that is only because of the leggo. without it other builds could compete.
i think you are making a mountain out of a molehill. the arbiter build up effect islike “here is some bonus damage” not " you must balance your core gameplay around it"
5 Likes
Sure, and it’s just a Shadowlands legendary that pushed literally every respectable beta player into Unholy Frenzy and Unholy Blight to amp its damage right? Just a legendary, you say, as all the beta testers are doing weird opening rotations and delaying major spells to maximize the Garg window. Like bruh, idk, you have to bank to 100 RP before you cast it, and with this version of Unholy, where you’re desperate for Runic Corruption, banking feels SO SO SO bad.
Like top players had already mathed out that delaying cooldowns and procs until the end of the Garg window was the definitive way to play SL unholy. This change needed to happen. There’s no point adding passive gargoyle back to the game, and Darbiter feels like trash to actually play with, with our current SL rune generation.
2 Likes
optimizing for proper spell play with your pets is part of core unholy dk gameplay. that means pooling resources and hitting your spells at the right moment. if you dont like that, you dont like UHDK, and what you really want is a retadin in a metal band.
so what?
5 Likes
And I’m calling that gameplay degenerate, because it locks a very specific talent build and stat weight in, and allows minimal viable deviation from a pre-set meta build. Garg is a very parasitic spell that shouldn’t be part of the kit.
I raided M ToS, don’t take me for an idiot who hasn’t experienced the spec first hand.
who cares? its for ST patchwerk style fights, which dont really exist anymore.
explain to me why you would rather play the same 4-6 buttons over and over again with no more depth or thought instead of playing with different cds of different lengths and cooldowns that each have their own playstyle considerations. from my perspective you are asking for the class to be more boring.
that doesn’t make your opinion more or less valid.
4 Likes
I mean having experienced the only tier where it was optimal speaks for something. Compare that to 99.5% of people who haven’t touched the spell in a serious setting or minmaxed around it. My experience with it may as well be gold, as far as feedback is concerned. If you killed bosses with that build in M ToS, then you’re qualified to talk about it too.
There were a handful of pure ST fights in Nyalotha, some with constant cleave cleave, and there were even more that were single target w/ hectic cleave. Garg is good in both scenarios. You can spend Runinc Power on Epidemic now, which allows Garg to be used as a priority damage spell during your AoE burst damage.
So do you know what banking actually entails now? 10+ seconds of downtime before you pop garg. How in the world does 10 seconds of rotational downtime before your cooldown make the spec better? I’d rather just press my buttons and not need to sit with my thumb up my rear end doing nothing while I wait for Garg to come up.
I’m not complaining that garg is hard to use, it’s insulting you think so little of me, I’m complaining that it’s stupid to use, and leads to rotational holes and downtime.
1 Like
They basically took Summon Gargoyle and made it a dead talent in that role. You could have just put a placeholder talent in that spot and named it POOP. Same outcome.
12 Likes
Actually swore when I saw that. Like… replace one mandatory talent with the only ability in Shadowlands that makes blood way more engaging and interesting to play. What’s the gain here?
1 Like
Lets not forget Blood Tap was added to counter balance the extra runes we will be using for Rune Tap… These runes have to come from somewhere, if not by kit then from our already lacking DPS/Threat.
1 Like
opinion
gatekeeping.
if you are wrong you are wrong, doesn’t matter how good of a player you are. the fact is gargoyle adds depth of play, you have to account for it if you want the most throughput from the spell. wanting that gone is just wanting the game to be made easier.
here’s a protip for a pro: casual out a bit. you dont need to make gargoyle 100% optimal every time you cast it. you can just fire and forget it and be happy with the damage you do get until you learn the fight enough to build your spell windows around it.
5 Likes
Ah right, the extremely minor and extremely brief DR that has, at least from what I’ve seen, been dismissed as essentially pointless button bloat in current incarnation.
This is the sort of thing that could only be said straight-faced by someone who has never tried to overcome the game’s difficult content. Anyone who does, knows better.
2 Likes
Logs show it was only ran in ToS and Antoras. Any other raid and it’s just suboptimal trash.
Fact of the matter is, very few people have taken this spell to the spreadsheets, sims, and mythic bosses, and I have. I’m not relying on my experience for my argument, I’m making my argument.
But here’s the thing, I’m not wrong.
Do you consider 10 seconds of down time every 2 minutes depth? Because I don’t. Explain to me, gcd by gcd, how Garg makes unholy more complex in a meaningful way.
“lol just play the spec wrong, that’ll solve your problem,”
1 Like
its status as optimal is still opinion. top dps, sure. but optimal? eh… this is basically a pick your favorite color exercise.
then you wouldn’t have mentioned it at all.
you have that live with gargoyle, spell lasts 30 seconds with the last part being the most powerful, festermight lasts 20. that means you need to cast gargoyle around festermight and create a 10 second window where you hold back on some of your abilities.
but really, this is just the difference between “i need ALL the dps i can muster” and “face rolls left to right, left to right”
it really does though, once you pull the stick out from where the sun dont shine you feel 1000x better and you realize the extra 10 dps you gained by wasting all that effort wasn’t worth it, and that you can be a lot more relaxed if you save that effort for only when it counts. it wont help your gameplay any, but your mental health will thank you.
1 Like
Why are you making an argument around Festermight when we’re talking about Shadowlands?
Yeah, if we actually had FM lol.
1 Like
i have already been playing with a similar gameplay situation you are complaining about. its not that bad.
That… you see, words mean things. You don’t get to make up your own definition on the fly. If a given loadout for a DPS spec, whose job is to do lots of damage, does more DPS, that’s… how do I put this… Optimal.
so wait, if you’re taking it as a talent now, and it’s gonna be a talent in the future, what’s the problem for you? It’s already suboptimal now, you’re deliberately running it. Won’t you just make the same choice in SL?
so if Death Coil reduce the cooldown of Apocalypse by 1.5 seconds, and our Apocalypse now resets 2 runes why would YOU ever take Gargoyle over army of the damned + Frenzied Monstrosity … you wont … so 2 dead talents
Gargoyle = dead talent
words do mean things. optimal meaning optimal for each fight. that build wasn’t. some fights you wanted clawing shadows/defile build because of cleave or range/movement considerations.
the valk could still do more because all of your damage for that build was front loaded into the last half of valk, so all you had to worry about was getting that right. but that didn’t make it fun, efficient, or optimal for all or even most fights, just the top dps.
keep in mind that unless a fight is a dps check you will probably want to use a more fight optimal build than a pure top dps build. bonus fun occurs when they are the same build.
Seems cool to me.