Ya know, I was gonna call out Aki for the ridiculous solution of “just don’t play the game lol” before I realized that’s probably the best advice ALL of us could use here.
I think I’m gonna go play SWTOR now.
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Sorry, I wasn’t clear; I mean if she’d done that without ever being made warchief. Someone else takes over as warchief, if they have to kill Vol’jin. Meanwhile, Sylvanas tells Nathanos or whoever to look after the Forsaken because she needs to go do things. Then we have the whole mystery of what she’s doing, with clues in every patch so we don’t get bored waiting for it.
First, I just don’t find Saurfang an interesting or inspiring leader after the whole Stormwind disaster of a storyline. I can’t work up any excitement about his rebellion. And second, it won’t fix the War of Thorns or anything in patch 8.0.
I’m not interested in the current story. I don’t want to be dragged into this war with the Alliance, I’m bored with rebellion, and I find Sylvanas a lot less interesting as an evil warchief than Garrosh was.
I dunno, I’m okay with the Zandalar story, even though it’s mostly failing at every turn until we fight G’huun.
Then we just have a difference of opinion, because I don’t think the Horde becomes remotely interesting until the Warcraft 3/Vanilla story. Maybe fun in a “let off steam” kind of way, but not really interesting.
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Because it is. If horde were supposed to have this choice from the beginning, you’d have had some choices before. The alliance also would be seeing quests like this, probably as a mass effect paragon/renegade theme to the alliance: both getting it done but one is a lot more visceral.
This choice is the devs going, “oh ***, we made the horde terrorists instead of warriors and they hate it. We gotta give them an out.”
Yes, terrorists. Capturing Teldrassil would be an act of war, but burning it down was simple, short sighted terrorism. That’s why it’s left such a bad taste in the mouths of many horde players.
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I think if I had to tell a story from Legion forward, I would have kept Vol’jinn alive (Might have killed Thrall on Broken Shore, if a Horde death was necessary). Still have Sylvanas doing her Stormheim stuff (in secret). Then probably pull another Wrath Gate like event that forces the Horde into another War with the Alliance.
This is assuming that BfA HAD to be BfA. If I had complete creative control, I think the faction conflict would be near nonexistent at this point, most of the contention existing between Humans and Forsaken.
That’s fair…
But he is going to be the center of your Heroic feel-good moment. You being uninspired by him is kind of your issue.
There are things I find interesting. But I agree that much of it could of been handled better. I think the Horde has it better from an RP perspective. Alliance side, it’s just “We need to stop the Horde!” And that’s it. Horde side, you at least have the opportunity for nuance. It’s not so cut and dry, and you have the opportunity for some interesting perspectives and storylines.
The questlines for Zandalar and Kul Tiras are the best parts of BfA thus far.
How? You have a choice, not the illusion of one.
I really think what I want to see is for Anduin to finally lose X, someone or something so important that when Mathias Shaw, Genn, Rogers, Jaina, etc. comes up and suggests an attack plan, that he will turn to them and go,
“You have my authority as the High King, and here is thing I need you to do as well.”
With the Vulpera, it would have been nice to have had Shaw talk about sabotage only for Anduin to agree to destroying the caravans, despoiling the supplies, and then also adding, “Take some of them as Prisoners of War and bring them back to Stormwind. If they resist, you have permission to make an example.”
As you go out to do the first part, you then come across Vulpera and you get a choice to offer them - Flee, Capture, Kill.
And if you choose capture, a prison area close to the stockades will start to become more populated if you choose to do this part.
If we’re going to do some grey area stuff, I want it to come from the top of the list and not a stooge that the blame can be layed on.
Sorry for the necro. Blame the suggested threads feature.
However, this point sort of dovetailed with my own, but for the purposes of this. I’m going to write this as though it were a new thread.
People have at times have accused me of being a Night Elf Stan. In reality. I consider myself a Night Elf Matthew.
Confused? Let me clear that up:
Content warning: Language, Homophobia
This at the present time is what I view as the most likely route to Alliance villainy. Matthew Mitchell is of course, not a good person. His motives don’t line up with his target, and yet he feels motivated to do what he does because his target may be seen as responsible for his own pain. I feel that the Alliance in some respects can be cast in the same light as this. While the Horde has (allegedly) changed, they may still be viewed as responsible for some immense atrocities. But this is where I’ve encountered resistance with the Horde playerbase, and I think it can be exemplified best as follows:
But in my head there’s a voice in the back and it hollers:
“I AM YOUR LACK OF A CONSCIENCE!”
I’m the ringing in your ears.
I’m the polyps on the back of your tonsils eating your vocal cords after your concerts.
I’m the time that’s almost up that you haven’t acknowledged.
Grab for some water, but I’m that pill that’s too jagged to swallow!
I’m the bullies you HATE. That you BECAME.
Honestly, the song is going to do this feeling more justice than I can convey here, but I hope you get the point. The most understandable path to Alliance villainy comes from an understandable place, a deserved place - and while I certainly feel like I’ve been on the receiving end of this as a Night Elf fan, because we DO get used for the Horde’s motivation quite a lot - I also realize that Horde players by and large do not want to revisit what Blizzard has established as their faction’s atrocities.
So, ultimately I’m necroing this thread to ask: how do we get past this? Is there a way past this?
You should of just posted a new post with a reference link to this one.
And frankly, this entire thread was just a record of the worst writing ideas imaginable, so you would of been better off completely removed from it.
Eh, if you create a new thread on an old topic, you get lit up for it.
If you necro the old topic, you get lit up for it.
I chose the latter approach this time because there’s some context that I want to import. Other than that? My critics will come after me regardless.
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No new ideas:
- make a decision on what the game is about. Is this a game about factions? Is this a game not about factions? Going back and forth just dilutes the resources and makes both paths worse. Understanding the direction will be a major stepping stone in gradual and long turn to unify the message of gameplay and story.
- blizz is not the only company in the world that works with old IP and established audience. There are other ways to handle it, not just “do whatever, regardless of the playerbase”. For example
“you have to come from a different angle. You have to be super true to the plane [replace with whatever is meaningful for the WoW story], but you have to not figure out what the plane is exactly - you have to figure out what the plane means to people.”
- If there is a lot of free time at some point, there is good (IMO) presentation that I would use as a basis for both gameplay design and story revision. I think both elements co-exist and connected.
Once again, not WoW, but IMO a solid foundation for where to start the concept.
Overall, if I could make a call on where to go, that would be an exploration of why people liked the things to begin with, and then the story would be going through what it became to restore the basics, where the previous (sort of) iteration of the story was, W3-TBC concepts, carefully considering WotLK ideas. And then to go from this onward.
gl hf
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Well, Rito is theoretically working on an MMO and to their credit, they do put in a lot of love into their world (Well, at least when it doesn’t have to do with Skarner. Free my boy Rito).
My advice? We all shut up and bear Papa Blizz’s wild ride until we can skip on out to Runeterra and all roll Shurimans together or something.
Nothing can give the Alliance what they want without damaging the Horde further and the Horde can’t be free from their nonsense because of the Alliance’s demands. If these last few months have taught me anything, it’s that.
Maybe I’ll be a Noxian. Lean into that bad guy energy.
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perhaps the current narrative team can’t. Doesn’t mean there is inevitability in any of it. W3 did not happen in 1 go. But we got a good story eventually. And it grew from the story where originally the horde was just some monsters from hell.
IMO the horde can’t be free because of the devs’ actions. And stubborness in sticking to the narrative the playerbase is unhappy with.
Idk, maybe you’re right in a way. To me though what I see is that the devs don’t get what they’re dealing with.
It’s a big fictional world with many details people know and love. But to the devs there are “favorite kids” and everything else that can be used to push their preferred characters and stories.
Those 2 IMO can’t work together. For the audience that exist, it would require a different story team that would realize that now is not the right time for the devs’ likes and dislikes.
gl hf
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How the actual hell do you people even find these threads to necro?
It wasn’t even a good thread!
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Please buy a third album.
Are you sure Runeterras is capable of satisfying the majority of fans of the WoW races? It’s all human. Let’s say Piltover and Zaun are goblins and gnomes. Ishtaal are trolls. The draenei will go to Targon. Noxus and Demassia are humans and orcs. Goblins might go to Bilgewater. Freljord are worgen. Shurima will attract the Highborne. Ionia for the pandaren. Elves … elves are likely to scatter around the world.
Mda. Did I just kill my own question? We need to consider why Runeterra is worse than Azeroth.
Mostly yeah, but there are a few different races. Runeterra has it’s own Trolls (Trundle), the Ascended and Darkin (Which were humans), the Vastaya, the Brackern, Yetis, Minotaurs, and w/e the Voidborn are.
Everyone will likely by playing humans of the different realms/the vastaya/and maybe the ascended or iceborn in the MMO. But this is Riot, they do whacky things.
End of the day though, Riot has actually made a genuine effort to expand their story and so far, they’re doing alright. They’ve created an interesting world and i look forward to what they do with it once we can get down and explore it.
Now give me playable Brackern Rito. No balls.
But all the Brackerns are asleep (except Skarner). And it seems that Piltover is taking apart the sleeping Brackerns into crystals.
All Brackerns are crystal scorpions, right? No matter how it turns out that scorpions are just fighting animals of crystal people.
But the Ascended Ones are demigods or something similar to them, aren’t they? Allowing them to play for such power … Although they are being killed by the Abyss.
There are only four True Cold Ones, aren’t they? Ash, Sejuani, Lissandra and the freezing girl from Lissandra’s story? Or is that girl Lissandra?
the alliance is already morally grey. play as a horde charcter for any real length of time and you find out they do just as many stupid amoral things as the horde. the horde just doesn’t bother hiding it.
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I know you are a troll with a very, very simple view of the matter.
No, this is too easy of an answer. I know that Horde players by and large don’t want to deal with what BFA left us with, but if you are concerned with the health of the game, which I am, “let it rot before jumping to something else because I think we can’t solve this problem without the Horde having to give something to the effort” is not a solution.
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I just want the Horde to stop being so damned easy to manipulate.
There are four and argueably five races in the Horde with legitimate reasons for hating and wanting revenge on the Alliance.
Darkspear trolls
Zandalari trolls
Blood Elves
Goblins
Vulpera
However, the Blood Elven leader Lor’themar Theron, wouldn’t just blindly go into a war, nor would Baine, that is a lack of proper writing for these characters, especially as seeing that there was no resistance, at all, towards the war. No pulling away your forces, you just shut up, fall in line, and do as you are told - this despite Lor’themar himself threatening to kill Sylvanas back in Siege of Orgrimmar - so much bravado.
That is just one example of lore being pitifully written. I like Sylvanas’ reasoning, but the moment Teldrassil was burned was the moment when we needed better clarification, as to why Baine and Lor’themar, as two examples, did not just pull out of the Horde and let Sylvanas deal with her little screw up on her own.
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