ht tps:/ /imgur.com/xFk DnJh This 1 shot 5 people (including me) followed up by a 10k judgement…
Sorry, don’t know why it posted on my mage.
How is a 15k hit one-shotting anybody?
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Probably because he was on his 160 ilvl mage with 20k Heath
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Actually it was on this DH and they did a 21k aoe spell then followed it up with a 10k hammer crit. I probably shouldn’t have posted this here since Ret Paladins will defend this damage till then end but whatever.
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So to be clear, when you said you got “1 shotted”, you mean they used at least 3 attacks, two of them with long cooldowns, and got multiple crits. Almost certainly this was during wings. Meanwhile you evidently did not CC them, trade a defensive cooldown, or get away. So yeah, you died. That’s what is supposed to happen in that situation.
I’m not saying Ret is fine in PvP. It isn’t. But if Final Reckoning got hit with a hefty 30% nerf, you’d have still died. When the opponent has every cooldown up and you have no answer or counterplay, you lose. That’s how PvP works.
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A whole 2 people responded to you and you already go to “all ret paladins will defend this damage till the end”.
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So you died to Avenging Wrath, likely Seraphim, Divine toll, a crit Hammer of Wrath, and a Crit final reckoning.
Man used 3 hp on Seraphim (quickest way is a wake of ashes 45s cd, same as Seraphim) Two 1 min cd spells ( Final reck, and divine toll) and a 2min cd Avenging Wrath.
At which point hes burned all of his damage potential for the next 2 minutes. Can’t fire mages also nuke someone down in 6 gcd’s like this paladin, but from ~40yrds away, or boomkins in literally 1.5seconds using convoke?
Have you considered using a defensive CD when the Walking Sun starts swinging hammers at your head? Cause its very easy to notice a Ret Paladin with their offensive CD’s activated.
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Yes I got hit with crusader strike a few times so I was at less than my max hp.
Long cd? Pally doesn’t have a CD longer than what DH has except Bubble and LOH and one of them you can’t even use in rated PvP. Yes this was during wings, I did cc them but you know they have bubble? Sure let me just use my blur and darkness, oh wait I did. So I am supposed to die with 0 counter? Nice balance.
That 10 page essay you’re writing there Rav better have notations and proper sources.
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Yes, if you answer a Ret popping every single cooldown on you and even bubbling offensively with a 20% wall and some RNG mitigation, and don’t even get out of range, you are indeed supposed to die. Especially when that RNG doesn’t favor you and the Ret gets a bunch of crits. That’s not “with 0 counter”, but in this particular case you did not actually produce a counter.
Ret in particular is overtuned right now, sure. But even with better tuning, you would often die there anyway. Nobody cares that you lost a single fight to a few crits in a row. Anecdotes are not a coherent way to think about game balance.
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I love you Blizzard. Seeing the DH down so sad now since their entire expansion superiority in BFA, love itttt. Paladins aren’t the only class doing this btw, pretty much every FOTM class is doing this rn.
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Run where? A ret can out run me if they have double steed when in an arena. I produced all I could, all the spells that did the most were ranged so it’s not like kiting can even do anything if I was able to get away from two steeds and 30% move speed freedom.
Yes I would die there because ret is overtuned, thank you for agreeing. Nobody cares that they can get crit for 21k followed by a 10k while all that is ranged and then get followed up with a 15k TV? I’m sure there are plenty of people that care. Not an anecdote when I could go find a similarly geared ret to the one I fought and they can do the same damage.
This is super ironic considering Holy, Prot, and Ret were all good in BFA too. Even if you want to argue that Prot and Ret were bad you still have Holy which has been better for longer than DH has been around. This is why I say that a lot of Paladins will defend this damage because they just see “Demon Hunter” and start drooling thinking about insulting my class even though they had a spec as strong, if not stronger, than me. I didn’t even play DH in BFA…
Divine toll applies judgment to all 5 characters, boosting damage. Final Reckoning boosts the damage of holy power spenders by 30%. Seraphim and wings give +33% mastery and 28% crit chance. Combine that boosted Divine Storm by a well placed Wake of Ashes into a slightly less boosted Divine Storm and you’re dying if you aren’t taking it seriously.
Basically you guys all bunched and got hit by the perfect opener.
I’m not a fan of paladin being about the 1-minute CD kill windows, however the only thing you can do is trade into it and then take advantage of the next 35-50 seconds when they aren’t available.
Blizz has poorly designed our class and people are only recently becoming aware of just how poorly. I’ve said it in the past and I’ll say it again: Ret Paladin needs a rework. No class should be designed around killing people and then doing nothing until they can kill again, it’s not fun.
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While I think you made a very strong point with HPal, I am going to strongly disagree. Ret was nothing close to “good” in BFA. It was completely bottom mid tier, a class you could jokingly laugh off their wings in an infinite kite then finish them off. Prot paladin wasn’t in a great place either in my experience with the M+ or raid scene either.
I’ll concede there are some ridiculous kills right now, primarily in DV if we hit the lotto and it goes brrrrr. However, I’m sure most of us would gladly give up RNG DV for a more consistent spell.
Anyways I think you are taking a circumstance of the perfect opportunity from this ret wrong. I guarantee he had Wings + Sera + DV up when he did this to you, prolly even mixed in the good ol Blinding Light cheese (holy dmg def needs to break this, so broken lol).
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Since you said this dude killed 5 people, I’m pretty sure you weren’t in an arena. So “away from the other 4” would have been a good place to run, since then he wouldn’t get to cleave you all down - either he would have to waste time chasing you, or he would have to let you go.
In an arena, around a pillar would be a good place to go. Steed is a strong sprint, but it also only lasts 3 seconds, and is on the GCD. If you can get the opponent to burn two GCDs trying to chase you, that’s two more GCDs for your healer to react, and two GCDs closer to the end of their cooldowns and offensive use of bubble.
In general, if you find yourself complaining that it’s impossible to get away from one of the least mobile melee classes in the game, you need to stop and examine your own play.
Right, Ret certainly is overtuned, as is burst damage in general right now. But you died to Final Reckoning. That’s not a finisher, that’s the setup. This particular death is not a tuning issue; you were nowhere close to living through this, and even nerfs on par with the rogue or MM nerfs would not have saved you here.
I agree that 21k crits from instant AoE abilities are fairly absurd, but even without that, you still would have died a few GCDs later to multiple buffed TVs, whichever of Wake or Divine Toll he hadn’t already used, and another hammer. If you just let him do it, that’s a mistake; if you don’t have a way to prevent him from doing it, then the opponent has successfully gotten you to commit those resources earlier in the match without committing their own, ie, you got outplayed. Either way, you are supposed to lose.
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So from all accounts of this guys story, hes complaining because he let a Ret paladin set up for 8+ seconds before said ret paladin effectively used his cd’s to nuke a team.
At what point to threads like this become trolling instead of people merely complaining about interactions they don’t understand?
Like I did cry and moan about how strong DH were in BFA, but thats because they managed to out sustain my crappy dps as a ret that wasn’t raiding; but I didn’t hop on the forums and demand nerfs because I knew that if my team focused better we could have killed them.
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He was readying to run away and cry before the fight even began.
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Oh no the stars aligned and you got destroyed, if that happens every game maybe you should start being thinking about what the problem really is, YOU or them? Lets mention the fact you are below 1400 which is basically GIVEN to everyone. If you think the class is so broken why don’t you try and play it, my guess is you’ll be stuck at the same rating.
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To be fair, DH is absolute dog water rn, I literally see them and get hype for free kills. It is always funny people scream ret is OP because they get destroyed by a lotto system 8 second setup. There is a reason we saw like zero ret representation in AWC finals.
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