Yet if bloodypaws sees it happen, it must be what happens in all situations, and if he doesn’t see it happen, it doesn’t exist.
You mean having a conversation with someone else?
Not half as bad as we feel sorry for you.
Yet he sees nothing because he apparently hasnt played the game since TBC or Wrath rofl
An indirect mocking, totally not indicative of a grudge right?
Just keep playing your little games buddy.
At what point have we been discussing that? I’ve literally argued for improvements to that since forever…
Oh wait… you’re shifting the argument again… like you always do.
Oh and again… we’re asking for ML for guilds only… so… this entire discussion has nothing to do with non-coordinated groups.
So what? Why do you want to play with players like that? If you don’t like the way they lead… don’t join their groups?
Totally fair. I’m not asking for you to lose that.
Literally proved wrong already in this regard. Scroll up if you need the link to the data demonstrating so.
75% of normal mode guilds used PL at the end of Legion, greater than 50% of heroic mode guilds used PL at the end of legion and around 20% of mythic mode guilds used PL at the end of legion.
The math is in, and you’re flat out wrong. If you don’t like ML, then don’t use it. It’s actually that simple.
So long as you’re not forced to raid with that individual… it’s perfectly fine to be returned. Why you seem to think you should have a say in how my friends and I run our guild… I can’t figure it out.
Again… I say this as someone who has zero hand in loot distribution. I STILL prefer ML. Literally used it TONIGHT in TBC in SWP. Zero issues.
Then you won’t get it.
Funny, cause Ion literally stated in the interview with Asmon that they want to bring something like that back.
You’re a fool to believe anything Ion has to say.
Meh… We asked for TF to be gone. It’s gone. Also with the huge sweeping changes in methodology from what was described about Dragonflight… I don’t think it’s unreasonable that there’s hope for ML (or some variant like it) to return.
You could be right, only time will tell.
Either way, that doesn’t change the fact that us asking for ML for guilds only has zero impact on non-coordinated groups like pugs. Going to respond to that?
Then players won’t group based on what Guild they’re in.
The original, true meaning of the word “dictator” is from ancient Rome. It was a title/position granted to an extremely qualified Roman citizen in a time of crisis to take full control of the Republic and once the crisis had passed they always relinquished their power without any controversy.
It was an extremely distinguished and honorable mark of someone’s service to the republic. One humble man even took it up twice and gave up his power both times to go back to his humble retirement as a farmer.
Do you live your life on all of these possibilities? Why drive a car, you might crash?
Why eat food it might be poisoned.
Why meet people, they might be trying to scam you.
and a person cannot be screwed over if they never interact with a ML group.
so yes, PL is a considerate alternative.
And neither can you, despite trying to allude that its somewhere near 100%.
You reaching deep in that barrel aren’t you.
Adults actually aren’t quite as petty. But lets humor you, lets say this is a common dilemma. this notion will be no different in PL. Are you trying to claim that a human who would get bent out of shape and hold resentment about gear done by a human would be perfectly fine because of RNG? That doesn’t really follow with me. petty be petty, no matter what.
and yet you never use examples from the most recent iteration of ML, only friends of friends from 10 years ago.
But wait ML is alive and well in the classic servers? where is the rampant stealing?
not really. you’ve indirectly mocked snozh loads of times.
genuinely lost on the point here. is this just another reaching example?
But is that what you want to tell players who don’t like ML, from Blizzards perspective?
I don’t think so.
I mean neither does pretending it doesn’t happen.
You’d be lying if you said everyone in a raiding group was happy about every loot decision.
You can’t blame the player for a system that is out of their hands.
That doesn’t mean the resentment is buried.
I’m sure it happens but Blizzard doesn’t care enough to notice.
That doesn’t excuse being obnoxious themselves.
A few have already got him blocked but he won’t acknowledge that he’s ever been out of line.
Warcraft can’t handle more division, which is what ML will create if it comes back.
Wanting something back and bringing something back are two different things… I hope ML stays away, but who knows… they pay more attention to loud minority.
It’s not considerate, it’s the morally correct choice.
Anyone who’s been on the internet for more than 15 years knows that you cannot rely on “common sense” or “good wiil.”
It’s not going to happen. This is the internet.
Thousands of hours of video evidence for Asmongold/McConnel/Esfand against this. Adults are extremely petty.
Again… so much evidence that contradicts this.
[quote=“Shïvana-scarlet-crusade, post:1123, topic:1236912”]
But lets humor you, lets say this is a common dilemma. this notion will be no different in PL
The person who drives a car does not buy the car thinking of the failings of others.
The person who buys food does not thing about being murdered. It’s eating. A basic function.
Most people I have met have not been worth meeting.
Every single master looter I’ve met, has not been worth meeting. The game would be better off if they were just gone. I don’t care. We don’t need people that depend on abusing their followers or subscribers or viewers to funnel them currency and resources so they can just pay to win their way through life.
We don’t need the race to world first.
We don’t need any of this nonsense. We need serious reform. A complete makeover.
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No, I want to tell them that PL is still an option and they are sure to be very happy with it. you literally read stats that backed up the notion that ML only a majority pick in mythic content. anything below was in favor of PL.
swivel, DODGE, deflect. DUCK.
I know I would be. I know Snozh would be. I know Caps would be. I know Synsha would be.
All the players I personally know that raid at a mythic level would be happy with every single loot “decision”. you don’t even realize how little of a decision there is.
So they will no longer blame the would be loot master? they will now just hold resentment against the game, and the person who won the roll.
I don’t think you realize how people really work.
is resentment this magical thing for you, that solves all problems?
woah now. so without any proof you’re going to claim that it still happens. Stories from 10+ years ago is enough to deem a problem rampant, but with no stories at all currently so you will ignore the evidence and say “well it probably still happens”
And you say we are dismissive and ignore things.
… so that doesn’t excuse you either?
being blocked really isn’t a proof of being “out of line” if anything it just speaks about the person doing the blocking, which really just tends to be a trend of them blocking anyone that disagrees. Holi went a blocking spree in this thread. thats called creating an echo chamber.
What division will there to speak of? guilds that want ML will continue to raid as a group, and guilds that want PL will continue to raid as a group, and pugs will continue to raid as pugs.
People will continue to play, and those who want the change will just be happier for the change.
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ML and PL are not moral or immoral. they are loot systems.
you know, I’ll give you this one, I agree with this statement, but I don’t know what the point is.
ah yes, big name streamers represent me and other people as a standard.
okay, not all adults. I’ll just play with the non petty ones.
Its not on me that you can’t surround yourself with good individuals.
[quote=“Bipsie-moon-guard, post:1126, topic:1236912”]
you repeated part of the quote, was there meant to be your text here?
And most of the ML I’ve met have been good. I also believe i was a good ML, but of course, I am a tad biased where myself is concerned.
maybe you’re just drawn to bad guilds.
why does this always come back to streamers?
what is wrong with the race?
You seem to be trying to shove a ton of non related topics into this ML one.
I mean, in my ideal reform, you could still be in it despite for sure being a player I wouldn’t regularly want to play with.
I’m not often trying to get people kicked out of the game. that’s a little controlling.
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Keep your Trust issues in your own raid groups please. Stop trying to push solutions to your problems on groups that you are not in.
That is not true at all.
Master looter has severe social and moral consequences.
You have what is called a “bias.”
So do I.
My bias makes me angry and fearful of people who I do not trust control my loot instead of an unemotional and easily datamined computer algorithm.
Your bias makes you think that Master Loot is the best thing since sliced bread. It always works out perfectly for you, and your close friends.
Our experiences and our memories and our environment shape our opinions, our thoughts, our lives.
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Master Loot is immoral, it has not feelings or morals.
Personal Loot is moral. It is consensual. Everyone who participates in the loot distribution, does so willingly.