This! Let’s support each other.
4 Likes
You could literally make this argument about anything or any class/spec other than destruction lock and bm hunter.
Just buff by 20%
spriest
disc
demo lock
aff lock
frost mage
arcane mage
fire mage
etc…
You buff everyone 20%, except for the people at the top, and your rankings don’t move. Your range is lower, which sounds nice, but now the raid 3000 more dps, and the bosses are melting. Suddenly mechanics don’t matter much, because the boss dies too fast, and the healers can’t run oom. And nowo now healing is just a spamfest again., and that’s basically ruined.
What a great plan.
1 Like
This is inflammatory trolling. If your only goal is to aggravate people, perhaps you should find a forum that allows it.
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No, you just don’t like the facts, so you downvote and report everyone that isn’t an alt saying how great this is.
You buff one low dps, then what justification do you have to deny the others? Either way you have nerfed the entire game.
If all you care about ais the dmg meter, then pick another class. Why is this hard? The dmg meter literally doesn’t even mean anything. Everyone knows that the specs aren’t equal, which is why everyone compares parses of the same specs. You will never beat the locks, but you an still be a 99% ret.
edit: Actually I got a much better idea. Instead of trying to make the game easier, why don’t you start a crusade to get the hunters, t6 rogues, and locks nerfed instead? Then all the hybrids look better comparatively, and the content isn’t made faceroll?
2 Likes
Noone likes nerfs and i haven’t heard anyone here calling for other classes to be reduced. Let them have their fun on the meters. I think a lot of people who like twisting are more interested in the improved level of engagement.
The non twist paladin rotation consists of 1 strike on a 6 second cooldown and a combination of an off GCD judgement paired with a GCD reseal every 8 seconds. This works out to 7 button presses every 25 GCDs or roughly 11 APM. Twisting brings this up to 2 out of every three GCDs are utilized for 16 button presses in that same 25 GCDs or almost 26 APM.
I’m sure the twisting playstyle is more attractive to some players while still maintaining their desired class fantasy of the holy crusader. I’m a slacker, or at least I am when playing a paladin, so the non twisted style is perfect for me but I don’t begrudge others for wanting something more to their liking. From what I’ve seen in this thread and others, it’s not really about blasting the meters. Everyone here understands that it would require divine intervention for that to happen for retribution.
8 Likes
The PTR is changed, which is the final word. What else do you need? You are not the boss to demand an explanation for every decision.
You don’t get it. This isn’t about just the damage meters. This is about the whole experience. The depth it adds to the class is amazing. Everything from leveling to farming and raiding at endgame becomes much more engaging.
The damage is significant enough to make it worth it, but not so great that it breaks the game.
It’s a minor change that gives the class more depth. This is literally an anti-faceroll mechanic for paladins. I wish I could have leveled 1-60 with two way twisting!
Also, from my experience playing with hundreds of other players, I have encountered a few who have a big concern for bosses being too easy. Truth is though, most people really just want fat loot and people to have a community with.
Even in classic endgame raids aren’t trivial for a lot of players. Sure you can meta up and faceroll, but most people don’t play completely that way. Rather they adopt elements of it that fit them.
A minority of people think the game is too easy, another minority thinks it’s too hard. All the people in the middle are just what I said before. They want fat loot and a community to play with.
6 Likes
The APM of 1 way and 2 way twisting is very similar.
For the most part you just trade lose 1 free GCD due to needing to shift SoC back a few tenths of a second (on a 3.0 speed weapon)
So instead of
Twist - Crusader Strike - Twist - Free GCD - Twist
It’s
Twist - Crusader Strike - Auto - SoC - Twist
Judgement takes up the free GCD in 2 way twisting, but doesn’t take up extra time in 1 way (it is used as you apply SoC). In practice the difference between the two rotations on the ideal 3.0 speed weapon is very close.
For people looking for a higher APM rotation, the current 1 way twisting provides it while being more tbc accurate. Some players here just don’t like it.
It does help them catch things like fury warriors however, which isn’t really fair to them given the lack of raid benefit that a fury warrior brings.
You can’t just ignore that a ret paladin existing and making full use of their raid buffs/debuffs in a raid is bringing over 600 dps in raid benefits by Sunwell. The class has their personal dps balanced around that fact. That’s the design of ret in TBC.
Only when talking things outside of class balancing. Blizzard has explicitly stated they aren’t retuning the player classes. This would break from that, even if you don’t believe the impacts would be negative.
1 Like
One increases the skill cap, the other turns the player into a bot lmfao.
I’d argue that 2 way twisting lowers the skill cap relative to 1 way twisting.
When it’s happening at the same timing every swing the rhythm is pretty fixed, which is likely where the “it feels smoother” comments come from.
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Two way is silky smooth, it should be a base mechanic IMO
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I like the twist.
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One was in the TBC, but one wasn’t. Which is more accurate how the classes played in TBC?
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The one where alliance doesn’t have seal of blood? That one?
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You assume I agree with this change also.
It must be a tough minority to be in 
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I wish they had flair in these forums, you could have this one along with another couple individuals:
#nochangesunlesstherearechangesthenthosechangesareokbutnomorechangesafterthat
What I’m interpreting from your posts is that you are having a difficult time coping with the fact that this is not #nochanges TBC. Seek inner peace and accept the fate of what is already heavily revised and continues to be revised. If you look at what has already been changed you’ll note that none of it is game breaking. Seal twisting isn’t either.
Save your energy to argue against something reductive to the game.
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Blizzard can change the game however they want. It’s their game. I will still play it regardless. I’m not totally against changes, but if you want to make it “a close replication” of the original TBC, changes should be minimal. Twisting was in the original TBC, so blizzard changed the code to make it work, which is fine. Seal of Blood was not, but was put in to make the class even across factions (i don’t totally agree with it, but i understand why). Dual twisting wasn’t in TBC, nor does it make the class even across factions. So this change i disagree with.
5 Likes
As I posted earlier in the thread, the batching changes affected classes like hunters and rogues. If they were to counter those changes and make things operate the same way as in TBC to maintain the original feel, then you might have a point. Unfortunately that’s been thrown out the window. Are you clamoring for hunter macros and rogue pvp vanish mechanics to return? If you’re not, then you’re not being consistent and therefore shouldn’t rally against any future changes without it being obvious that you’re not being intellectually honest.
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If they were in TBC, then yes. While people dislike the “one button macro” for hunters, it was usable in TBC, so it should be made to work in TBCC. And vanish should work exactly how it worked in TBC. These aren’t “changes”, they are “replicating TBC quirks” just like twisting.
3 Likes