Pre-Alpha Feedback: Dracthyr and Evoker

As there is no location to discuss and present early feedback for World of Warcraft: Dragonflight, I posted this to the General Discussion as there are other topics surrounding the upcoming expansion in this forum section. If this is in violate to the rules then could a moderator move this post to an acceptable location.
Thank you,
Kris


Introduction
The announcement of World of Warcraft’s next expansion, Dragonflight, was officially announced yesterday, April 19th. I watched the entire YouTube stream from start to finish, and I was extremely excited at the start. However, my mood mellowed and turned to almost indifference as the deep dive into the systems continued. I tried to understand why I felt this way; an expansion based on dragons, exploration, grounded storytelling (as opposed to the cosmic scale during Shadowlands), a dragon-themed race and class (though I do not care for the former), removal of expansion-specific systems, and a unique new features that will carry on into following expansions with - at present - cosmetic rewards? Everything looks great on paper, so why does it feel wrong to me?

There is a lot to cover on this topic, so I will be breaking it up into different parts with each one able to function on its own. For this specific topic, I will attempt to dissect the new race and class introduced into World of Warcraft: Dragonflight; the Dracthyr Evoker.


Disclaimer
As with everything I will be talking about related to the new expansion, this is all subject to change as the expansion is currently in pre-alpha.


Dracthyr: The Black Duck Race
Something about the Dracthyr just seems off when compared to the other playable races in World of Warcraft, and I believe it is a two-fold problem. Firstly is their introduction and secondly is their cosmetic appearance.

So to the first point, nearly each race in World of Warcraft has substantial lore and history within the Warcraft universe. The two exceptions are the Mechagnomes and the Vulpera. However, these two races avoid this problem by being introduced into the franchise well before their addition to being playable races: the Vulpera were added in Battle for Azeroth’s launch and the Mechagnomes were added in Battle for Azeroth’s second major content patch update - Rise of Azshara - whereas their player character availability was added late in the third major update - Visions of N’Zoth. All other races had history within this universe, with the major races dating back to its inception in Warcraft: Orcs and Humans.

The Dracthyr, on the other hand, have come out of nowhere yet are immediately playable. This sudden addition feels a little like whiplash; like they just suddenly appeared out of nowhere and are now your friends. Obviously the implementation of the Dracthyr through their unique starting experience will dampen the blow depending on execution. Overall, this may not be a big issue and one easily ignored, but it contributes to the other problems I have with this race.

So to the second point, the Dracthyr just look out of place. While there are other anthropomorphic animals as playable and even non-playable races, the Dracthyr stand out. I believe this is due to their wings, lack of armor (at least that is currently being shown), and proportions.

As to the wings, their permanent fixture prevents models being placed on their back, like cloaks and two-handed weapons. While cloaks and other back items are not a big deal, missing the weapon model on top of that (as the Dracthyr look to be wielding no or invisible weaponry) makes the race stand out from the rest. These factors make them appear as non-player characters. While the Mechagnomes lack the ability to show arm, wrist, and feet armor they are replaced with robotic parts to do not completely alter the silhouette of the model.

As to the armor, every preview I have seen of the Dracthyr lacks armor apart from a standard chest piece in different colors (with possible minor difference in shoulder flair), a crest on the head, special tabards that face only the front with straps around the back to go around the wings, and possible belts. No gauntlets? Greaves? Sabatons? It appears that the armor shown on the Dracthyr is set to specific pieces, tied to what I can only guess as either the character creation/customization window or what slots are shown in their visage form. The limited armor differences again contribute to the race feeling like non-player characters rather than actual players as they all look the same apart from differences in skin color and facial features.

EDIT: Tina Wang clarified via a BlizzPlanet interview that “the armor that [Dracthyr] wear is a type of armor that you will be able to customize at the Barbershop, too. So Dracthyr, I think they’ll also be able to wear shoulders, tabards, belts across their visage and Dracthyr form. While the visage form is able to wear all-armor.”

As to the proportions, the Dracthyr’s legs and feet look almost comically large compared to the rest of their body and especially the head. A more muscular build for the Dracthyr, even as a customization option labelled body type/shape/size/etc., would fit the fantasy of a dragon more than the slender build that looks nearly identical to a Dreadlord’s animation rig yet thinner in mass. Dracthyr also share the same model between males and females, which does make sense, but in combination with what I mentioned above makes them stand so far out from the rest of playable races that they just feel awkward.

EDIT: Tina Wang clarified via a BlizzPlanet interview that “there is more customization than what you saw in the video. There’s actually so many ways that you can customize that Dracthyr. Even the shape of the face. You can have, like these snouts that can look more ancient, or more sleek, or like a more blunt. You can even slightly change your torso to be like slightly more slender or slightly bulkier”.

I did briefly mention a racial ability, their humanoid visage, which I have other problems with.


Draconic Heritage: A Confusing Customization
The Dracthyr’s humanoid visage customization looks great, however I am weary about the specifics of its use as well as underwhelmed by their limitations. Firstly, according to the Dragonflight official site:

“Dracthyr Evokers freely switch between two customizable forms—choosing between a humanoid visage, and a fearsome draconic form to battle foes and overcome obstacles.”

My problem is with the wording as I am unsure what the exact limitations are with this ability. Are Dracthyr able to stay in their humanoid visage during combat as implied by the line “Dracthyr Evokers freely switch between to customizable forms” or are they forced to be in Dracthyr form during battle, as implied by the line “a fearsome draconic form to battle foes and overcome obstacles”? If the rules follow the former, then I have no issue. However, if the rules follow the later similar to the way the Worgen’s Two Forms works, then I have an question: Why not allow players to be in either form whenever they want?

EDIT: Tina Wang clarified via a BlizzPlanet interview that Dracthyr Evokers are “going to be in Dracthyr form when you are in combat.”

So my point stands: why not let players choose to be either in Dracthyr form or humanoid visage form during combat? Well, Blizzard’s answer seems to be based on how intrinsically tied the Dracthyr race is to the Evoker class, such as an ability called Soar that sends the Dracthyr Evoker into the air to cast while being mobile. However, a slight change to these mechanics could allow for more player freedom; have Dracthyr’s transform into their draconic form during these abilities that are tied into the race’s appearance, have the humanoid visage grow related appendages (such as wings for Soar), or use spectral versions of the Dracthyr form or related appendages instead.


Dracthyr Evokers: Restricted Access
This is hinting at a bigger issue I have with Dracthyr Evokers: the many restrictions placed upon them to be playable. Dracthyr have to be Evokers and Evokers have to be Dracthyr. The Dracthyr’s humanoid visages are set to Blood Elf for male and Human for female. Dracthyr have to choose their faction during character creation - which I understand is a new limitation brought about by the new character creation introduced in Shadowlands, but choosing to be on the Alliance or the Horde before even experiencing what is means to be a Dracthyr is insane and is the same problem I have with how Pandaren were forced down this route as well; it was much more impactful and meaningful to make that choice when it was presented to you after interacting with representatives of the Alliance and the Horde. It was more immersive and narratively sound.


Evoker: Mismatched and Missing Potential
Then we have the Evokers, which feel off due to the weird pairings of dragonflights for their two specializations and the absence of the fifth dragonflight.

Firstly, the Red Dragonflight was charged with safeguarding all life on Azeroth, to which the developers themselves admitted during the Waking Shore deep dive section. So why is it placed in the Devastation specialization for a ranged caster damage dealer instead of the Preservation specialization for a healer? As stated in the deep dive section for the Dracthyr Evoker, the red magic is supposed to be fast while blue is concentrated and overwhelming. However, swapping red for bronze magic would work just as fine for this concept as well as using the supportive role generally attributed to the Bronze Dragonflight to reduce cooldowns and speed up casting times; an interesting dynamic of quick bronze magic amplifying slow but powerful blue magic could make for a unique and fun caster play-style.

Please take my subjective view here with a massive grain of salt, as I do not play casters so I do not know how they function mechanically.

And in switching bronze for red in the Preservation specialization, the red magic can be fast but mana-intensive whereas the green magic can be slow but virtually mana-free, creating a similar feel of weaving the two primary sources of magic for the specialization to get the most out of it.

Secondly, I have to mention the absence of the Black Dragonflight in the dragon-themed class. Why is there no specialization utilizing earth, fire, and lava for a mix of defensive and offensive abilities? Narratively, Neltharion (before becoming Deathwing) created the Dracthyr Evokers by studying the primal proto drakes. There is concept for a lava primal proto drake possibly for the first raid in the expansion, so why are Dracthyr Evokers unable to use black magic? It just feels like a missed opportunity to not only have a dragon-themed race and class in melee using the staples of dragon mechanics (claws, bites, wing buffets, and tail swipes) but also the new prismatic spell effect created specifically for the Evoker is stated to use all five dragonflight magics. Why is there no use or manifestation of the Black Dragonflight then? Unless it is hidden in base abilities for the class used by both specializations, but even then it feels like a weak excuse to not develop a third specialization and implies to me that the developers were just a little lazy.


Conclusion: Possible Solutions
I went into this much detail to set up the premise, explain my grievances with the race and class, and then to propose possible changes I deem as solutions. There is a great foundation here to work with, but I feel like Blizzard missed the mark on execution; either going too far with the Dracthyr race or just dropped the ball with the Evoker class.

So, I will start with my most extreme feedback and work my way down to more reasonable. I do not expect many of these to even be considered, but I need to propose all of them to hopefully convey my full thoughts on this topic.

First and most extreme: Scrap the Dracthyr race. Entirely. Move the Evoker hero class to Human, Night Elf, Gnome, Orc, Blood Elf, and Goblin at the least. They keep the humanoid visage customization options as class-specific options. Change the starting experience to Alexstrasza, Merithra, Kalecgos, Nozdormu/Chromie, and Ebyssian teaching mortals to use draconic magic thus creating the Evoker class and explainging their draconic features. Add a dragon transformation ability for a mount that works with the Dragonriding mechanic (as the Dracthyr work in this way already) and keep the Dracthyr model as an avatar-like cooldown when the class fully channels the power of their draconic magic.

Second and slightly less extreme: Allow Dracthyr to be more classes other than just Evoker such as Warriors, Hunters, Rogues, and Mages.

EDIT: Ion Hazzikostas confirmed via a FanByte interview in regards to Dracthyr becoming more classes that “it’s definitely possible down the line.”

Third and less extreme: Add more races to the Dracthyr humanoid visages for both sexes, such as Humans, Orcs, Night Elves, Gnomes, and Blood Elves as well as allow Dracthyr to remain in their humanoid visage form through all activities including combat (some animations and the Dragonriding mechanic will still force the player into their Dracthyr form but should revert back in the case of animations once the animation is done and was activated in their humanoid visage).

Fourth and slightly extreme: Add a body type/shape/size/etc. option for not only a more muscular build, but also various other builds for Dracthyr, such as larger upper body (arms and hands), larger lower body (legs and feet, probably what is seen as of now), larger head, and combinations of the three.

Fifth and mild: The latter half of the above feedback - allow Dracthyr to remain in their humanoid visage form through all activities including combat (some animations and the Dragonriding mechanic will still force the player into their Dracthyr form but should revert back in the case of animations once the animation is done and was activated in their humanoid visage).

These are, of course, just suggestions based on my subjective view of the Dracthyr Evokers as well as the limited information we have on them. However, I hope this helps add to the discussion surrounding them and provide early feedback on Blizzard’s continued iteration and development of the new race and class.


Please feel free to add to the discussion below, as I would love to see more community opinions on the topic and continue to have conversations about the new expansion. It goes without saying, however, to keep it civil and respect one another: what you may find entertaining another may not and vice versa.
Cheers,
Kris

27 Likes

I’m right there with you on a fair bit of it.
I like the third, fourth, and fifth ones.

Dracthyr need more body options. I love the head and body on the version on the right in this image.
Imgur

These heads here, while a fine option, seem a bit too small and narrow. I want something more beefy. The red dragon there just makes me think of those little trash/rodent like dinos you see all over Zandalar.

I also agree they should be more classes. I’d prefer to see a lot more representation there.

I also like the idea of opening up the visage options to include most of the races.
The human and blood elf based versions don’t make a lot of sense anyway…if Neltharion made these 10k years ago, why are the visage options based off races that didn’t really exist at the time? High Elves came into being a bit after the sundering, and humans didn’t exist yet.

No options to make your character resemble Ysera, Noz, Ebonhorn, Alex?

Really odd.

I’m still of the mind that instead of some weird experiment that Neltharion made, I wish they were just a brood of juvenile dragons being sent out into the word to help it, learn about the mortals and such.
dragon riding mount form could have been their true dragon form.
Keep the anthro as a combat compromise alongside the mortals (not as big) or add a scaled down version of the mount form as well. Perhaps some could be druids and use that as their feral and guardian form. Dragons are magic, so scaling yourself down to better assist your allies isn’t out of the question, same for the anthro form.

Having Dracthyr only be Evokers, but having access to a racial appearance as any other race would be great, as would allowing them to be a multitude of other classes.

The whole lack of a black dragon based tanking or damage spec makes no sense.
I’d kinda like to see a tanking spec with maybe a talent option like warriors had for Gladiator, and also have Gladiator return as a talent option in the new trees.

22 Likes

I like the dracthyr they have now. Seeing them animated in the ingame footage they looked sleek and elegant. As for the face they already mentioned there are a lot of customization options that will make them look more menacing. Not to mention different body thickness.

10 Likes

You know, they did say they where going to have ‘beefier’ options as a choice for body… perhaps it will be similar to the image review you posted.

It would be pretty nice if they had both. I like both, having options is really nice since they really cannot wear gear the way base avatars in the game can.

5 Likes

I sure hope so. I’d like to see the head shaped more like that as well, I really like it.
The use of “slightly beefier” has me a bit worried though. What do they call slightly? Can we get a WIP image?

I also agree, more options is great. The original version is fine as an option.

Really don’t understand this part…I can understand it for some parts, but why restrict it so much? Most gear would work fine.

2 Likes

Apart from the fact they look out of place in WoW (they look great don’t get me wrong) and need more body types, dragons are generally masculine cause of their body designs and thus need more upper mass in both genders.

Another issue is they are incredibly Restricted, yes DHs are Felblood elves but they are also attached to Night Elves and Blood Elves who have variability in class and more importantly ROLE choice, Dracthyr Evoker is limited to 2 specs like Demon Hunters but lacks the option to play another class meaning you can never have a Draconic Tank (which gonna be Honest is what i’ve always wanted to play as), they could’ve at least given them a Tank spec to make up for the fact Dracthyr can’t even be Warriors for the tank access.

8 Likes

Many of the fan edited versions I have seen look great. More options so players have a choice at body type.

Either more class options or more options to play as differing sizes of Dracthyr and/or humanoid visages. Both would be ideal, but I think only one would be incorporated if any at all.

I found this strange as well. If these Dracthyr take on humanoid forms from ten thousand years ago, then they should be Night Elf visages. If these Dracthyr take on humanoid forms from present day, then they should have a multitude of options.

I prefer that they are not full dragons, though I would love a dragon flight form so to speak. Otherwise, everything here makes sense.

The only thing I can think of is the black magic is used for the class in utility like defensive abilities, but Blizzard certainly have enough source to make a full specialization out of just the Black Dragonflight. However this is the first I heard about a Gladiator Stance-like ability to also allow melee damage dealer role from the same specialization; and I LOVE that idea. (And the possible return of Gladiator Stance for Warriors.)

2 Likes

Can u stay in visage form? Dragon form is weird looking

1 Like

I want to see the new options before making a judgement on them.

I agree completely.

Exactly my sentiment. Well said.

4 Likes

Tina Wang clarified in an interview via BlizzPlanet that Dracthyr will be in Dracthyr form during combat.

That’s a shame

2 Likes

why don’t you at least wait until it is in alpha - they aren’t going to change anything until people experience things.

seriously, they aren’t going to do this. Just because you don’t like things doesn’t mean others don’t and they have spent all kinds of time on them already - just not going to happen.

2 Likes

We can never have anything interesting and unique in this game.

4 Likes

No one is going to really take feedback seriously until it’s actually being tested.

And even then, good luck :stuck_out_tongue:

3 Likes

So I cannot give my feedback now, I have to wait until alpha? Why?

If you read the post in full, you would realize I don’t expect this to happen but I am listing this option just to provide as much feedback as possible, even some I don’t agree with. It is called being thorough.

I don’t understand your point as there is no quote attached to this, but in the event you are responding to my feedback: I advocated for more options so more players can experience this “interesting and unique” race and class, not less players.

2 Likes

Will not deter me from voicing it, and I will continue to voice it.

3 Likes

Watering them down with extra classes and letting them fight as human or elves, which we already have a multitude of as it is, destroys their uniqueness.

It just boggles my mind the fantasy-breaking people beg for on here to have a game with werewolves and dragons, but people want to play them in human or elf form, when those races are already an option.

2 Likes