Personal Loot as as it is, is serviceable. It’s not 100% optimal in every scenario (trade restrictions on ilvl etc. I remember having a pair of 475 int trinkets in BFA for boomy and looting a 460 loaded dice for a friend and I couldn’t trade it. This part may have been fixed in Shadowlands, but it still exists on weapon types and what not…could be better, but like I said it’s serviceable enough for me.
I don’t see the harm in allowing full (or close to full) guild groups, especially in mythic, to enable Master Looter. There’s definitely an argument for abuse in pugs, but for tight knit guilds who play for their raid team instead of just themselves, gearing their raid as a unit is done no more efficiently than with master loot.
I’ll take personal loot over any other system. It is 100% RNG based and requires 0 outside interference, greedy officers coming up with weird systems to justify loot or GM giving loot to their friends/partners is just ridiculous.
Master Loot would be suitable for the super hardcore guilds but will fail almost 100% of the time in a more casual environment in SL. With the scarcity of the drops and the amount of raiders that participate its just a recipe for disaster.
How is master loot of group loot any different? They either give all the pieces to the buyer or just roll pass…
No one is entitled to someone elses loot, again I would rather a selfish person not trade me loot they don’t need over some simp GM giving loot to his girlfriend. If you have ever been an officer or GM back when ML was in the game you’d know that the entire system was a complete nightmare.
Master loot would make 0 difference to boosting if anything it would make it even easier to sell boosts as the booster’s characters would not even need to be fully geared before trading their gear. I’ve experienced WAY more issues with ML and GL over personal loot by a long shot. From ninja looting to bias loot distribution it is legit a guild breaker.
Group loot is a MEGA YIKES, lets let all the selfish people roll for things they don’t really need or troll roll for things.
I dont think so. A guy who buy carries need to upgrade 15/16 slots. He needs to buy 16 runs of M+15… 16x$20 around $320 but 16 runs cant fill out the whole 16 slots becoz of random slot duplicates on loots. Spending $320 is not fun. And even if you get ilevel 220 thru carries, you wont beat M+15 or Heroic Sire on your own PuG becoz you would be destroyed thru lack of skills. Playing WoW is suppose to be fun thru its adventure. There’s no adventure on paying carries and it’s not fun. You cant even boast for your achievement becoz people wont acknowledge it becoz you know you dont deserve it.
I think the exact logic behind the removal they used was they wanted to get rid of split raiding.
Bosses no longer have a fixed drop pool, and possible loot drops will change dynamically based on who is assigned loot. For example, a cloth player wouldn’t be assigned plate. Also, as an example a cloth player in a majority plate/leather raid would be significantly less likely to see upgrades compared to a raid composed of more cloth characters.
To conceptualize why this incentivizes boosting, lets use an example: if I made a raid of only druids - only druid items would drop. This may not seem like a big deal, but for highly sought after items with powerful bonuses tripling or quadrupling the chance you could get them by paying for a funnel is a big deal.
Masterloot did far, far more damage to the game than personal loot ever could.
and I don’t think they should get rid of the PL upgrade restriction but maybe make it a buffer, because after a point I don’t care what the stats are, the primary stat increase is better.
That occurred before personal loot was in the game. I remember having raids that we basically ran to gear up one or two player and everything went to them. And I know guilds were selling runs even back before personal loot came into the game. And poor player behavior is not up to Blizzard to police, that is up to the guild they are raiding with. If they are not pulling their weight, you bench them until they do.
Unless you’re in an actual guild that’s pushing progress and decides loot on how it will best increase the performance of the raid as a whole… I really wish they’d give an option to turn on master loot for groups that are 100% guild
The trade restrictions are better for the health of the game. The health of the game takes precedence over what any individual player wants or needs.
While ML might be better for guilds or mythic guilds or whatever little pool you want to narrow it down to. The fact remains that it creates problems for the whole rest of the game and it’s players.
PL is uniform, simple, and gets the job done without any GM intervention or messy tickets.
I agree with the moral statement that gold-based runs are toxic and by their nature pay-to-win, but I disagree with the outcomes.
My argument is that the game is inherently already pay to win, and that is why Blizzard would justify taking an existing, working system and making it systematically accessible to players. This is a similar implementation fashion with RIO and before that Gearscore.
Again, the nature was not to debate the moral virtue or vice of GDKP as a system, only that it seems to be keeping Classic players engaged in raid structures well beyond their normal power scaling participation curve and that in retail, it would enable token sales (incenting devoted players and the company roughly equally) much the same boost communities already do, and may favor a positive price pressure onto the US-server tokens.
I don’t see this at all, but would be happy to better understand the perspective. Right now, you can pay about the cost of a token for a “loot-crate equivalent” of gear. If anything, the random nature of potentiality of items, versus the actuality of items, pushes the game farther into “pay-to-win” (playing odds, gambling) than it would for concrete, actual returns with fixed costs (literally the same as purchasing an item from the AH).
As noted, I don’t think there’s a perfect system. But wonder if there’s a way to minimize the damage potential by the currently existing one. I can try to itemize the “problems” I’m referencing instead of pointing toward a solution, if that helps. Something like…
illicit gold sales are more cost efficient than what Blizzard can offer,
geared players need a reason to engage and token purchases mitigating subscription costs are a reasonable way to maintain engagement,
boost and carry spam are one of the top concerns of players looking to experience the game socially already.
If we zoom out further than loot modes, I think loot scarcity as we know it is an increasingly dated concept.
Why force it to be a binary choice between personal progress and guild progress? We could have both. Add currencies that accrue from raid participation. Add craftables that are made with materials gathered in raid instances. Add mechanics that let guilds earn extra chances at loot for the whole raid. Lots of things that could be done to ensure that nobody walks away from the raid truly empty-handed… even if it’s just incrementing a progress bar, that feels a hell of a lot better than making no progress at all.
I’m not saying get rid of personal loot. I simply want players to have the option to choose what they do with their loot. Right now, I don’t have a whole lot of choice in what happens with my “personal” loot because of all these absurd stipulations placed on every single slot and type. It’s asinine and results in a lot of wasted loot.
