Proposed Update to the Archaic Runeforge System

Classes Death Knight
21

Fair enough. Last time I dug into SSG, it was a 2H only. For what its worth, I pulled it up on wowpedia to double check, and it wasn’t updated there. Kinda proves the point that no one even looks at Runeforging anymore, they just gate and throw on FC.

You are wrong. And your wrong because of how you look at the argument. I clearly said that they can overwrite each other, because that is how Blizzard balanced them. You using that as a reason why they are enchants isn’t the dunk you think it is.

Now if you wanted to, you could have said "After you Runeforge your weapon, the results state “Enchanted: Weapon X”, and you would be right, and would have a better argument.

You DON’T have anything to correct. This was a proposal thread. Its very similar to threads on reddit saying the similar stuff. You just disagree that the Runeforging needs an update. You think its fine. OK. Say why you think its fine. Say why you think its ok to have 7 Runes and only 3 ever see play?

You do realize that people play 40k with alternate rules all the time? yes, there is a set rulebook, but the vast majority of tabletop games aren’t played at REL.

Cause we are board and waiting on 11.1, and complaining that DKs haven’t gotten overhauled.

All I am saying, is that there is a time and place to correct “wrong information”. I think you did great in the thread about is FDK a 3 button rotation. They were asking was it going to be meta.

This thread was an exploration thread about what could the Devs do, if only for random internet banter. You don’t need to interact. You don’t need to be a buzzkill. You could just say, “That’s an interesting idea, but I don’t think they need to be changed, and here is why.”

My comment here is why the negativity man?

22

the best take here is that all 2H weapons should be allowed 2 runeforges while 1H weaps (DW) get 1 each

7 Likes
23

Agreed, this would resolve the talent interaction issues for frost while also not risking making an enchant better and obsoleting the entire system.

2 Likes
24

Its not my fault that you put out false information that needs to be corrected.

No im not, runeforges are enchants. It doesnt matter how many times you or anyone else wants to claim I am wrong, they are enchants. They are just enchants called runeforges. Its pretty blatantly obvious.

And you dont have to say incorrect things either.

Yes, a proposal to change the runeforge system because… oh what were the words used…

ah… there they are. So its a proposal or a request for blizzard to change the runeforge system because its “dated”.

So a bunch of other people want a change for the sake of change? Talk about first world problems and changing something that doesnt need changed and all suggestions being put forward all lead back to the same exact outcome.

Why have so many enchants when there only a few are used? The best is always going to be used. Its that simple. This isnt something that needs extensive thought, the answer is blatantly obvious.

Did you hear the whoosh or was it too far over your head. And no, I wasnt talking about people playing with alternative rules, I was talking about people saying that the rulebook states something that it doesnt.

See.

If you are bored go play another game.

Yes, and that is when wrong information is presented. There is no better time.

No this is a proposal. Asking for Blizzard to change a system that isnt broken to just end up in the same exact spot everyone is in right now. “All we ever use is stoneskin, and Ill never forgive Blizzard for nerfing us when FC was made baseline which resulted in additional power.” Thats the outcome. Im tired of having to explain this over and over to people that claim to be veterans of this game but seemingly hasnt ever paid attention to a single thing to how a character is built. Come on, be realistic. If you make FC baseline then the next best thing takes its place.

And you dont need to put out incorrect information. Working off of incorrect information is what leads to bad decisions like asking for the runeforge system to be changed.

But I dont think they are interesting ideas. I think they are bad ideas that just result in the same people complaining about the same thing just substituting “Fallen Crusader” with “Stoneskin”.

Because these threads are bad, bring about bad information, and achieves absolutely nothing even if the request is successful. Its like complaining about riding the bus, and the solution is painting it a different color.

It accomplishes nothing. They are all bad ideas. Just be happy you get your free enchant, 2h needs to stop looking at what DW has since you guys didnt want to listen 2 expansions ago when 2h was being reimplemented so your time has past, and just go enjoy the game and if you arent enjoying it then stop playing it.

25

I legit don’t think the system is set up for that though. Runeforges are literately just a branch of the system for Enchanting weapon enchants, and placing a second on the weapon over-rides the one that’s on there. Maybe there’s some chunk of legacy code that’s dormant that could do the trick, but I’d rather them not try to revamp a 20 year old chunk of code just for a single spec (not that they would).

I think you landed on a great idea here. Personally I think the system should just be folded into our talents and spells as I’m sure a chunk of our balancing problems (and why we can’t have a decent self heal like everyone else in the game) is because we’ve had basically the same meta for runeforges for over a decade now.

Why not take some of the runes and make them temp enchants like poison or a shamans weapon enchants. It would still keep the feel of them being mystic runes we’re laying down on our weapons, but would give more incentive to try out different ones and end the whole static ‘separate but the same’ enchantment system as it currently stands.

2 Likes
26

Because it would bring a nerf. Adding more power will have to be compensated for. Just ignore runeforging, there is absolutely nothing wrong with it and its not leading to any balance problems.

1 Like
27

you are totally correct, but given the options id rather RotFC become a proc talent that forces dks to use another runeforge, I prefer them being enchants, and I would rather not hav to keep applying them like rogue poisons or shaman weapon buffs.

28

Congrats at not accomplishing anything and just shifting putting FC on a weapon to Stoneskin while accompanying it all with a nerf because more power being added.

Just get rid of Runeforging at this point. You guys are never happy so why have things that benefit the DK at all, make them like all other classes that have to buy their enchants.

29

You should ignore Kel fam thats wht most of us do anyway, guy is a complete troll with the worst takes on everything. Dude doesnt even play the game.

30

Says the person that wants to change stuff that will accomplish nothing. 33k achievement points and you want to make FC baseline just to shift the runeforge to the next best one. Congrats, you wasted your own time.

31

I ended up putting him on mute.

He is smart and knows the class. He could contribute so much, but he just shuts things down, and if I was a dev, I would hate that.

Thanks for the advice

1 Like
32

Shutting down bad ideas is bad somehow? Its like saying throwing spray paint cans into a fire is bad and people saying “he just shutting things down but could contribute so much” yes im trying to stop you from creating a bomb.

But go ahead, make FC baseline into the spec and then watch as all these same people, you, Verod, Asherr all complain that all you do is apply Stoneskin. Do it Blizzard, sometimes people need to blow their hand off to know that holding a firework isnt a good idea. Just make FC baseline within the spec and then nerf the class for the additional power added.

Talk about in one ear and out the other.

33

that is ezily the most frustrating part, how can som1 som well informed be such a blantent forum troll its aggrivating, but i guess thats wht they r going for.

1 Like
34

How is it trolling if its pointing out the issues with what you propose? Just recognize the issue and come up with something better than “make FC baseline so I just move to the next best runeforge”. It doesnt solve the issue of using the same runeforge over and over again.

But then you say its not up to you to make a suggestion, even though you guys do until the issues are pointed out, and say its up to Blizzard to come up with the solution. But there isnt a problem to have a solution in the first place, its a bunch of people that are bored and want to see a different runeforge like it matters at all that the same one is being used.

Is it the look of it? Is having a big strength increase up for over half the fight that bad? I mean it cant be if you want it to stay within the spec.

So what EXACTLY is the problem here? What is there to complain about? Thats the actual frustrating part is that you guys will complain about ANYTHING. So how can anyone know what is actually a problem and what isnt when everything is? This is why you guys think Blizzard doesnt listen to you guys and are ignoring DK’s (even though they clearly arent).

There is no end to the constant and blatant complaining and then when someone does point out an issue, they get lambasted because its not aligned with what people want from the specs, but they hate the spec even though they have what they wanted.

The runeforge system isnt a problem, BoS isnt a problem, Ghoul isnt a problem. You want to use Stoneskin go use Stoneskin, nothing is stopping you and its not going to be some massive drop off. The boss is going to die, or are people really that concerned with what others think of them on some 3rd party site? I think people are concerned with what others think, of where they are ranked on some 3rd party site because thats the only way to have any valid information right?

The hilarious part is its people that talk about me that are getting forum vacations. If you cant be on topic get out. No one wants to see people like you talk about other players. Thats why these threads die so fast. Stay on topic or shut it.

35

You know, I really wonder what can be done with Runeforges to be overall balanced that also eclipses the Weapon Enchantments. The Runeforges should be all of them are… Direct Damage Increases since there are Direct Damage Increase Enchantments.

FC is just too good. Apocalypse is Bad. Hysteria got removed thanks to BoS shenanigans ensued. Sanguination got nerfed in PvP because it hit surprisingly hard. Spellwarden is a good pvp talent but not good enough for an enchantment slot. Gargoyle is always an alternative. Unending Hunger is… situational at best. Razorice is exclusive to Frost which is also… another really good runeforge for that spec.

Not much of a diversity for Runeforges that’s slowly creeping up to be integrated to the DK kit as a whole.

1 Like
36

Why does anything need to be done? Are the same things going to be done to enchanting to make all the options that are created during each expansion to be worth applying to your weapon if you arent a DK? Its a pointless endeavor.

There will always be the best option. Has there ever been a time when there wasnt? There are the best talents, the best enchants, the best gear, the best runeforges. So either people stop doing the 3rd party rankings and just play the game and what they find fun so long as the bosses die, or there is just going to be the best period and you will always want to get those things.

Changing the system doesnt fix there being a best in slot. It just shifts what the bis option is. The best thing they could do is get rid of runeforging and enchanting to stop the complaint otherwise it just keeps getting shifted.

So I ask again, if they make FC baseline within the spec/class what is stopping people from using the next best option?

37

I mean, what’s the point of changing the Runeforge System? You get to not pay for weapon enchants and have one that is always better than w/e they’re giving out for the expansion. If this is about Frost and 2H, then that should be fixed either through MotFW by baking in Razorice or rebuilding Frost from the ground up since 2H being so dependent on Obliterate is part of the problem with the spec in general.

38

The main point is why have all the donut flavors if you only sell one or two.

It’s the same issue with spymasters web this patch. If something is head and shoulders better, it needlessly homogenizes things.

Yes people will gravitate towards what’s best, but why is it best across all three specs in all scenarios. We have talent builds down to dungeons, but we carry over a customizable piece of kit across all content.

Heck, they could even make a leveling rune to increase XP gains or health/rune/RP generation after killing something.

We have this huge sandbox to play in, and only a little bit of it is ever used.

39

Its boring just using RoFC for the last 18 years. I would like to see some diversity personally. It wouldnbe cool it we had RotFC baked into a talent that procs wen u r runeforged with something else l. The things like Rune of Apoc couldnbe real choices for UH. The rest of them would still need to be balanced anonsts themselve tho. Which is the core issue at the end of the day. There is one runeforge to rule them all.

1 Like
40

No reason to actually change the system though.

Again, this fixes nothing. It just adds in more power that has to be accounted for.

It wouldnt be because Stoneskin exists. This is what I dont stand is how people havent learned this after playing for 15+ years.

Why is this a problem and how exactly do you do anything about this? There will always be one runeforge to rule them all outside of making specific talents that work off of specific runeforges but that again just pushes you towards 1 runeforge its just based on the spec now.

The Runeforge system is not the thing to complain about, and if the complaints are the runeforge system and unholy not being able to play without a pet then DK has it pretty good.