you think somehow even if spells are doing millions of dmg it will 1 shot a Prot Pal running a magic mitigation build you are factually wrong. Ideally can you just try to talk about the topic instead. Sigh…
If one good thing came from all this it’s that people know Prot Pal has OP magic mitigation if they are interested in that. Now lets talk about Prot Warriors I wish this thread luck.
How many times do I have to tell you that PvP is not equivalent to PvE? There are builds you can run in PvP that do not work in PvE.
In PvE prot paladins (relative to some other tanks) were getting annihilated in 8.3. The damage profiles are different (i.e sustained high physical damage with bursts of extremely high magical damage) which means that if you run a build entirely to deal with magic damage, you get dunked on by physical mobs.
Which means you run a build that is reasonably good at mitigating both forms of damage which in turn means when you get slammed by a 1 mil cast from a mob you are going to be in serious pain because you cannot effectively run whatever PvP build you’re talking about because of the mixed damage types.
Do you understand now? This is why talking about things in isolation is pointless.
Yes this is true and I 100% agree with this. All I said was is that Prot Pal has a magic dmg mitigation build that is strong against magic.
No we aren’t!!! I told you what I am talking about. I am only here defending my position on the false claim made that Prot Pal is objectively weak against magic dmg. That’s it.
Now can you drop that false claim thanks. Prot Pal has an incredible tool kit to hard counter magic dmg. That’s the only point I have been making every post.
Who cares…the discussion isn’t the source of where the dmg is coming from just the actual magic dmg. Again the only point I am making is that Prot Pal can hard counter magic dmg. That is it!!! Thus rendering the claim that Prot Pal is weak against magic dmg as false. You have to be trolling.
The topic I have been talking about is purely magic dmg mitigation. Not physical…not bleeds…MAGIC DAMAGE!! Yikes…
This is why the forums can be hopeless you aren’t even talking about the topic I have been arguing. I only care about this one point which was stopping the misinformation of that false claim.
Gonna stop feeding you and hopefully this thread will talk about Prot Warriors at some point.
So you want to discuss pointless hypotheticals. lol
Drez and folks like him don’t deal in hypotheticals. They deal in facts observed in realistic scenarios.
In realistic scenarios in PvE (which is all we’re ever really talking about here if you’ve failed to notice) prot paladins are not gods at mitigating magical damage because they can’t focus on that without dying to physical damage.
Which is why they were stacking versatility rather than mastery in 8.3. It was reasonably good at mitigating both forms of damage.
Everyone but you, apparently.
You’re the one who’s become hyper focused upon a singular point without wanting to acknowledge the broader context of the statements. lmao
If a 300-400k spell on a normal target hits a Tank that takes 50% more dmg then has 10+ debuff stack from FC. You get to way more constant big damage you have to mitigate.
