This bug really needs to be fixed asap, its ridiculous it wasnt recognised prior to launch.
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Where twisting
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It’s almost as if it becomes second nature to those who actually play with Seal Twisting as opposed to the naysayers.
The ret rune situation makes no sense without twisting. SoM has no reason to exist as soon as DS is unlocked. DS has higher ST dps, higher burst DPS, utility through healing and of course is even better in AOE/Cleave. Even with twisting, SoM would be a marginal ST gain.
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This is precisely why by wrath, enh got dual wield, sword spec arms got nerfed to the ground, and soc got reworked while som got removed. Especially for pvp it was healthier for the game.
Ill never not remember the time cdew played tbc ret in arenas and manages to chain sealtwists perfectly yet still fail to land kills because SoC itself refused to proc before the enemy healer could heal back the kill target.
Doubly so in pvp. Nobody worth listening to likes playing with/against a ret/enh who can just gigaproc within 0.5 seconds of touching you, or the exact opposite happening - the ret/enh sitting on top of you for 15 seconds because no one peels you properly, yet he still does no damage to you because soc/wf wont proc.
As someone with as much experience/success playing TBC ret/resto as anyone in the world, hoping for RNG oneshots was the wrong way to win 90% of matchups as that comp. The RNG oneshots could happen, but ret/resto won more reliably against war/rdui playing around the insane defensive utility of the ret/offensive potential of the resto shaman and winning mana battles. Twisting was far more fun, rewarding and interesting version of Ret compared to anything from vanilla to MOP.
“OMG I MANAGED TO PRESS 1 BUTTON 0.4 SECONDS BEFORE A WEAPON SWING HAPPENS!” Relying on rng to determine if your twist would be successful is not rewarding in the slightest, and paladins in general was a meme in tbc, both ret and holy. People love to talk about the order of how you press buttons and whatnot, but never about whether the end result would be ultimately good for everyone else involved.
Because you pay $15 per month, screw everyone else, right? Especially other classes?
Also, Lol, warriors are also subject to the same rng bs, both sword spec and mace stun.
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Relying on rng to determine if your twist would be successful
Your twist is successful if both seals are up when your melee lands without delaying the melee. Is your shatter combo not successful if the frostbolt doesnt crit?
paladins in general was a meme in tbc, both ret and holy.
Ret was extremely desired in PVE to the point that sunwell speedruns were running 2 of them and was r1 viable in PVP. You are outright wrong, but still apparently have an extremely strong opinion on twisting despite knowing very little about it. Have you considered just playing DS if twisting is added so you don’t have to twist?
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Timing is literally a skill. Like, it’s outright disrespectful to make such a wantonly stupid statement.
Being a human metronome is, on it own, a skill, and the skill required to maintain the metronome increases the more additional tasks you are executing on in concert. The game has historically criminally underutilized this means of skill expression, and twisting is one of the few ways you have ever been able to do it.
You’re basically saying that drumming isn’t a skill.
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You are talking to ret paladin players. Waking on in the morning and putting socks on is an accomplishment for them.
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What I mean by rng is by SoC itself proccing. Twisting doesn’t mean anything if your SoC refuses to proc.
Shatter in wrath procced far more often and you could definitely force it to proc by using frost nova, shattered barrier talent, or pet freeze combined with deep freeze. Brain Freeze proc from wotlk is rng, but you could never oneshot someone with FFB unless the gear disparity was massive.
And dw wf procced more often too.
Didn’t bring up PvE
ret was miles behind the three strongest DPS in pvp - rogue/lock/mage. Ladder was rampant with those 3 classes, with disc and rdruid. are you seriously trying to convince me a ret could stand any chance against rogues, locks, and mages?
You either cant read or are intentionally misinterpreting everything ive said about sealtwisting and are making a strawman argument.
Please bring in the TBC Twisting with a bit of cleave so we can have it as an option instead of Divine Storm. Everyone clamoring to make Ret brain-dead with Divine Storm already has what they want since it is currently better in both single-target and cleave scenarios. In rare cases where twisting Martyrdom might pull ahead a bit, it’s so close in damage that Storm probably wins because it’s a zero-risk whack-a-mole button.
You can’t mess up Divine Storm rotation, so really, it should be the worse single-target option.
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Shatter in wrath procced far more often and you could definitely force it to proc by using frost nova
Shatter gives you additional crit chance against frozen targets. It does not guarantee your crit. Sometimes you will spam spells into a nova’d target, which will not crit. You did not “fail” your shatter combo because of RNG. It’s the same thing with twisting. All twisting properly does is maximize your chance to succeed.
are you seriously trying to convince me a ret could stand any chance against rogues, locks, and mages?
Considering I got r1 3 times as ret beating rogues, locks and mages? Yes, I am seriously telling you that ret could stand a chance against those classes.
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You beating rogues, lock, and mages who are braindead isnt indicitive of how strong your class is. Everyone with half a brain knew going into tbc that those three classes would dominate the meta, and claiming that “uhh ackshually ret is pretty strong, even though i beat a bunch of retards to get to my rank” is spitting out pure copium.
Twisting isnt as skillfull as you make it out to be, dont speak so highly of yourself.
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Speaking as a paladin player since 2008 including TBC Classic. I approve of and ask blizzard making Seal of Martyrdom & Seal of Command twistable. It would allow ret paladins to have an opportunity to make a name for their self as a dps player. Something they’ve never had before in vanilla wow.
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That is a fairly ridiculous statement considering Ret is currently the 4th highest DPS spec in SoD…there’s plenty of chances for us to “make a name” as DPS as it is…
seal twisting was clunky and annoying hopefully they leave it out.
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I loved seal twisting in BC, was excited about in SOD until I found out there’s no twisting SOC with SOB… please bring it back!
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Esfand is trying to get them to fix this from what i heard/understand
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