Are you saying that maintaining a shrine (or casually defacing it on the way to the elevator) is on the same level as undoing the blight caused by the march of an unholy army of thousands?
All I’m saying is that the shrine shows no change, and the candles alone imply maintenance as far back as Classic when the Forsaken were already moved in for a year or two. If there was lore indicating that it was in fact marred or defaced by Forsaken in passing to the city below prior to the blight bombs Sylvanas set off, that would clearly indicate that the in-game representation is indeed lazily outdated.
Nah Blizzard wrote themselves an out. Voss said she “knows someone better” to lead the Forsaken that isn’t her. She didn’t specify who, so they can write in whoever they want.
There is lore saying Gnomes got Gnomeregan back if I’m not mistaken, yes.
There is no lore saying that Terenas’ memorial is defaced in passing.
This is the key distinction between Gnomeregan’s confirmed reclamation not being shown, and the hypothesis that someone should have desecrated Terenas’ memorial by now. One is lore not represented by the game. The other is a fan-theory not supported by lore or the game.
YOUR hypothesis is that because there is no lore or in game representation of the shrine being defaced that somehow means the Forsaken are OK with the Menethil name outside of Arthas?
Not desecrating a memorial does not infer anything. Maybe they just like the statue. Maybe there is a single Forsaken soldier who watches over it because he was in the Court of Menethil.
You are inferring lore-based ideas from nothing. But there is plenty of lore that states the Forsaken loathe Arthas and the living. Calia being as close to living as one can get as well as the sister to the person who cursed an entire race is not something the people who literally say “For the Dark Lady” and “Dark Lady watch over you” are going to be super happy about following.
If she’s the leader going into shadowlands without proper development I’ll be upset.
She shouldn’t jump from from start to finish, that’d be dumb.
I hope she gets some chapters in the new book.
I was a little surprised to see her in the alpha spoilers. I think going from the excerpt in the book to that is too fast. Need more stuff in the novel for sure if that’s going to be the case.
Blizzard has never been known to write things well. Slapping Calia as the leader of the Forsaken that fast and just expecting everyone to nod in agreement is pretty on-base for them. Just look at… Every time they changed Warchief.
This still creates a problem for people who don’t read the novels. They went from Sylvanas ditching the Forsaken at the end of BFA to Calia being the new leader at the beginning of Shadowlands.
I’m always optimistic with them. I shouldn’t be but I am.
I’m hoping for a chapter or five in the novel. Don’t need everything to be explained but just need some believable progress.
Going from “I’m watching Lillian to see how she interacts with the horde leaders” to “ok cool, so I sat in one one council meeting, I’m calia, my dad was in charge of Lordaeron, don’t like it? Tough”. Is a bit much.
This is an issue full-stop as well. The Forsaken now are more than just Lordaeron. They have branched out to basically all continents as the Scourge are on all continents. There are pockets of Forsaken in Northrend, Kalimdor, and southern EK (and maybe even Vol’dun if you count the skeletal Zandalari as Forsaken). Her being the daughter of a long-dead king of a region that isn’t even the kingdom he was king of has zero significance to if the Forsaken will accept her or not.
Depple has a assumption that the Forsaken are unkind to the name Menethil because of Arthas. THIS is the actual initiating hypothesis.
I simply pointed out that the solitary thing bearing the Menethil name on the primary path into the Forsaken’s capital city beneath Lordaeron does not show any sign of deliberate tear. Then I pondered about the implications about that.
Then you came in and equated the tasks of maintaining or leaving a altar alone, and compared it to the herculean task of restoring half of Quel’thalas (stuck in Burning Crusade chronologically, the Plaguelands updated in Cataclysm would be a stronger case), and straw manned my position as saying that the Sin’dorei don’t care about their homeland more than Forsaken care about a single shrine.
I have zero doubt now that you have never seen it or paid it any attention. Because it is not a statue.
No, I am inferring lore-based ideas from subtle cues. But more importantly, I’m pointing out the dearth of evidence for your claim that the Menethil name is despised by default by indicating that the thing with Terenas’ name on it and dedicated to his name is curiously intact in the middle of the capital of the people that hate his guts.
I mean, if Blizzard wanted to indicate distaste towards the Menethil name, the simplest thing would’ve been a passing mention in a pertinent book or short story, or just a simple texture change to Terenas’ shrine. But in the expansion where they revamped the entire world, including small details aplenty, Terenas’ memorial remains unmarred by Forsaken hands.
By the way guys, the easiest way you can counter my line of thought here is finding a simple lore passage that contradicts me (and supports your original premise). Rather than inferring in the opposite direction that I’m wrong with even less evidence than I got, even if my evidence is minute.
Well since no one desecrated Garrosh’s grave, guess that means all of the Horde and Alliance respect Garrosh and think everything he did was okay.
Since the Horde hasn’t burned down Tiragarde Keep, guess that means they agree completely with Daelin and really think the Alliance should just have a neat little base right on their coastline.
A shrine with signs of maintenance (candles burn out and need replacement) that remains unchanged in an expansion dedicated to changing the world is evidence, however circumstantial or minute it might seem.
Only someone with an utter dearth of the finer points of writing through subtle world building and considers it a complete lack of evidence.
By the way, speaking of a lack of evidence? That’s you guys. As in, you guys have no evidence that the Menethil name as a whole is derided by the Forsaken as a whole. I’ve been asking for it. I’ve been giving you the cheat-sheet to debunk me. And you’ve curiously ignored it…
Because strawmanning me is really the way you’re going to debunk my position, rather than, you know, backing up your claim that the Menethil name is disliked (despite the thing bearing its name remaining untouched and better yet maintained in a city full of people who dislike it).
