Even here though I think the trap launcher buff was unnecessary. However, it’s far more egregious to buff a class with two dps spec options, and a viable Tank and Healer spec, along with multiple raid needed buffs and utilities than it is to do the same to a pure dps class that does nothing else.
My bias - I actually support the old school hybrid tax. I know it’s not the way things are balanced now and that the community generally strongly supports not having a hybrid tax but still - that’s my bias.
In an ideal world I’d want to see:
Fire, Assas/Com, Surv/Marks, Aff all at the top of the tier. With non SM Rets and Furies about where Fury is now. Alongside all the other hybrids (Feral included). Fury is in the sweet spot for where high performing hybrids should be right now I think (buff Prot).
With SM DKs, Warriors, and Pally’s should be competitive with the pures.
The case for no balance changes in classic is that classic brings in players from pre retail (like myself) who didn’t dislike the hybrid tax or see it as bad design. Applying retail class balance design philosophy to the classic version of the game alienates such players.
And the result of the balance changes we have seen has been exactly that I think. But this is spilled milk and it is what it is.
If they did wrath forever servers or a SOM they should run it without the class changes in my view.
you can remove bear weaving without increasing their dmg a ton, like decreasing their dps a bit with the glyph.
Ret without buffs would still put them solidly near frost dk and overall Mid tier dps, above bottom even without SM. How is that not fair, cosidering the statements they made regarding why it was fair for others to not receive the same treatment ?
Even if it was, dropping off that hard puts ret BELOW Frost.
1 and 2 assume Shadowmourne, without it the drop puts ret about on par with a Blood DK that doesn’t have Shadowmourne, and isn’t using Unholy Frenzy at all. AKA, tied for 2nd last and only beating Arms warriors.
The data is there. Maybe learn how to read and do math some time. It might help your blatant forum alt trolling be less pathetic.
Good.
Glad another melee class is at the top instead of warrior for once. Rets deserve it. They were the laughing stock meme builds for vanilla and TBC. Now they’re viable and you’re crying about not being #1 yet you’re still s-tier…
Cry more. Please. Loving the fury tears as a non-pally.
It looks quite unlikely they will do that. But if they did, I suspect they will just leave it at is and not do anything to it. Because those servers will die out eventually either way, why put any more effort into it?
At any rate, did any of the changes ruin the game - nah, I’m still having fun. It’s a philosophical difference of opinion. Thus why I’m not pushing for a change at this point.
Either way, Warriors are hybrid. Even by my own preferences Fury is fine. There’s an argument for bringing Prot up to par though.
Agreed… that’s the area where warriors have a legit gripe IMO. AD as it currently stands is way too OPed.
But ret vs fury… they’re virtually tied. There’s no real imbalance there.
Prot, however… that’s where the real imbalance lies. I actually take the warrior side on that one.
Furies… you guys are just fine as is. Still A-tier without SM and borderline S-tier with.
Nah… looking at Festergut, the number 1 fight without cleave and full melee uptime, and just removing the reckoning glyph would drop ret to around blood DK levels of damage.
SoV changes also gone and we would be below blood.
Everyone is eager to bring in blood DKs for dps, right?
Ret needed buffs. That never stopped being true. The spec shouldn’t need shadowmourne to be competitive, and it absolutely would still need shadowmourne for that had it not been buffed.
Like I’ve said before, there’s some argument to be had about the ret buffs being slightly too much given the early spike in power they get in ICC, but that’s going to largely level out over time.
I don’t think it’s unreasonable for a ret weilding shadowmourne to be one of the better DPS specs, while one without it is middle of the pack, which is where non SM ret should end up by phase end.
And ret nerfs to create a better relative balance would be very light adjustments.
Rey glyph on the sim is doing 1147dps out of the 16.4k… So yeah idk what you on about.
frost is at 15.75k full bis, none glyph ret would be at 15.5k assuming whatever glyph replaces reck will be some 100-150dps ish.
That is 200 dps less than frost and is solidly in the middle of the pack, dropping SM puts you at like around the lowest dps, yet idk why thats a debate, “WARRIORS SCALE AND GET SM” was uttered so much it was insane and without SM Warr is behind 7-8 dps specs ??? How dafuq was that fair.
So as you seem to suggest, maybe you should look at just an ounce of data, cause your stupid claims just got debunked…
But it is no wonder mr 10/12 mid ret player, i can see the saltiness in attacking like you do thinking it will help your argument.
Oh but I thought the argument was without SM! Which goal posts are we after today, far, further, or furthest? Ya see, if you keep moving them it’s just gonna make me tired of dealing with you.
Also, second best glyph we have is Seal of Vengeance glyph, which we already use, at 100 dps. So that kinda nullifies your statement. You also hilariously showed yourself bad at math, as 16.4k minus 1.1 k is not 15.5, even with the extra less than a hundred we’d get from using a different glyph. Subtracting SM, as you suggested, as I stated, puts Ret tied for 2nd to last.
But if you want to continue to be a troll, feel free. You’ve been an entertaining fool at least.
And ret hasnt even gotten SM yet. Point there being ? That fight is funny to bring up, ret is ahead of warr overall on it, the “GIGA SCALER” is being outdone by the spec that was so bad it needed a helping “1k+ dps” even though undead mobs and tier sets + abom solidly put it back in the same tier it was fair for warriors to be dogwater until.
You would still be equal to shadow and above several other specs, again completely without SM still. with SM it equals the glyph so your spot would be the same.
Several other specs needed buffs, but cause the developers and their GF´s now with zirene doesnt play those specs they were forgotten about or outright nerfed multiple times.
I dont mind rets getting a buff, i mind them getting a buff, warrior be shanked from getting one cause devs said (ohh but they scale) meanwhile they at the start said they cared about “CLASS REPRESENTATION” for 2 out of 4 phases warriors was the least represented class in the game, all spec sucked and they were shafted from a buff, but ret got one cause they were bad at DPS, yet their holy and prot spec is litterally 95% and 70% of all healer and tanks roster spots. Make that make sense for class rep ?
I dont mind SM ret and warr being top of the meters, i mind the hypocrisy in it all, the unfair treatment and the nerfs to one class while buffing others.
more importantly how do you feel about the firect warrior dps copy (feral) being buffed by 2k dps and then litterally still outdoing a legendary wielding dps ret or warrior. That is even more ridiculous.
They should remove at least 1k dps from feral if not more, they should also roll back ret since they only needed that buff to equal “warrior” back when both were bottom naxx going into ulduar. Now they are nowhere near the bottom in full bis, no matter what, not great without SM but solid midtier with it, so the buff by their own terms should be reverted.
Wdym without SM, with or without SM doesnt change the fact that Reck is 1000+dps or that with sm you in mid tier, above bottome tier without ?
The irony in you calling someone bad at math when you cant even read what i said correctly, i said 1.16k to reck and that i assumed next best glyph to reck beforehand would be 100-150 (ASSUMED) so that it would be roughly 1k. Also i am not looking at the sim i am going off the numbers on the BIS list here
where ret is 15.50k so yeah you talking about being bad at math and not knowing data is hilarious, cause clearly you dont know how to research any of this…
But keep making yourself look exactly as numbingly dumb as the portrayal of the ret discord seems to be. No wonder you are mediocree player, when all you do is throw insults haha.
Oh look. Caught you lying. Fun fun! Take that Ret -SM number and THEN subtract that thousand you claim from it. Where is that at… OH 14375, which is 25 ahead of Blood -SM-UF, and a bare 300 ahead of Arms. PRECISELY where I said it was already.
It’s almost like you’re just mentally incapable of keeping up.
COMMA, above bottom even without SM, which is true, you yourself said tied with second worst. Which is not even completely accurate either. So yeah no lie there, how are you this stupid haha.
is above 2 specs, above bottom ? Lets go back to middle school, since that all you can do, what is the bottom exactly
