L M A O
Dude says old flight require motor skills 
mount > space bar > auto run > leave the room
Old flight not only DOESNT require ANY motor skills…you arent even required to be in the room
Can someone check is post history and see if hes one of them that has complained about 'AFK flying" ?
That would really ice the cake on this one lol
NVM…I had to check and see…literally just did it.
My sides are busting lmao
Islands, visions, torg, dungeons, raiding and even pvp have all also been apart of the main story line…
Hey, out of context quoting is fun… try reading my entire post.
Well, when I looked at the other guys post, your blocked post was visible too so I may as well respond.
So…the ONLY people actually affected with this PF is literally the small percent saying they are having trouble with dragonriding.
How do we know this?
Because WE are all flying on dragons and have been since day one.
Even new players could come in, realize DRing is too much for them and BOOM…WEEKS of grinding for normal flight while their dragonmount is right there ready to be used if they could.
So Im sorry, but given the details here, Ion leaves no choice BUT to assume PF is targeting the lesser abled group.
To say otherwise is to accuse the man of not being intelligent enough to figure it out…and I doubt that is the case.
But they all also require the same skill set that you’ve needed to stop Kobolds from stealing candles in Elwynn Forest. The problem isn’t that DR requires an entire new skill set from anything else we’ve ever seen OR that it was required for the story. Either of those things would be fine if the other wasn’t simultaneously true. The issue is both are true at the same time.
What part did miss? The premise of this thread is that for a portion of players, dragon riding is not fun, difficult or impossible. Many have stated that this portion is small and PF should not exist to target this small group.
Your post speculates that PF is here to increase engagement in parts of the game that are not seeing much play.
Why would this be the reason? How can PF at the same time, impact so few, yet be designed to appreciably move the needle on metrics? If the goal is metrics, wouldn’t they be better off adding something that targeted a larger group and would improve metrics more?
Mate, what are you guys out here doing with dragon riding? Am I doing it wrong? I point my mouse in a direction and hit space bar and maybe one or two other key binds every 10-20 seconds.
Look, I get disabled players have challenges, and can be affected more so than others by certain requirements. But your position here is a pure straw man argument while simultaneously claiming a moral high ground to disparage legitimate discussion refuting it.
Cheers.
PF affecting a small portion of the player base was not part of my point. I can see how my lack of clarity would lead you to conflate the two.
To clarify, I speculate many people want normal flying in DF and thus presents and opportunity for Blizz to move the needle on under utilized systems.
They never seem to ask, “Why aren’t they engaging with it?”
As someone who did that stuff already in this expansion, the open world questing content in DR definitely has a noticeably shorter window of relevance than previous expansions.
The big bad of launch has been canonically dead for months. The black dragon family feud was resolved in an entirely predictable way. The centaurs are barely used after the Oh’naran Springs campaign. Same for the Tuskaar. The renown rewards are fluff and a trickle of profession points. The four catch-up systems we have had so far (in under a year!) blow away any gear from questing or renown, and as the game scales to the gear, there’s no need to upgrade gear until level cap. I leveled an alt through DF with heirlooms that weren’t even DF level and nothing bad happened. I was gathering catch-up gear from events while leveling through world content and she was ready to go when she dinged 70 and wasn’t even halfway through the campaign. The catch-ups are coming so fast the Forbidden Reach has been a dead zone for months.
For the people who have challenges with Dragonriding due to disability, Blizzard did post accessibility changes for the Dragonriding system on the PTR this week. If y’all are willing to test out the changes I’m sure the feedback would be appreciated.
The skill required isn’t just what buttons you press, but also being able to process the information on the screen. We’ve never been able to move this fast, leading to many players needing to make decisions faster than a lot of specs need for play.
Motion sickness is also a real concern due to the sheer speed. Even when dragon riding slowly, depending how far you need to go you can run out of vigor if you can’t handle a certain amount of speed.
And for some it’s even worse than this. There are players whose motion sickness is so bad they can’t even watch where they’re going with legacy flying. However, due to how passive that mode is, they can look at the sky and use their minimap to fly, using keys to adjust course if needed. This is basically impossible with DR, and even if you could figure out a way for it, there are so many mountains and peaks and towers there’s a good chance something will quickly come into frame while looking at the sky that will risk causing the motion sickness.
Agreed.
And Money says that the people avoiding DRing are likely avoiding ALL content they can that also requires much dexterity / motor skills / etc because that is literally the problem theyre having
Those jump puzzles in ZM come to mind.
My reflexes are pretty good and some of those even annoyed me.
I cant imagine someone having fun with that who actually have problems.
I can imagine them just skipping it entirely and doing something else they enjoy.
Old flight requires nothing more than a key press to mount. A spacebar press to get off the ground. And your autorun bind clicked once you aim in any direction.
That aint happening with DRing and everyone here knows it.
Yes, there are just as complicated things in the game as DRing…NO ONE said otherwise. Tell that poster that fact.
edit…
This topic is worn thin and Im sick of listening to the trolling at this point
old fight is coming.
thread muted
Yes. But pvp, m+. raiding and many of the mini games have as well.
You mentioned that the core gameplay loop has not changed in 20 years. You don’t see that as a problem? How are we going to attract new players or keep players with a game that isn’t evolving? When new games with awesome graphics or new gameplay like mk1 or sf6, vr games, starfield, armored core 6 etc exist?
Or are we all just comfortable watching this game slowly die?
They were frustrating and challenging. I found them fun. Logic like this is how we go from legion kt quests to bfa turtle quests and people complaining about how dumb and boring the bfa quests are.
I agree with this. But we are in a thread complaining about new/ returning players not getting PF for weeks because of renown grinds and saying that is bad. But we are going to lock relevant gear or other rewards behind it?
I’m not Blizzard. I don’t have to sell anyone on the idea that everything locked up in Pathfinder is worthwhile.
For those players who’ve skipped out on that content so far and not felt like they were really missing out on much? They’re right, and they only get more right as time goes by and that content’s importance fades dramatically with each patch.
If DF’s renown system is what renown is supposed to be like in the absence of anything like Shadowlands’ soulbind upgrades and whatnot tied to it, I don’t think renown has to exist at all. It’s another overengineered solution in search of a problem.
These are all valid points but off topic. Nowhere have I disagreed with your assessment that legacy flying is old and outdated. Nowhere did I claim it was good for Blizzard to bring back legacy flying from a long term game design perspective. Yes, sometimes to move a game forward you have to develop things that have additional complexity from what existed before, especially in a game that will be 20 years old next November.
But at the end of the day, this topic is about the requirements for unlocking legacy flying when it does come to Dragonflight. Blizzard confirmed that it was coming shortly after the expansion launched. Whatever design concerns might exist from this relic of the past have already been weighed and the devs decided it was better to have it than not. Whether you or I or anyone else thinks this might not be the best approach is irrelevant to the mechanism required to unlock it. If you made or responded to a post about outdated mechanics Blizzard is holding onto, I wouldn’t be arguing any of these points.
With that said, given that legacy flying will be coming, its unlock cost being PF is an intriguing decision. For players who greatly prefer DR, like myself, this is totally irrelevant. I’ll likely get the achievement by happenstance but having legacy flight won’t make any different in my enjoyment of the expansion. For players who are behind on PF unlocks due in part to an inability to DR, the unlock would likely make a difference in their enjoyment and they also will have the most effort to get the achievement from this point.
That’s why I take exception with the PF requirement. It’s not hard to think that Blizzard strung those players along thinking they could pretty seamlessly log into 10.2 and experience the things they missed so far from not having DR only to now pull the rug out from under them given how little the PF unlock will mean to anyone who can and likes DR.
I feel bad for the disabled, how ever I could care less that the returning player or new players having to play catch up. They get no sympathy from me.
So… what’s the plan? We want content that is long lasting but not long enough that we get bored… engaging/ challenging but not hard enough so that everyone can do it… and rewarding but not so much that it causes fomo or requires new/ returning players to actually do it…
Good luck finding anything that meets that expectation.
That is my point. Why are we spending time subverting every design decision so that it’s got a backdoor anchoring game design to 20 years ago.
This is no different than the other thread discussing why the events don’t have better rewards or why the graphics are outdated.
And it’s the same response. If they try upgrading graphics, people complain that they can’t run wow on a toaster anymore. If they add better events, people complain about fomo and what about returning players missing out.
If they try to undo pruning or update gameplay mechanics or make give flying actual gameplay it’s labeled anti something.
All while we watch the game slowly die and wonder why as new games do all of this bigger and better.
Like I said, this is a great point, and I’m truly with you on that. It’s just that the design has already been decided to add legacy flight to DF, regardless whether that decision is good. Given that the design is coming, restricting its use in a way that largely only affects the people who need it in the first place does nothing but create anger.
Who is we?
Content losing its value over time is not an unnatural expectation. Letting world content just kind of peter out unless it was specifically being used to catch-up players for a raid was Blizzard’s SOP up through Mists. Now, Blizzard lets the raid-prep stuff just kind of peter out instead.
This entire discussion arose because of Blizzard not enabling regular flight sooner, and now wanting to turn it on, but also to make it inconvenient, when its past reasoning for doing so was quietly taken out back and shot in the head last November. Pathfinder does not make content relevant, only mandatory. The storyline continuation/resolution is what makes the stories of that older content irrelevant, just as catch-up mechanics make the rewards for that older content irrelevant.
If a player can find some personal relevance in that old content, more power to them, but that’s up to the player, not the developer declaring something is still important.
That’s your expectation, not mine.
I don’t think players being left to their own devices in the least valuable content of the game is some kind of problem to be fixed. Players are capable of making their own fun, fun in which progression isn’t even a concern. The more they can do for themselves means the less the developers have to split their time and energy micromanaging the open-worlders while creating stuff for the progression-centric content that actually drives the patch cycle. This was how WoW up through Mists worked.
Then we as players, giving feedback, are choosing to ignore the success of classic and hardcore. The success is temporary to be fair, because without an evolving endgame their isn’t anything to do at max level.
But classic players are talking about how alive and vibrant the open world is. And how great a community and experience it creates.
But any attempt to bring that to retail is shot down.