Let me lead of with I am on a PVE server.
I don’t really care about PVP.
I don’t care about ranks.
I came back to classic because i want to see BWL AQ40 and NAXX at level.
I have seen the mantra of #nochanges.
I agreed. We do not need to give the new team the ability to screw this up. or retail the heck out of it. They have shown their inability to create enjoyable content.
I saw " warts and all" which is a great thing to me. lots of little things in are buggy and odd. But an individual rock from the earth has character, shape, quality and a story to tell. All polished rocks are the same shape, size and texture. I will take some uniqueness and individuality and flavor over bland boring fulling polished into obscurity that is retail.
These changes concern me for the future… They are now changing things. They are now patching and updating a game we were promised would not be changed.
a Museum piece. A time capsule. A glimpse into a history book…
You don’t add your own brush strokes to a painting in a museum.
You don’t remove things from a time capsule decades later because you don’t like them.
You don’t edit history books because you don’t like what they say.
This concerns me when it comes to the future of classic.
This pandoras box was sealed with the strong promise of #Nochanges and “warts and all”. This box has been opened. The students are taking the brush from the master. We are re-writing history now to appease the people whining.
Appeasement. polishing. fairness. equality.pruning, quality of life.
All done in the greatest of intentions.
Is what has turned this game from the enjoyable experiences and tough to earn rewards that took effort, thought, focus, and dedication. Into a game that gives out epic armor for turtles making it to the water.
What change is next? Will you like the change? will you not like the change? Will other people complain enough to enact a change that affects you? Will you not care untill it affects you? Allowing and tolerating and cheering the changing of something that was never designed to change is a problem. It lead to the current content… I hope others share the same concern as I do that we have opened pandoras box of changes with the thunderous applause of the masses.
True, but at the same time, players did NOT have the ability to form up large scale premades like this when vanilla was a thing. Didn’t have a ventrilo to put you in to a group of others that you queued up with, and see if you take the queue or not.
as far as I’m concerned, it does not effect you one way or another. They are focused on players doing BGs and pvp. PVE content is a joke if you haven’t noticed.
Been reading the forums since yesterdays announcement. Just to see how people would react and maybe get an insight in to what people are hoping to get out of the later phases of this launch now that the nostalgic feelings of MC and WPvP and Honor System have been turned back into the normal daily grind.
This is what I noticed…the #NoChanges rallying cry is more of a meme now than a movement and I can only hope that this mindset doesn’t infect what SO MANY OF MY FRIENDS AND FELLOW PLAYERS ARE HOLDING OUT HOPE FOR. And that’s a Classic BC, a game without the ‘museum’ ‘unchanged’ ‘nostalgic’ talk that gets vomited out about Vanilla.
I’ve read for the past day (admittedly while in que for AV and not every single post) and have yet to see a single argument made that would in any way even begin to justify defending not implementing changes to a game where exploitative behavior exists……the SAME as they would do in classic. And in fact did regularly.
today on the first page are 10 + topics of people begging for other changes because one change went through… This will be the death of the game. and the destruction of a piece of history. a museum piece. a masters work.
No, this is about the 20th change to the game. It’s simply one of the few that received actual patch notes/documentation.
You are right to be concerned though.
Here’s an incomplete list of the changes made to Classic prior to the recently-announced AV changes. Many of these were snuck in announced and undocumented:
Layering
Server size
Neutering Warlock Infernal summon
Neutering the leash/kite characteristics of mobs
The previous changes to AV (auto-raid creation, forced loot settings)
Instanced zones (ie, each zone in the open world operates as an instance)
I don’t really care what where or why they “started” making changes…
My problem is now they have been giving and inch.
and they will take a mile.
There was no “bug”. there was not “loophole”.
it was a bunch of people crying about what other people were doing .
so they started making changes.
Do you not understand that "they started making changes, about a bunch of people crying about what other people were doing " is a BAD thing.
its what retail is the result of… a bunch of changes to appease the people who cry the loudest. while ignoring the majority that don’t complain about everything.
this is a literal example of me playing " just let me put the tip in" with a girl im dating…
My question is is why are these AV changes the “straw that broke the camel’s back”?
No one is freaking out about how broken some classes are - like druids being mana drained while in form.
No one is freaking out cause guards dynamically respawn in cities when they aren’t supposed to.
No one is freaking out there mob tagging is broken for power leveling.
No one cares that itemization is at 1.12 but we’re in an earlier phase.
No one cares that the mail system doesn’t work the way it did in vanilla.
No one cares that there’s modern scripting for macros and old macros are “broken”.
Why should we be up in arms about AV changes given these other things as well. Why are those okay, but this isn’t?
I’m not saying classic is bad. Or that changes should or shouldn’t have happened. Classic is able to be played due to the evolution in gamers, in a much different way than it was at original release. This has created different issues that may or may not need to be evaluated and dealt with.
There was a point in vanilla you could exploit instances to dupe flasks which wrecked the economy. Do you think that should be in classic? Is that a “wart” that you wanted?
Let’s not forget what actually just happened…
THEY REMOVED THE DISPLAY OF A SINGLE NUMBER
If such a tiny trivial change to a UI DISPLAY was so gamechanging to you, then you’re only admitting how much of an exploit it was.
Battlegrounds are a huge part of Classic for most people and so the complaints were pretty overwhelming. Pre-made AVs were never part of the vanilla experience.
The change that concerns me is the change to diminishing returns on PvP kills. I don’t think there was any valid reason to change that whatsoever. There was no negative impact on the vanilla experience leaving that as it was like the other changes they made to prevent AV pre-mades.
That said, they haven’t done anything to diminish people’s hard work to earn whatever they’ve earned in the game beyond the scope of vanilla. The moment they start doing that they’ve gone too far.
Wait - you don’t think people forming premades is counter to want Blizzard wants from the BG?
People cry long and hard about what they want – in this case they are justified because premades which circumvent the queue system and can ONLY work through dumping non members into a mire of 15-40 awfulness are game-breaking issues. Not game-breaking for the premade sure, but game-breaking for Alliance pugs and for Horde with long queues.
If Blizzard just caved to every whim people had and everything people cried about we would have transmog and guild banks. We would be getting cheap respecs or dual specs. We won’t be getting any of that.
Guessing you failed to read my post. Let me shorted it for you.
Let me lead of with I am on a PVE server.
I don’t really care about PVP.
I don’t care about ranks.
I came back to classic because i want to see BWL AQ40 and NAXX at level.
Appeasement. polishing. fairness. equality.pruning, quality of life.
All done in the greatest of intentions.
Is what has turned this game from the enjoyable experiences and tough to earn rewards that took effort, thought, focus, and dedication. Into a game that gives out epic armor for turtles making it to the water.
What change is next? Will you like the change? will you not like the change? Will other people complain enough to enact a change that affects you? Will you not care untill it affects you? Allowing and tolerating and cheering the changing of something that was never designed to change is a problem. It lead to the current content… I hope others share the same concern as I do that we have opened pandoras box of changes with the thunderous applause of the masses.
“making a few minor changes” took vanilla to retail in 15 years…
and no false equivalence here.
going from #Nochanges and “warts and all”
to “we just making these little changes”
is the same as:
going from " you cant have no booty tonight"
to " okay. you can just put the tip in".
its the same thing. there is no changes. or there is changes…
No they made dramatic changes - when they started development on TBC.
Think of Classic as the natural progression, and the changes being made, as changes that would have been made to exploits/quing systems/bugs had TBC never existed. We are playing 1.13- not 1.12.
Despite your “i am a pve guy” blah blah blah. I can only assume you are uppity about the last change because it affects you. So quite frankly I read your diatribe with a very small grain of salt.
But i will help you understand.
This is not Vanilla. Classic is a completely different game because we live in completely different time. Elements of Vanilla exist that still exist under your
warts and all line–like MOST OF THEM, especially the vast majority of important ones. But there are other elements that simply cannot exist due to the nature of the game 15 years later–starting and ending with server size. That in itself changes 100 other things that are impossible NOT to change: eg the economy, rarity of mats, plowing through content 100x faster, the general base of knowledge, etc.
This will never be a pure version of vanilla and the sooner you understand that the sooner you can move on and enjoy this version of the game. I hope they continue to make revisions to the game that are necessary corrections BECAUSE OF SERVER SIZE so the game can remain as close to vanilla as possible without the majority of people quitting early (such as p2 ending sooner because of the relentless wpvp or now the av fixes to manage the displeasure of everyone not in an ally premade which include both horde and allys).
If you can’t cope, then move on, but holding out some high hope that this will be the early 2000’s all over again will leave you constantly disappointed and a waste of your time.
