Night elf posters were right

Front and center, ! We’re beginning our assault on Wintergrasp Fortress. Those Horde animals think they can hide cowardly behind their walls? Well, I think not! We’ll show them the power of Gnomish technology and smash their walls to bits!

Seems to me the MU draenei can be quite hateful of the Horde as well.

Mmhmm, that’s great.

It’s like I said:

And as I mentioned:

If the game didn’t force factions the draenei would 100% have been neutral following Legion. They barely participated in the BfA war. The Lightforged participated more than the Exodar draenei.

If Blizzard ever actually wrote internal Alliance divisions the draenei would have been pissed about how Legion unfolded. Velen calls for aid from both factions and the Horde sent more people.

That isn’t even true. You can see regular draenei stationed in various encampments you create during the campaign. We have a drenaei boss for the Dazar’alor raid. https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Jadefire_Masters_(Horde)
You can see the bodies of dead draenei all over the Nazjatar confirming they were part of the group sent to end Nathanos’ fleet.

You are making up your own lore here. There is NOTHING stating the Alliance sent less forces then the Horde for the final assault against the Legion.

So 1 monk and some draenei Anduin pointlessly and stupidly got killed in the dumbest military maneuver ever? How very compelling.

Oh sorry, they sent the same amount: 2 whole elves. Well, actually the Alliance sent 1.5 elves, but close enough.

Either way, it’s a bad sign when your “enemies” send the same number of people to help you as your “allies.” Especially when this fight was the reason the draenei joined the Alliance in the first place.

You are conflating ingame visual with actual lore. The reason there are only two whole elves is because the patch was already going to be Alliance heavy, what with Turaylon and Alleria being added(we players from both Horde and Alliance were the bulk of the reinforcements). Heck, if anything the whole Alliance bias complaint would have been even more intolerable if even more Alliance npcs were in the Vindicaar…

It ended with the death of Rastakhan and the fall of his fleet. If anything it forces Sylvanas to be even more desperate and ultimately lead to a chain of events the ended with her losing her seat as warchief.

Even the Chronicles which constantly assigns raid clears to specific factions has Antoras as cleared by both factions. Every indication is that the Horde helped the draenei just as much as the Alliance.

It was completely and utterly unnecessary and would likely be considered a war crime.

And that was not my argument. My argument is you saying the Horde sent more aid. So from the looks of it, even Chronicles agrees with me and says they both sent aid and the Alliance didn’t scrimp on it. Heck the way you worder it even agree with that assessment. :grinning:

Trying to capture or kill the head of an enemy state is not a war crime.

The Chronicles would consider the draenei as Alliance forces in that regard. So if Alliance and Horde participated equally and draenei were the overwhelming majority of the Alliance forces there, that means the Horde sent more forces to help the draenei.

Sending a bunch of people on an intentional suicide mission probably would qualify as a war crime. A war crime against their own people at that.

For all intents and purposes, it likely qualifies as one. But than again, it’s the alliance. Attaching war crimes to them and keeping said crimes around is a major No go rule for Blizz

You know, I had to reread Chronicles and it doesn’t mention even that there was equal contribution on either side. In fact, its the passage is simply conflating then as a unified group. So saying the Horde helped the draenei just as much as the Alliance is just, you making up stuff.

Like all of this is merely a nebulous statement as far lore is concerned. But what we do know is Velen never consider himself as abandon/harbored any bad feelings to the Alliance, so you trying to make this into some schism thing instead of just that everyone was busy dealing with the Legion and Velen understood the strain everyone was under is just a bad way to portray the lore.

If it was a unified group……than yes, the horde would have helped just as much as the alliance did. Since you know…both groups were unified in their efforts

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And the draenei were Alliance, I would think it would be 50/50 Alliance and Horde forces and the draenei being part of the Alliance represent maybe 1/3 of the forces of the Alliance while 2/3 of it the 50% represented the other Alliance races.

The fact is that as a Unified Effort both sides contributed to the war effort equally. By sending soldiers, etc to help with the invasion of Argus

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Which means the Alliance sent as much aid as they could and match proportionally what they could.

So did the horde, which funny enough, you keep purposely ignoring

Of course not. The Alliance is never allowed to have any division at all. Even when it would be 100% justified.

Instead Blizzard just ignores draenei during Alliance content aside from a few random no-name NPCs thrown in here or there.

Draenei joined the Alliance for 1 reason: Help against the Legion. And when the time came to fight the Legion what was the Alliance doing? Genn was off doing sneak attacks on the Horde, Tyrande was insulting Horde champions and pushing the nightborne towards the blood elves, and Anduin was crying. Draenei were forced to act as a neutral force calling upon both factions for aid.

I’m sorry, but if that’s not reason for draenei to be a little pissed off at the Alliance I don’t know what is.

Again, that was never my argument was against this:

That the Alliance somehow sent less aid when it propotionally sent as much aid as it could.

This was not justified.

No, the draenei joined the Alliance because the Alliance lent them aid and in fact promised to help them get back to Outland. Yes the Alliance also promised to help them against, which they did.

Or Velen being the actually wise person he is realized the division of the world better then you and realized the Alliance, having suffered at the hand of the Horde, like his people, might actually pissed about working with former enemies.

Overall, the blood elves have been the best friends the draenei have and that’s funny since they started out fighting. Blood elves have 0 obligation to help the draenei, yet consistently do. Velen asks for help for invading Argus and the blood elves immediately step up and bring their new nightborne friends with them. And I hope the draenei go help the blood elves in Midnight.