I did a couple AVs on my hunter alt recently and it was even more machine-like than when I was grinding rep on my warrior. Turtle SHGY, for about an hour. In both cases, SHGY couldn’t be taken until Lok was summoned, which snowballed the whole game so that it ended within 15-20 minutes after Lok first hit SHGY.
What I found most interesting is that no one is even trying to win Alliance side. It is just understood that if you try to win, you will end up losing and you will end up with far, far less rep than if you just farm rep by turtling at SHGY. There was even someone who said at the start that they were not going to go south of SHGY. It was actually pretty organized, it’s just that the goal wasn’t winning but maximizing rep.
If the rep rewards were better for attempting to win than turtling and taking the loss, things would be different. If the chances of winning weren’t so bad, things would be different.
Some of us do try but it’s an uphill battle vs a full-on horde turtle and many people don’t even bother fighting that anymore. You pour your heart into taking SF, getting to IBGY, then have the horde rez 20 at a time and wipe you. Rinse repeat and see how long it takes before apathy sets in.
Yes. I know. The difference for me was the surprising number of people that were taking an alt through the same grind that they had taken their main through - just like me, I guess. They weren’t newbies to AV. They knew exactly what they were doing. They knew exactly what did and didn’t work, and they choose to just farm rep.
I guess the part I disagree with is the “so bad” qualification at the end of your post, but everything else I agree with.
There are clearly several factors at play causing the alliance to lose so frequently in AV. The map imbalances aren’t helping, but it’s plain as day to anyone who steps foot in AV that the alliance apathy is making it borderline impossible for them to win right now. Also, even when a few alliance do attempt to make some headway in the game, most of their team is so inexperienced in doing anything other than rep farming that they make strategic mistakes that make it very hard for them to advance.
I had a game last night where Alliance actually sent like 5 on offense and I nearly shed a tear. Unfortunately those 5 didn’t bother with any GYs and just went straight into Galv’s room where they were easily wiped by counterspell on their healer and arcane explosion spam. Then their team continued to sit at SH GY while the horde walked around them to SP and capped their base and won without ever taking SH GY.
It’s not even a lack of experience, the people sitting at SHGY are literally there to farm rep, they don’t care about winning. They are either alts looking for some raid quality gear at exalted, or bots.
If you want to fix AV, you have to fix the rep grind first, either by moving the rep items out of AV (#nochanges) or by changing the map to make it so alliance can actually push from SHGY if you they win the fight there.
My guess will be that Blizzard changes nothing. At the end of the day, people love the feel of classic, and classic was basically just a way to tide people over until Shadowlands comes out, at least in their eyes. Once they feel they have milked the content, they will either move towards TBC to start the process over again, or just focus on their current game and let classic play until it is no longer profitable for them
It has become habit to not cap anything down south because that just alerts horde to your presence. A group of 5 has a much better chance of trying to sneak a quick kill of Galv than a group of 40 do of taking IBGY.
And to give some further context to horde players that haven’t played AV as alliance, if alliance tries to push for SFGY or IBGY, chances are that they are going to quickly lose SHGY - long before they can hardcap another GY south of IWB pass. That generally results in a quick loss that nets less than 500 rep - often far, far less than 500 rep. Deciding not to even try to win and just farming rep at SHGY -> do turn ins when it is lost, then farming rep at SPGY nets usually thousands of rep.
You guys ask why we defend SHGY and we tell you over and over,because of we lose it we die.
Then the suggestion is not not get IBGY as a graveyard but to somehow skip everything and get FWGY…LOL??
Its literally going to be the same thing when we trade SHGY for either IBGY or FWGY, any alliance that die are a massive loss to us, but to horde dying means nothing anywhere. Kill any of us at FWGY we get sent to SPGY…
Yeah, if you’re going to do that then just take 20+ people and do a full rush on the RH. Don’t take anything else because it will alert the horde to do a full recall to block you.
Of course, if the horde see so many alliance rushing like that then they’ll move to block it, then alliance will wipe, horde will get SHGY while all this is going on and it’s GG for the alliance.
Exactly. It’s a high risk move that can work if you surprise them maybe once every four or five games. Try it more often than that and they’ll anticipate it and block it.
That’s why you need to get 20+ there. Kill horde as they recall in and rez your dead until the RH caps.
A group of 5 can kill Galv. A group of 5 will have a MUCH HARDER time killing Galv with no GYs nearby, and with an open path for Horde to steamroll into Galv’s room to wipe them. He’s no slouch, and he calls for help the instant you aggro him. I agree that sending a small team south to pick up objectives is a viable strategy, but not Galv. If they were going to skip GYs, they should have piled into IBT which doesn’t have an elite boss inside of it. Or our base towers. Or take FW GY and hold it and then assault base towers and TP from there.
Galv is, in my opinion, the worst possible play for a 5 man ninja team.
Do you really think that a 5 man group has a better chance to take and hold FWGY than to kill Galv when the nearest GY they control is SHGY? They might kill Galv, they won’t take FWGY.
5 people, who can’t be reinforced, have a better chance of taking and holding a GY until it hard caps than killing one NPC? I’m not sure we are talking about the same game, let alone the same BG. Agree to disagree, I guess.
Yes, because the GY isn’t guarded by a high level elite NPC that calls for help the instant you engage him. There’s a Lieutenant and 4 guards there. The 4 guards will die to a single shatter combo, and the Lieutenant can be duoed down in about a minute. Then you spin the flag and the herald announces that you took FW GY. When horde comes to recap, it’s just them vs the alliance.
Compare that to Galv where 1 or 2 horde can walk in and turn the fight because your 5 man is fighting a high level boss.
Also keep in mind apathy. Galv is right next to IBGY and SF GY. It’s a short ride to go check on Galv. FWGY is a further ride back. Don’t underestimate the bystander effect.
There is a 0% chance a 5 man team alone takes any tower or GY from the horde side. Trust me, I’ve been there and tried that. It’s totally fun and if you’re playing with a 5-stack I think you should try it for that reason, but like you aren’t going to hold against the 10-20 horde that get to respawn 1-4 times each.
Galv will work because it always takes time for the horde to trickle into defense, and that’s enough of a window to kill him. Seriously, 1-2 horde against a 5-man of any decent level won’t turn galv because he does all of 0 damage to your tank and can be ignored for the few seconds it takes for your dps to kill them.