Please don’t remove Hunter pets

[Quivermethis-rexxar]

@Gwitch-skull-rock

Because it’s harmless to allow the OPTION to have a pet. Why remove something that isn’t causing harm even if it’snot used a lot. Guess we should remove all human pinky finger. It is after-all the least used and least important finger. No one needs the option to use it if they want. Goodbye pinkie.

The pinky finger provides grip improves your hand function.
And it’s not harmless. The mm pet goes against the grain in quite a few areas of mm play.

Completely different.

@Gwitch-skull-rock

Why?

Because that’s about all an mm pet is good for.
You use it to hold threat so you can stand there and dps.
It isn’t involved in your rotation like other hunter specs. If anything, it gets in the way with pathing problems and having to summon it for hero.

@Gwitch-skull-rock

SO FIX THAT WITHOUT REMOVING THE OPTION OF USING A PET.

They’ve been trying to balance this for 10+ years and have been failing.
It’s easier to just remove it for now.

They did the same with frost dks. They removed 2h frost play for a long time because it was impossible to balance with dw.

@Gwitch-skull-rock

Tell me. What negative thing happens, how would it negatively impact the majority to remove pet utility from pets but keep the option to use pets on MM?

Then it’s just existing to exist. I’d rather them cut pointless fluff.

If pets are going to exist under mm. I want them to be INVOLVED in mm. Not just sit there and tank and provide hero.

@Gwitch-skull-rock

you all anti pet hunter crowd already got the option to go petless, but that wasn’t enough for you. You now want to take away the option to use a pet.

I’m literally a bm hunter with countless rare pets lol. Heck, I’ve had my same spider since cataclysm.

So that argument doesn’t work at all with me.

@Gwitch-skull-rock

But that’s irrelevant. Emotions are relevant. People who are upset at a game or change may stop playing.

Emotion just clouds the argument and causes needless friction.
Keep the emotion in-game and away from arguments. Especially stances, because it usually just devolves to calling people shills and trolls.

@Gwitch-skull-rock

Feelings don’t care about your facts. And feelings control where people spend their money on recreation

Facts also don’t care about your feelings either. Facts dictate direction of things, usually.
Aka this very post. Most mm hunters using lone wolf, so they are baking it in.

[Rankin-shandris (Rankin)]

@Carhagen-moon-guard

The Water Elemental as a permanent summon was useless. The pathetic amount of extra DPS it offered paled in comparison to the larger amount of DPS gained if you picked the Lonely Winter talent, which most players did.

Sounds more like they need to buff pets instead of continuing to whittle away at them.

[Carhagen-moon-guard (Carhagen)]

And hunters will still have access to full pet functionality.

By playing BM or Survival.

The MM spec fantasy for years has been fighting without a pet. Whenever you summoned one, you were trading DPS for utility. Blizzard recognized this, got plenty of feedback that sacrificing DPS for utility wasn’t fun, so they’re fixing that issue by removing pets from MM hunters and giving them a spirit eagle which provides all the utility that pets provided the spec before, but without the frustration/drawback of having to stand still for 3 seconds mid-fight to dismiss the pet just so you could do proper DPS again.

This is an excellent change. But we’ll get a much better grasp on it (and I’m looking forward to doing so) when 11.1 hits the PTR.

[Quivermethis-rexxar]

@Rankin-shandris

I can have my pet out 24/7 if I so desired. It is thus an integrated part of my character that I can use for any length of time.

And you still can!.. As bm or surv.

@Rankin-shandris

Blood and Frost DKs have an optional talent to temporarily raise a minion.

Trying to say these things are equivalent is incredibly dishonest.

Trying to argue the fair comparison and calling me dishonest, is disingenuous.
I’m looking at it from what it brings to the table, to which you completely keep ignoring.

[Rankin-shandris (Rankin)]

@Carhagen-moon-guard

The MM spec fantasy for years has been optionally fighting without a pet.

Fixed that for you.

@Carhagen-moon-guard

so they’re fixing that issue by removing pets from MM hunters and giving them a spirit eagle which provides all the utility that pets provided the spec before, but without the frustration/drawback of having to stand still for 3 seconds mid-fight to dismiss the pet just so you could do proper DPS again.

I can’t use the stupid eagle to tank for me, so it is a massive loss in functionality.

[Phenomenon-hydraxis]

And why, pray tell, can’t this generic eagle #7 instead be… Oh I dunno, the very same pets we already have?

Why can’t these new changes be modified to work with the existing pets?
Is that too much to ask for a multibillion dollar company?

They’ve identified that MM hunters should have a pet. and historically have not had a pet.

[Rankin-shandris (Rankin)]

@Quivermethis-rexxar

Trying to argue the fair comparison and calling me dishonest, is disingenuous.

There’s nothing “fair” about comparing a permanent pet with a temporary minion. I’m done wasting my time with someone who can’t argue in good faith.

[Zhiyuwanju-moon-guard]

@Quivermethis-rexxar

Y’all are stuck on this premise that because it has a pet, it makes it a pet class

Just because this class uses stealth doesn’t mean it’s a stealth class. Like what is a pet class?

@Quivermethis-rexxar

Clearly dks don’t fit into that ideology because it blows up the point

No it doesn’t, DK is a minion class that can specialize into upgrading their ghoul to a pet. Multiple things can be true at the same time.

[Quivermethis-rexxar]

@Zhiyuwanju-moon-guard

DK is a minion class that can specialize into upgrading their ghoul to a pet. Multiple things can be true at the same time.

And clearly glossing over the main point I’m making. Time and time again.

[Zhiyuwanju-moon-guard]

@Quivermethis-rexxar

And clearly glossing over the main point I’m making.

You don’t have a point, you are floundering trying to get technical and failing at it.

[Carhagen-moon-guard (Carhagen)]

By the way, speaking of DKs, remember back in Wrath of the Lich King when all DK specs could tank and DPS depending on what talents you picked? Yeah that was fun, and a lot of players, myself included, enjoyed tanking with Frost or Unholy instead of Blood. Or we’d DPS with blood because that just felt cool.

Fast forward to when they changed the DK class considerably by making Frost and Unholy DPS specs, and Blood the tanking spec. Every DK player had to make a choice. Give up tanking if they wanted to play Unholy or Frost, or give up DPS if they wanted to play Blood.

Talent spec redesigns that drastically change how a spec plays have happened before and they will happen again. For now, instead of chucking a wobbly because it’s your classes turn to get hit with the redesign bat, how about you wait until you can actually test the changes, and see if you like them. You might surprise yourself.

[Snozay-area-52]

@Gah-eonar

Wish me luck, asking the girlfriend the big question on Christmas day!

DUDE I wish you the best of luck man!

@Gah-eonar

Last time we talked you were in the waiting room, anticipating a new niece, hope everything went well there too!!

Everything went well. Niece is 100% healthy!

@Gah-eonar

(Good luck in the thread)

Same to you man, especially Christmas day!

[Snozay-area-52]

@Eàu-warsong

move lust to talents and forget about it
it was iterated 100050230420341 times

And thats not the only utility that causes that.

I know your game knowledge is practically zero but I have already refuted this multiple times

[Quivermethis-rexxar]

@Rankin-shandris

I’m done wasting my time with someone who can’t argue in good faith.

Yet you are the one who continues to call me dishonest when you’ve been disingenuous for most of the thread.

Just tell me how fluffy incorporates into mm to warrant it staying.

@Zhiyuwanju-moon-guard

You don’t have a point, you are floundering trying to get technical and failing at it

I’ve had a point. Y’all keep glossing over it to attack me.
Which I find hilarious.

WHAT FUNCTIONALITY DOES THE PET BRING TO MM OTHER THAN A PLACE HOLDER?

There it’s in all caps. Thus the comparison to ghouls. It exists for mm, nothing more. It isn’t an integral part of mm play, as proven by lonewolf usage.

[Mynti-bloodhoof]

I have AOTC on my MM hunter. You?

If you think everyone’s opinion but yours is irrelevant, then maybe you should go play Call of Duty instead of WoW.

[Snozay-area-52]

@Mynti-bloodhoof

I have AOTC on my MM hunter. You?

Do you really think AOTC is a flex?

I had that week 2.

@Mynti-bloodhoof

If you think everyone’s opinion but yours is irrelevant, then maybe you should go play Call of Duty instead of WoW.

Nope I just think solo people and people who dont have a clues opinions are irrelevant.

[Phenomenon-hydraxis]

@Quivermethis-rexxar

WHAT FUNCTIONALITY DOES THE PET BRING TO MM OTHER THAN A PLACE HOLDER?

Well, with the changes you like and that are coming with the General Eagle Pet #7. A lot.

So again, why can’t these changes be slightly modified to change Generic Eagle #7 to instead be our already existing pets?

[Eternosus-galakrond (Eternosus)]

@Mkali-frostwolf

If you mean pets other than birds (or similar, e.g. wyrmlings) then yes, we’re not aligned.

I don’t share your opinion that the choice needs to be restricted in any way. But I think we have some room to discuss how best to draw lines here.

I might have suggested pets of a certain role (since that’s thematically why roles exist, to be generalizations of the iconic Rexxar beasts). But there are often discussions of unlinking families from roles. So I can see that being a sloppy slope that could lead to any pet being assigned to be the skin on the ability.

[Gwitch-skull-rock]

@Quivermethis-rexxar

And it’s not harmless. The mm pet goes against the grain in quite a few areas of mm play.

How?

@Quivermethis-rexxar

Because that’s about all an mm pet is good for.

Or Roleplaying/Flavor/Immersion but yes also that.

@Quivermethis-rexxar

It isn’t involved in your rotation like other hunter specs. If anything, it gets in the way with pathing problems and having to summon it for hero.

Then use lone wolf.

@Quivermethis-rexxar

They’ve been trying to balance this for 10+ years and have been failing.

IT DOESNT NEED TO BE BALANCED ! JUST LET LONE WOLF REMAIN META LIKE IT IS 99.9% OF THE TIME BUT LET PEOPLE USE PETS WHEN THEY WANT

@Quivermethis-rexxar

They did the same with frost dks. They removed 2h frost play for a long time because it was impossible to balance with dw.

Guess what happened next. Go on, guess.

@Quivermethis-rexxar

Then it’s just existing to exist.

Exactly.

@Quivermethis-rexxar

I’d rather them cut pointless fluff.

Why?

@Quivermethis-rexxar

If pets are going to exist under mm. I want them to be INVOLVED in mm. Not just sit there and tank and provide hero.

They don’t need to exist for you. You have lone wolf, let pet lovers keep their pets and you keep lone wolf. Why do you want others to be unhappy for something that doesn’t effect you?

@Quivermethis-rexxar

I’m literally a bm hunter with countless rare pets lol. Heck, I’ve had my same spider since cataclysm.

It does, because it’s what you’re doing.

“Oh but I like pets in bm” irrelevent. We’re talking about MM here.

@Quivermethis-rexxar

Emotion just clouds the argument and causes needless friction.

People cannot turn off their emotions. The more rational someone thinks they are, in my experience is an example of them being irrational. Humans are emotional beings and denying that will not only hurt yourself but everyone around you.

This “needless friction” is inevitable. People have an emotional connection to their pets. You can argue whatever you want about that statement but it won’t change the facts of the matter.

@Quivermethis-rexxar

Keep the emotion in-game and away from arguments. Especially stances, because it usually just devolves to calling people shills and trolls.

When have I done that in this conversation?

Try again.

@Quivermethis-rexxar

Facts also don’t care about your feelings either. Facts dictate direction of things, usually.

No facts don’t dictate anything. Facts just are. People make choices based on their emotional reaction to things which may or may not include facts.

@Quivermethis-rexxar

Aka this very post. Most mm hunters using lone wolf, so they are baking it in.

That’s fine bake it in. As long as they keep the option to summon a pet.

@Carhagen-moon-guard

The MM spec fantasy for years has been fighting without a pet

For who?

@Carhagen-moon-guard

This is an excellent change.

Unless you like using pets as MM.

@Quivermethis-rexxar

And you still can!.. As bm or surv.

People who’s ideal fantasy is being a ranger with a single pet becomes impossible.

@Carhagen-moon-guard

Fast forward to when they changed the DK class considerably by making Frost and Unholy DPS specs, and Blood the tanking spec. Every DK player had to make a choice. Give up tanking if they wanted to play Unholy or Frost, or give up DPS if they wanted to play Blood.

Not all class reworks are inherently bad. Removing choice is something I’m generally against and it would’ve been cool if all specs could tank into the future but I understand why they did it. There was a benefit to it. But there is no benefit to removing the option of a pet. There is benefit to remove the pet utility from the pet and make it hunter utility.

@Snozay-area-52

And thats not the only utility that causes that.

What’s the other ones? Andwhat can’t be moved to the hunter besides pet tanking?

@Snozay-area-52

Nope I just think solo people and people who dont have a clues opinions are irrelevant.

Yet those people play a sub. So it’s irrelevent if someone was world first mythic queen, or a random pleb. They both pay the same $15 sub.

[Mynti-bloodhoof]

People like you are what makes online games so toxic nowdays… Welcome to my ignore list.