Aye, she’s a prickly one but I couldn’t agree more. The wardens are probably one of the coolest aspects of Night Elf society, and they totally stole my attention in an expansion that was supposed to be focused on the Demon Hunters 
1 Like
Sylvanas gave the order. What’d you expect the Horde to do? “Nah Warchief, I’m not feeling it.” And then they’re dead too! Nobody had any control over what went on at the actual burning. Yes, the one person responsible is Sylvanas for giving the direct order that no one could refuse. It don’t matter what the equivalent is, you’re essentially wanting the writers to put the Kaldorei on a genocide march and you think it’ll be “cool and fitting”.
That’s not how it works.
2 Likes
A majority of the horde in the cinematic are seen shocked by the order. Even nathanos himself is like “wth”. Can’t blame thousands there for 1 person’s action, the same person who is their Warchief and can’t exactly defy or it could very well be seen as traitorous in front of hundreds of thousands of people there… You know, the same thing Sylvanas has been flinging around with tauren boy.
1 Like
And Thomas Zelling. And people who openly go with the Rebellion. And the player if they side with Saurfang during the rescuing of Baine. And every other opportunity known to man. Defying the warchief in the current moment since Sylvanas was made Warchief = death.
1 Like
I totally agree, I also seemed to have loved the DH cinematic for the vaults kind of solely for the Maiev, I’m unsure if that was just me though? I don’t know why, but the warden’s are just very cool to me, their own little nelf SI:7 sect of cool characters… I fully support the prickly, cranky elf woman and all Wardens running around taking over Nelf society.
Same logic Garrosh also employed 
… However we don’t discuss him, he clearly did nothing wrong .
Sylvannas razed a city, killed civillians, and committed genocide entirely unprovoked. That’s not the sort of blood letting that a strategic victory like taking one of her three val’kyrs is going to solve. That’s the sort of provocation that has armies chasing someone into hell over. Sylvannas realistically would have signed her own death warrant from an action like this, and yet bfa treats this event like it’s the normal trading blows between two adversaries.
I’m honestly in the camp that thinks that the faction war is stupid at this point and Blizz needs to dissolve it. Nearly every expansion has treated the faction division as a distraction to a real threat that both sides will have to work together to overcome, and bfa looks to be no different. Plus the fact that the gravity of sylvannas’s actions at darkshore seem to be completely ignored by blizz shows that they’re pretty awful at writing the faction war.
If they wanted a war that started the way bfa has, it shouldve devolved into an equal destruction of both sides to the point that both sides started to look like monsters, and ended when it got to the point that the disgusting nature of what both sides had done had totally left everyone with no taste for war. That’s what “gray” is. Bfa hasn’t been gray at all. It’s been sylvannas twirling her mustache.
At this point though, I’m not interested in blizz trying to deliver on their promise for gray. They’d likely just have alliance stupidly be the ones who raze thunderbluff for no clear reason, and point to it with pride saying, “See? Gray?”
Spare me.
9 Likes
Mhm. We don’t discuss that. Bad juju. Dark times. Personally, I was on a beach in Uldum.
Not true. Just for the record. This isn’t true.
3 Likes
Except it wasn’t unprovoked… Greymane’s been poking her side since Stormheim - an unsanctioned attack mind you. She also felt that there was no way the alliance and horde could ever simply forget what has happened between the two. Which, honestly is kind of understandable. Especially given the two factions did discover life blood of azeroth that seems to be crack for literally anything.
Taking one of her very important Valkyrs is a good satisfaction for some but not all and I’m sure there are going to be more development between the two down the storyline. To say that the entire story is just unfinished after everything they did in that current storyline would be a bit much and can’t be certain of.
I don’t think anywhere did they do that, Anduin nudged it off only slightly because Sylvanas was pulling his numbers tight, something she intentionally wanted to do and clearly succeeded in doing. Which, tyrande instantly got pissy, left and took matters into her own hands. Tyrande and all the nelves are also clearly upset by what happened, Greymane included especially since they were the ones to help them in time of need.
I’m ok with this truthfully, I’d like to see the Alliance actually more “morally gray” as people like to meme.
1 Like
What about is not true? The justification was " If we don’t attack them now, they might consider doing something some time" which still doesn’t justify the main targets being innocents.
Sylvanas didn’t even want to defeat the night elves armies, she just wanted to wipe out as much of the race as possible. Those civilians would have never been a threat to the horde, but she still decided that it would be the best to just make all of them die a painful death
8 Likes
And the attack on Stormheim. Here’s the timeline.
Horde vs. Alliance. Bad juju happens.
Garrosh goes bonkers. Horde / Alliance team up to remove corrupt Warchief. Horde / Alliance reach peace through Varian / Vol’jin.
WoD = Everything’s good.
Legion - Genn attacks Sylvanas (and tells the player character it’s an unsanctioned op) during a time of world wide crisis unprovoked.
Sylvanas makes it very clear in A Good War, and Saurfang agrees that Genn going unpunished for his actions during a time of world wide crisis and attacking the head of the other super power on Azeroth is bad juju and is entirely worth being concerned over because he attacked unprovoked. It’s her entire point behind attacking Darnassus.
Edit:
Also entirely false. Sylvanas and Saurfang both agree in A Good War that the point behind attacking Darnassus is to occupy the city, and nothing more, with the intent of driving a wedge between the Night Elves and the humans so that they’re not a threat.
2 Likes
Now this is most definitely not true. She wanted to drive a wedge between the alliance in case they wanted to attack the Horde. Again, the entire burning of Teldrassil was entirely Saurfangs fault and it wasn’t at all actually suppose to happen. But, because Saurfang suddenly was like “OUUUGH my HONOR” she was like, “Alrite that’s it im doing what needs to be done.”
2 Likes
Greymane attacked Sylvannas. Gilneas did not attack the horde.
Conflating one mans attempt to settle a score as a provocation to level a city populated by civillians, most of whom arent even the same race, is a tenuous grasping of straws for a justification.
Not to mention, Sylvannas never even mentioned it as a provocation, so it’s mostly player head canon for a justification anyway.
3 Likes
I want to point out something similar once happened to another group of elves, this had major repercussions for all of Warcraft lore.
The Scourge invasion of Silvermoon and the corruption of the Sun Well.
90% of the High Elves were killed, many raised as Undead slaves for Arthas. Most of the Capital of the High Elves was destroyed, their fount of power corrupted.
Because of one AH* Lordaeron Human General, and the Alliance not sending aid, the now Christened Blood Elves left the Alliance, joined with Illidan, and eventually Joined the Horde.
The Night Elves over the last 20 years aka WC3 till now, have lost their sacred forests thanks to the Orcs, lost their ancient ancestral capital and reminder of why they hate Mages thanks to Goblins. They have been slowly beaten down and discriminated by the Alliance, treated as Newbs when it comes to Warfare by Alliance Leaders. Now the heart of what remains of their culture and people was destroyed, a small handful managed to escape to Stormwind, thanks to Night Elf Mages who once scorned may have saved their race, and a small fighting force lead by Tyrande and Malfurion. There are now fewer Night Elf survivors than there were Blood Elf survivors, they have just as much reason to despise the Alliance as the Do the Horde, hell they have more reason to hate the Alliance now than the Blood Elves did at the end of WC3.
So this brings about the all important question, how are the Remaining Night Elf Night Warriors going to punish those responsible? Because one thing about all Elves, they hold grudges.
*Filtered Term for a really bad person.
4 Likes
I didn’t want to bring this up, but: In MoP the horde destroyed theramore and we ended up siding with them. What makes you think that it will be different this time especially since we already have the confirmation that tyrande is already totally satisfied?
That aside, why would Sylvanas wipe out the night elves for something that Genn did, when he merely denied her 1 val’kyr after the attack on Gilneas?
3 Likes
Uh. When the king of a city attacks a queen of a city, that’s a declaration of war. Again, an unsanctioned op, mind you.
She does in A Good War. She makes a point to mention Genn going unpunished is bad juju. Go read it.
2 Likes
Except it’s not grasping straws when he also represents a part of the Alliance. You can’t sit here and say that logically just because one person - who is a major leader of his people - attacked her and not all of his people she didn’t feel that eventually if all bets were off he wouldn’t instantly jump at the opportunity to start what he wanted, with the numbers to back it up. The people in the alliance still represent the alliance in some way or another.
Again, another reason she also did it along with Stormheim is because it’s obvious they’re never going to forget things that happened. I.E…you know, her killing his son.
Don’t care. MoP -> Treaty of peace -> Genn.
The treaty of peace between the Alliance and Horde happened after Theramore.
She didn’t want to. I said it earlier, in A Good War, the only reason she wipes out the Night Elves is because Saurfang deliberately disobeyed her orders. If Saurfang had taken Malfurion’s head like he was supposed to, the battle would have ended and no one would have died other than the soldiers who had been in conflict. It’s written repeatedly in A Good War.
3 Likes
Oh you mean Garrosh the corrupt leader who started his own true horde and kicked out people that clearly disagreed with him like Cairne and Vol’jin, who both threaten him?